Author Topic: My very first no run thread! Hooray!! (Edit: My first engine build! Hooray!!!) (Read 22259 times)

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #15 on:** March 09, 2009, 08:55:23 am »

Andrew:
Any differences on the Mech head vs Hydro?
(I mean as far as compression numbers... There certainly are differences!)

And presumably the injectors are only this difficult to remove the first time,
they should only be torqued to 45lb/ft or something like that!

Compression tonight!!!

Thanks!
-Brad

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #16 on:** March 09, 2009, 08:26:49 pm »

Well,
things aint exactly looking up at the moment...

First (totally cold) compression was:
100, 50, 0, 150...

I did smile, when, on the first cylinder, as soon as I turned the key, I saw a triple flaming salute from under the hood...
(the other 3 paper towels which were keeping stuff out, and had soaked overnight in PB B'laster, got set aflame by the <brand> glow plugs and spat out when I turned the key.. me heart sinks everytime flaming balls shoot out from under the hood.)

Ill try a few more times...

-b.

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #17 on:** March 09, 2009, 09:18:22 pm »

WOW.....

Cylinder: ONE TWO THREE FOUR

Round 1: 150 50 0 100
(10 minute break)
Round2: 195 120 80 80

Round3: 210 130 150 60

I am pretty sure the best thing to do at this point is go ahead and take the fuel injection and intake manifolds from a gas engine, and convert it to a 1.6T gas engine... yeah, it'll be running on 3 cylinders, but whatever, number one will be hitting well!
Any other suggestions?

-Brad

jtanguay · « **Reply #18 on:** March 09, 2009, 09:42:23 pm »

did you use any oil in the cylinder with any of those tests??? those numbers are low even for a gasser!!!

and why the heck is 4th getting lower, but 3rd is being resurrected? :lol:

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #19 on:** March 09, 2009, 10:24:28 pm »

I put nothing in the cylinders at all...
Bentley says you ought not do a "wet" test on a diesel, as it may ignite..
I wish that were a concern!

this was totally dry, and the car has not run in a week.
However, after the first 2-3 seconds of turning it over, my oil pressure light does go out...

Any suggestions on the next direction?
Just yank it all apart and look for the broke ***?
Thanks!
-Brad

jtanguay · « **Reply #20 on:** March 10, 2009, 12:57:54 am »

Quote from: "Jettagli16v"

I put nothing in the cylinders at all...
Bentley says you ought not do a "wet" test on a diesel, as it may ignite..
I wish that were a concern!

this was totally dry, and the car has not run in a week.
However, after the first 2-3 seconds of turning it over, my oil pressure light does go out...

Any suggestions on the next direction?
Just yank it all apart and look for the broke ***?
Thanks!
-Brad

with numbers like that i suspect burnt valves. or broken piston rings. i don't think you have to worry about lighting the engine up by putting oil in the engine. those numbers wouldn't even light up diesel properly atomized in the cylinders... as for the amount of oil i think less than a teaspoon. if compression numbers go up, then its the rings. if not, then its the valves (which are my best guess)

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #21 on:** March 10, 2009, 08:53:02 am »

I cant thank you guys enough for your sage advice.

The thing that still throws me is that the car ran GREAT one day and then just did not start the next.

Ill try the test again tonight with a tsp of oil in each before the test.

Is a timing failure still on the table as an option?

Thanks,
-Brad

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #22 on:** March 10, 2009, 10:47:29 am »

Andrew:
Thank you so much for the help...

I had not yet checked the timing belt,
as the belt and tensioner are only 10k old.
But at this point, I certainly will.

Ill look for intake restriction,
but I think it unlikely (aside from bad turbo) because I have a 3" pipe with a K&N on it....
(Ill spin the turbo too, but that ought not contribute to low compression)

The thing that throws me is that it ran great the day before,
and the problem is one that is common to all 4 cylinders..
(In my head I am ruling out rings, unless they all broke simultaneously, and burned valves?)

THANKS!
-Brad

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #23 on:** March 10, 2009, 11:12:02 am »

And after confirming the timing belt and pulleys are still OK,
no intake restriction, and a free turbo,
am I good to tear this thing apart,
or should I try to find the tools to do further testing (leakdown) to confirm the problem?
I am assuming my problem will be visible to the naked eye.

-Brad

jtanguay · « **Reply #24 on:** March 10, 2009, 12:12:34 pm »

Quote from: "Jettagli16v"

And after confirming the timing belt and pulleys are still OK,
no intake restriction, and a free turbo,
am I good to tear this thing apart,
or should I try to find the tools to do further testing (leakdown) to confirm the problem?
I am assuming my problem will be visible to the naked eye.

-Brad

even if the timing belt looks okay it might have jumped time. you'd need to pull the valve cover, and set the engine to TDC by looking at the flywheel.

i'm gonna go out on a limb here... but you have an '85 engine, with mechanical lifters right? so possibly you need to get your valves shimmed as well? they usually don't just go suddenly though... more like a slow death.

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #25 on:** March 10, 2009, 01:09:59 pm »

[quote="jtanguay
even if the timing belt looks okay it might have jumped time. you'd need to pull the valve cover, and set the engine to TDC by looking at the flywheel.

i'm gonna go out on a limb here... but you have an '85 engine, with mechanical lifters right? so possibly you need to get your valves shimmed as well? they usually don't just go suddenly though... more like a slow death.[/quote]

Tonight, I will roll the motor to TDC,
at the cam,
and confirm that my pump and flywheel are still in line.
(assuming they are....) my timing is good, and
Im pulling the head. (I regret the GP job now)

Jtanguay, I think the valves may totally need adjusted (shimmed) but I also agree with the theory that I am looking for something major and catastrophic. The car went from running great one day to not starting at all the next.
I am also still hopeful that the 19PSI was running may have killed the headgasket... or is this just wishful thinking?

Also, are there any special instructions towards protecting my IP from damage due to the elements? It will be sitting for at least a week or so, and I want to minimize collateral damage.

Thanks!
-Brad

jtanguay · « **Reply #26 on:** March 10, 2009, 04:57:08 pm »

Quote from: "Jettagli16v"

I am also still hopeful that the 19PSI was running may have killed the headgasket... or is this just wishful thinking?

Also, are there any special instructions towards protecting my IP from damage due to the elements? It will be sitting for at least a week or so, and I want to minimize collateral damage.

make sure the openings are blocked off. plastic should do and it should be clean. making sure there is no air inside the pump by filling it with some ATF will also help. air is the real killer of pumps. unless it was really dry.

theres a slight possibility that your head gasket is gone. but they don't blow when the engine is off. so if it ran fine when you parked it, it should run fine after. did you install head studs, or just the head bolts? did you torque them or did you get a shop to do it? were they re-torqued after 1000km?

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #27 on:** March 10, 2009, 07:26:09 pm »

Damn... This moved form a glow plug thread to a no run thread, and its looking like that may become my motor build thread!

I currently have small pieces of aluminum foil covering each of the 4 outlets, and a big Tapcon screw in the return line from injectors.
I can find something better to seal the 4 outlets, like a vacuum cap of appropriate size.
If the pump is sitting for a week or 2, (already 3-4 days) should I fill it with ATF?
which hole do you fill in?

Also, JT,
Headgasket and bolts are of unknown age and condition.
That is one of the reasons I think it is suspect... it may even be original (the ODO on this car reads 80.000 mi, but it was n/w when I bought it, and the guy I bought it from said the car had 180k on it..... so I know nothing!)
Again, I know extra boost can trouble headgaskets and bolts, and I set it at (what I thought was) a conservative 19PSI, but people certainly give you funny looks when you tell them you just added a MBC and turned it to 19... Silly gassers!

Off to find TDC and verify timing!
-Brad

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #28 on:** March 10, 2009, 09:10:20 pm »

well, i guess good news is relative at this point,
but my timing is all fine.
Camshaft lock drops in,
and then my 7/16" socket drops right in its hole, in the pulley
and the flywheel was 5mm off until I bumped it, and then it is perfect.

Therefore, We go inside the cylinder... (thats right, you guys are coming with me!!)

I just dropped 53 Willys a line about the whiz-bang MLS gasket for my motor.
Also seemingly banging my head against a wall to get the ARPs for under $130. Ill pull the trigger on those soon.

The worst sentence I ever say is "while we are there"...
I said that about my 1974 VW thing about 5 years ago (needed floorpans), and I plan to take it off the rotisserie this summer. (but in my defense, I work 50-70 hrs/wk consistently, and then also play with vws)

-Brad

Jettagli16v · « **Reply #29 on:** March 10, 2009, 10:18:33 pm »

And I have really been missing this lately:

(Thats the cockpit of my poor TD Jetta)
Recaro, Schroth and VW is a nice combo!
The only interface I have had with that seat in a week is being careful not to get my greasy hands on it when turning the car over for troubleshooting!!