Author Topic: So i bought a little gizmo today...  (Read 19816 times)

Reply #60November 15, 2010, 03:21:38 am

regcheeseman

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #60 on: November 15, 2010, 03:21:38 am »
Quote
i think it is very possible that it could help atomize the oil into a much more burnable vapour.


No. It isn't.

Quote
you do not need blow by to get oil vapour from the crankcase, lobes of the cam stir mist the oil quite a bit.

oh so this device atomises mist now? Isn't mist already atomised then?


Please don't accuse people of making up **** and then come out with gems like these.

If it was possible to make oil into a more burnable vapour by passing it through a screen with no external energy involved then why would we bother with diesel pumps.
I may just get a carbed petrol engine, stick one of these device in the inlet manifold and run it on diesel - do you believe this will work also?
« Last Edit: November 15, 2010, 05:18:44 am by regcheeseman »

Reply #61November 15, 2010, 04:33:39 am

13ad13oy

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #61 on: November 15, 2010, 04:33:39 am »
Lol what an entertaining read!

HOGWARTS??????
You mean that place ACTUALLY exists?

Well some of the gothic passaging in HP, was filmed in Gloucester Cathedral. GC is only a mile from me. It does have exceedingly big vaults... By some quirk, I was actually baptised there, so technically I suppose, it is my local church... :o

Quite a bit was also filmed at Fettis College in Edinburgh - Over the road from me!

89 Caddy Truck

Reply #62November 15, 2010, 08:17:47 am

TDsamurai

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #62 on: November 15, 2010, 08:17:47 am »
I never once said i wasnt making things up, im trying to explain possibilities of how it works, i was asked how i thought it worked and im explaining it to the best of my abilities. If you have any facts of whether or not a further atomized fuel would not burn cleaner please share. If im not mistaken there are multiple levels of atomization. maybe im using the wrong word.

Reply #63November 15, 2010, 08:55:07 am

Mark(The Miser)UK

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #63 on: November 15, 2010, 08:55:07 am »
I never once said i wasnt making things up, im trying to explain possibilities of how it works, i was asked how i thought it worked and im explaining it to the best of my abilities. If you have any facts of whether or not a further atomized fuel would not burn cleaner please share. If im not mistaken there are multiple levels of atomization. maybe im using the wrong word.
Harry Ricardo, who designed this particular style of IDI clearly stated that the design of the swirl chamber shears droplets and completes the combustion.
 IIRC it swirls at 8 times the rpm of the engine. The only downside to the IDI is the extra heat losses to the head, as it is cupped around the fuel. The DI does not shear the fuel so well, so requires finer atomisation, and squirting in many directions, but then gains due to less heat losses to the head.


13-13 that is one beautiful building, but then Edinburgh, is full of them. Down here we take pride in pulling down our best buildings, for dead shopping centres, or patches of gravel :(
Mark-The-Miser-UK

"There's nothing like driving past a bonfire and then realising; its my car on fire!"

I'm not here to help... I'm here to Pro-Volke"

Be like meeee: drive a Quantum TD
 ...The best work-horse after the cart...

Reply #64November 16, 2010, 03:50:23 pm

regcheeseman

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #64 on: November 16, 2010, 03:50:23 pm »
Quote from: mark
13-13

You don't know how amused that has made me. What about you 13?

Reply #65December 07, 2010, 12:26:44 am

TDsamurai

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #65 on: December 07, 2010, 12:26:44 am »
This is off a CD i got today. It has alot of information and if you are still closed minded enough to not even think this thing has a chance at working after reading this i dont know what to tell you.


Engine Catalyst Data
Intro to Tech
Crankcase emissions, commonly referred to as blow-by gases, are extremely toxic. In fact, they are several times more toxic than the exhaust emissions. They are carcinogenic. Few people realize that most large diesel engines simply vent these toxins directly into the atmosphere. Most often, they are vented directly below the operator of the vehicle or equipment. It is difficult to simply recycle these toxins back into the engine on large diesels because they cause a number of maintenance and performance concerns, such as oil contamination, carbon fouling, power loss and excess vibration. These toxic vapors burn as an oil, not as a fuel. They also tend to stick inside the engine necessitating frequent maintenance. Imagine what they do inside our lungs.
Fortunately, oil refining chemists, in their pursuit of better fuels, have discovered a method for literally cracking these oily vapors into a fuel, a high octane, clean burning fuel. The secret relies on the ability of certain metals to react with and decompose oil vapors. Not entirely dissimilar to the function of a car’s catalytic converter. Except, this process involves low temperatures. Once these oil vapors pass into the conditioning chamber of reactive metals, they become modified and no longer coagulate. They also become a burnable, high octane fuel additive.
Recycling these freshly modified high octane vapors, at this point, now becomes something very beneficial. The engine no longer becomes contaminated with sticky, oily emissions allowing the oil to stay cleaner and engine internals to be free of carbon sludge. The performance benefits as a result of the higher octane vapors, is also impressive. The engine will run smoother, quieter and accelerate faster. The increase in torque often provides an improvement in fuel efficiency.
The total volume of crankcase emissions emitted from an engine varies depending on several factors such as engine condition, load conditions, temperatures and even oil condition. On average however, most engines produce from 2 – 10 % of their total exhaust emissions as crankcase blow-by. When this oil vapor is converted into a high octane fuel it is not surprising to see the fuel efficiency improve accordingly.
Exhaust emissions are often reduced significantly as a result of the high octane vapors improving the combustion process. An unadvertised secret in the fuel refining industry is that it takes only a very small percentage of high octane additives to significantly improve the combustion process. Since crankcase emissions cause only harm to the engine and environment, it is only logical to convert them into a high octane fuel additive.
This crankcase vapor conditioning system is not a filter, requires no maintenance and will not wear out, ever. It does not use or emit toxic chemicals and it does not produce heat. The technology is adaptable to all engines from small lawn mowers to locomotives. There are no limits. We have ten years of field experience and have proven this technology on thousands of engines worldwide. Commercial engines have been extensively tested under severe conditions such as in the extreme cold of the prairie winters
to the sweltering jungles of Central America. The steep mountain terrain of British Columbia has also been utilized to test logging trucks, tow trucks, garbage trucks, semis, school buses and delivery trucks under full load, long term operating conditions. The technology is safe, reliable and extremely effective.
Advantages
Installing a catalytic modifying system in the crankcase emissions line to convert blow-by emissions into a high octane fuel additive provides :
-Smoke reduction – 50%
-Exhaust odor reduction - 75%
-Power and acceleration improvement
-Fuel economy 2 – 10%
-Starting improvement, even in the extreme cold
-Sound reduction
-Vibration reduction
-Temperature stabilization – maintains thermostat temp even on long hill climbs
-Oil cleanliness - 50% - 2x longer
-Oil pressure consistency
-Engine internal cleanliness
-Reduced oil consumption, often 25 – 50 %
-EGR cleanliness
-Catalytic converter extended function with less contamination
-Used oil washes off clothing and hands easily
Detailed explanation of functional benefits
Smoke reduction and exhaust odor reduction:
This is a result of the reactive vapours breaking the fuel molecules more completely during combustion reducing the amount of unburned fuel cluster s from escaping out the exhaust.
Power, acceleration and fuel economy improvements:
This is a result of the high octane additive increasing the chemical reactivity of the fuel ultimately improving the rate of combustion to produce a more uniform energy release and subsequent pressure increase.
Starting improvements:
Is a result of the reactivity produced by the modified vapours allowing them to quickly decompose the fuel molecules chemically, rather than the normal process involving heat.
Sound and vibration reduction:
This is a result of the high octane additives controlling the rate of combustion, by decomposing unstable fuel molecules before they self detonate. The smoother, more controlled rate of chemical reactions reduces detonation and energy fluctuations.
Temperature stabilization:
By providing a more uniform combustion rate, more energy is converted into pressure and less is wasted into the engine components and cooling system.
Engine internal cleanliness:
Combustion contaminants that enter the crankcase cavity produce acids, which damage engine components, and carbon based sludge that increases maintenance issues. The water, being strongly bi-polar, is attracted to the crankcase processing system. As well, the carbon contaminants, often carrying a charge, can similarly be attracted to the chemical reactions occurring inside the conditioning system. The elimination of these contaminants has been observed in countless test engines indicating significant potential for providing and maintaining engine cleanliness.
EGR cleanliness and catalytic converter long term maintenance support:
These components are prone to frequent carbon contamination and often require maintenance or replacement as a result. By converting crankcase vapours into high octane, combustion enhancing particles, the increase in decomposition efficiency produces less unburned carbon escaping out into the exhaust. EGR systems and catalytic converters remain cleaner and function longer.
Oil cleanliness and viscosity stabilization:
Oil becomes contaminated mostly by water and carbon escaping from the combustion chamber, past the rings. The piston rings fluctuate considerably more when the fuel detonates. Improved combustion reduces energy fluctuations allowing the rings to seal better ultimately keeping combustion contaminants above the piston. Also, improved combustion reactions produce less free carbon to contaminate the oil. Water, a by-product of hydrogen combustion, when it does escape past the rings, thins the oil ultimately reducing its viscosity and the subsequent oil pressure in the engine. Water, however, is a bipolar molecule and is easily drawn out of the crankcase because of its attraction to the
electro chemical reactions occurring inside the crankcase emissions processing system. It simply enters the device and gets passed into the combustion chamber.
Technical explanation of combustion
Fire is a chemical reaction involving atoms, not molecules. A fuel is comprised of molecules of hydrogen atoms and carbon atoms. In order to burn, the molecule must first decompose into individual atoms. Hydrogen then combines with oxygen to form water. It requires over 35 pounds of air to burn one pound of hydrogen. Carbon bonds with oxygen to form carbon dioxide. Most fuels are comprised of approximately 87% carbon and 12% hydrogen because of their saturated molecular structures. If the fuel molecules don’t completely decompose into atoms smoke is often produced, ultimately wasting energy. If all of the fuel was able to completely decompose and burn, exhaust emissions would be non- toxic. Normally, fuel molecules must collide with one another in order to break apart, into individual atoms, before they can burn. This is why warm engines are easier to start and smoke less as a result of the heat energy providing sufficient kinetic energy for molecule breaking collisions.
However, molecules can also be broken apart by using chemical solvents, radicals, rather than heat energy. Octane boosters often work in this manner. The concept is to break apart the fuel molecules into atoms quickly and completely in order to promote smooth, controlled and complete combustion reactions.
It should be noted that all fuels commonly available such as natural gas, propane, gasoline and diesel fuels are all made up of carbon and hydrogen atoms proportionately combined into various sized molecules. The larger the molecular cluster, the more viscous the fuel becomes. Diesel fuel, for example, simply has larger molecular clusters of hydrogen and carbon. It is more difficult to ignite because it requires more energy to shatter the larger, heavier molecule of carbon and hydrogen. Regardless of fuel type, the end result of complete combustion is always water and carbon dioxide. The quantity of energy released is also always the same, per atom. Heavy fuels simply have more per volume, it doesn’t burn any hotter. The type of energy released, however, varies considerably.
Burning a fuel produces heat energy but the manner in which it burns ultimately determines its usefulness as an engine fuel. Briefly consider that the sun’s radiant energy will directly heat solid objects or water but not the air. The radiation energy is not in a wavelength that accelerates oxygen or nitrogen molecules. Similarly, the gases in the combustion chamber absorb only certain wave lengths of the combustion’s energy. The wave lengths that are absorbed ultimately accelerate the nitrogen molecule’s vibration causing expansion. The expansion produces pressure and the engine revolves. Only a percentage of the heat energy is absorbed by the gases, leaving a lot of energy to be lost and absorbed into the engine block and cooling system.
Fuels such as alcohol or high octane aviation fuels produce better performance in an engine, not because they burn hotter, rather, they burn smoother and produce more uniform molecular vibrations. More energy is absorbed and converted into kinetic motion or, pressure. Uniform energy levels provide
a more complete expansion resulting in a greater possibility of converting this energy into pressure. Fuels that detonate easily produce hotter engine components, such as cylinder heads, and provide less power. Aviation manuals review this at great length because of its significance in regards to performance, safety and engine longevity.
Fuels can all be made to burn with similar, ideal, characteristics by controlling their decomposition rate. This, in turn, allows control of the combustion intensity and the potential for producing uniform vibration levels, expansion and conversion into pressure.
Catalyst Technical Description –
The toxic characteristics of crankcase emissions are significant and accounts for the reason to recycle these vapors into the engine’s induction and combustion system. However, since these gases contain oil compounds and unburned carbon they tend to coagulate and stick to engine components. This characteristic also makes successfully filtering them very difficult because excessive restriction to the crankcase ventilation system caused by a contaminated filter produces pressure inside the engine leading to oil leaks, poor oil control and excessive exhaust emissions. Accordingly, most manufacturers simply recycle these emissions into the engine’s induction system raw, unfiltered, undiluted and unmodified. As a result, the engine’s oil becomes contaminated sooner, performance and engine longevity is compromised and exhaust emissions are slightly worse.
In order to deal with the very sensitive characteristics associated with toxic crankcase emissions we developed a specific catalyst system that would not, in any way, be associated with a filter system. There are many types of catalysts used in the oil processing industry that can effectively modify oils and their hydrocarbon vapors. Unlike any known catalyst system we developed ours to safely and effectively process crankcase emissions at any temperature without producing heat or causing any resistance to the flow of the crankcase system. Also, there is no required maintenance or limited service life. The materials comprising the catalytic system are non toxic, non corrosive and completely compatible with the engine, its fluids and operating environment. The materials are not consumed in the electro chemical reactions and they are not contaminated by the crankcase emissions. The system is self generating requiring no heat or electrical support. As well, it will work in any temperature extremes from very cold to very hot.
The modifications elicited to the hydrocarbons involve the deformation of the molecule’s electronic structure resulting in processes commonly known in the oil refining industry as fractioning, isomerization, cyclization and dehydrogenation. Although it has been discovered that many different combinations and arrangements of metals produce some desirable hydrocarbon modifications only select materials in specific arrangements are chosen to process and recycle crankcase emissions. The benefits of catalyzing crankcase emissions with our system include not only the advantages of safely processing these toxic emissions without maintenance or restriction, but the positive effect these modified gases have on the combustion process. When these modified emissions enter the combustion chamber they assist the fuel’s decomposition process. This allows the fuel to not only burn more completely, ultimately reducing hydrocarbon and soot emissions, but allows for a more controlled, smoother combustion process ,which in turn reduces NOX emissions. Smoother, less
intense combustion reactions produce lower levels of NOX forming radiation. As well, when the fuel decomposes and burns more completely starting characteristics are improved and less carbon is produced allowing emissions control equipment to function efficiently without excess contamination. It has also been discovered through extensive long term testing that water contaminants in the crankcase are attracted to the catalytic system and are effectively eliminated in the combustion chamber. The reduction of water in the crankcase system allows the oil viscosity to remain as intended with fresh clean oil. As well, acid formation is reduced.
This catalytic system is easily adaptable to engines by simply splicing it into the crankcase ventilation system. Since there is virtually no restriction to the gases passing through the unit it is simply a matter of choosing an appropriate sized device with the proper fitting size to match the engine’s original hose diameter.
The engineers of every engine type have configured a hose diameter suitable for sufficient crankcase pressure evacuation. We simply match the size of the original hose assembly.
The most significant characteristic of this system, compared to any known crankcase enclosure systems, is that it effectively modifies crankcase emissions without restricting flow, even after long term use. As well, the self generating electrochemical reactions safely produce reactive intermediates with unique combustion enhancing characteristics ultimately enabling engines to produce cleaner emissions longer.

Reply #66December 07, 2010, 03:45:10 am

Mark(The Miser)UK

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #66 on: December 07, 2010, 03:45:10 am »
This is off a CD i got today. It has alot of information and if you are still closed minded enough to not even think this thing has a chance at working after reading this i dont know what to tell you.

Engine Catalyst Data
Intro to Tech
Crankcase emissions, commonly referred to as blow-by gases, are extremely toxic. In fact, they are several times more toxic than the exhaust emissions. They are carcinogenic.
Agreed

Few people realize that most large diesel engines simply vent these toxins directly into the atmosphere. Most often, they are vented directly below the operator of the vehicle or equipment.
Sounds like a stupid thing to do.

It is difficult to simply recycle these toxins back into the engine on large diesels because they cause a number of maintenance and performance concerns, such as oil contamination, carbon fouling, power loss and excess vibration.
 These toxic vapors burn as an oil, not as a fuel.

Sorry I thought these engines are oil burning.
They also tend to stick inside the engine necessitating frequent maintenance. Imagine what they do inside our lungs.

Fortunately, oil refining chemists, in their pursuit of better fuels, have discovered a method for literally cracking these oily vapors into a fuel, a high octane, clean burning fuel.
That was the big leap…

The secret relies on the ability of certain metals to react with and decompose oil vapors. Not entirely dissimilar to the function of a car’s catalytic converter. Except, this process involves low temperatures.
Nope this is it; is this a catalyst, or is this item dissolving as I speak, and behaving the same as on old school aluminium chair leg dipped in electrolyte and used to create hydrogen for cars.

Once these oil vapors pass into the conditioning chamber of reactive metals, they become modified and no longer coagulate. They also become a burnable, high octane fuel additive.

Recycling these freshly modified high octane vapors, at this point, now becomes something very beneficial. The engine no longer becomes contaminated with sticky, oily emissions allowing the oil to stay cleaner and engine internals to be free of carbon sludge. The performance benefits as a result of the higher octane vapors, is also impressive.
How do you know it’s because of these vapours?

The engine will run smoother, quieter and accelerate faster. The increase in torque often provides an improvement in fuel efficiency
I’ve just this week improved my mileage by 20% by turning my timing back from 1.05mm to 0.7mm. It also resulted in smoother, more efficient etc etc, as it naturally would do: A local 2 mile grade, that was requiring changes from 5th down to 4th and 3rd for the last 200 yards, can now be cleared in 5th…

The total volume of crankcase emissions emitted from an engine varies depending on several factors such as engine condition, load conditions, temperatures and even oil condition. On average however, most engines produce from 2 – 10 % of their total exhaust emissions as crankcase blow-by. When this oil vapor is converted into a high octane fuel it is not surprising to see the fuel efficiency improve accordingly.
So you are saying that 2 to 10% of  emissions are from the crank case? This sounds reasonable.
However it is a big leap to say that it is 2 to 10% of fuel, as opposed to 2 to 10% of the heat and CO2 going out of the exhaust.  Remember it is not 30% of the fuel going out of an exhaust, but 30% of the results of burning the fuel, which may contain miniscule amounts of unburnt hydrocarbon, and CO. If it were working then it would be referring to 2 to 10% of the fraction of a %.


Exhaust emissions are often reduced significantly as a result of the high octane vapors improving the combustion process. An unadvertised secret in the fuel refining industry is that it takes only a very small percentage of high octane additives to significantly improve the combustion process.
See "chair leg" above for similar results then.

Since crankcase emissions cause only harm to the engine and environment, it is only logical to convert them into a high octane fuel additive.

This crankcase vapor conditioning system is not a filter, requires no maintenance and will not wear out, ever.

So it is a catalyst ;) can 'they', the CD writers make up their mind? ::)
As our slimy Politicians would say; “I refer my honorable friend to the  answer I gave a few moments before”



This whole thing reminds me of a limerick:

“A mathematician named Hall,
Had a hexa-hydronical ball!
The cube of it’s weight  x  his pecker  + 8
Was 4/5ths of 5/8ths of  F***all."


I can’t be bothered with the rest of the essay, but I repeat, the engine has to be in need for a general if not major service for this item to work, else no blowby  means nothing to convert…


« Last Edit: December 07, 2010, 03:47:37 am by Mark(The Miser)UK »
Mark-The-Miser-UK

"There's nothing like driving past a bonfire and then realising; its my car on fire!"

I'm not here to help... I'm here to Pro-Volke"

Be like meeee: drive a Quantum TD
 ...The best work-horse after the cart...

Reply #67December 07, 2010, 07:46:00 am

regcheeseman

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #67 on: December 07, 2010, 07:46:00 am »
It's whole operation depends upon

Quote
Fortunately, oil refining chemists, in their pursuit of better fuels, have discovered a method for literally cracking these oily vapors into a fuel, a high octane, clean burning fuel.


My father has a saying which is quite apt...

"What absolute cods."



Reply #68December 07, 2010, 07:52:09 am

TDsamurai

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #68 on: December 07, 2010, 07:52:09 am »
If you think an engine has to be damaged to have blowby i think you should go read a book or something.

Reply #69December 07, 2010, 08:22:17 am

Mark(The Miser)UK

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #69 on: December 07, 2010, 08:22:17 am »
If you think an engine has to be damaged to have blowby i think you should go read a book or something.

I'm sure you don't mean me, but if you do, then I never mentioned damaged, I mentioned in need of a service. My one engine had 160 thou ring gaps, but is still hopefully going to reach over 60mpg with the$22 re-ring and a completion of the current tuning...

WRT reading a book , alas you have found out my obsession, I love books.
There are books in every room of the house, except the crappowse, and that is only because queues used to form due to ponderers.
I could not justify a 3rd T. Crapper, in a household of 4 ;D.

I do own a large attic that I am turning into a mini library though...
Mark-The-Miser-UK

"There's nothing like driving past a bonfire and then realising; its my car on fire!"

I'm not here to help... I'm here to Pro-Volke"

Be like meeee: drive a Quantum TD
 ...The best work-horse after the cart...

Reply #70December 07, 2010, 10:34:02 am

R.O.R-2.0

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #70 on: December 07, 2010, 10:34:02 am »
it says that the "blow by gasses are burned as an oil, not a fuel."

last i checked, i could take the oil from the crank case of my engine, and dump it in my fuel tank.. thats straight oil, but whats it burning as? oil or fuel? whats the difference?

DIESELS BURN OIL! that is their sole function.. burn oil.

im not sold on this little gizmo at all.. i need factual answers. actual improvements..
92 Jetta GLI - Black, 1.6D w/ GT2056V turbo..
86 GTI - 4 Door, Med Twilight Gray, Tow Machine..
86 Audi Coupe GT - Tornado Red, All Stock.. WRECKED.
89 Toyota 4Runner - Dark Grey Metallic, LIFTED!

Turbo: exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster.

Reply #71December 07, 2010, 12:13:27 pm

Wayland

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #71 on: December 07, 2010, 12:13:27 pm »
I think you should keep running this device for 6 months or so, keep track of your engine and egt temps, fuel mileage, etc and post up the results. We can argue about this device all day, but road testing's the only way we'll know for sure.
84 Grumman Olsen Kubvan
93 Dodge CTD Truck

Reply #72December 07, 2010, 01:39:56 pm

snakemaster

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #72 on: December 07, 2010, 01:39:56 pm »
this thing gizmo dont work , snake oil comes to mind  ;D :)
Glenmorangie  single highland malt

Reply #73December 07, 2010, 01:53:54 pm

Vincent Waldon

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Re: So i bought a little gizmo today...
« Reply #73 on: December 07, 2010, 01:53:54 pm »
...and with that we've come full circle in this thread, several times.

OP... please consider posting back in 6 months time and let us know what your long-term experience has been.
Vince

Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
2001 silver TDI Jetta Malone Stage 1.5 , 2001 blue TDI Jetta SBIII 216s Malone Stage 3, 1970 Bay Window bus

Gone but not forgotten: 1969/1971 Beetles, 1969/1974 Westies, 1979 Rabbit, 1986 TD Jetta, 1992 gas Jetta, 1994 TD Jetta