Anyone with an mTDI that really works?

[regcheeseman]

regcheese, did you get this sorted?

God no! I got really worried and confused about emissions so I'm sticking to petrol.

[zukgod1]

regcheese, did you get this sorted?

God no! I got really worried and confused about emissions so I'm sticking to petrol.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

[burn_your_money]

In regards to emissions, I  think we are just wasting time, money and effort trying to get an internal combustion engine to be environmentally friendly.

For example, a lot of the emission controls on a vehicle reduce it's fuel economy. This results in the need to pump more crude from the ground, transport through pipelines, then to tankers to cross the ocean, then more pipelines some transports etc etc. Each one of these stages increase the amount of pollutants created while making the car more environmentally friendly.

Then there is all the electronic and mechanical add-ons to the motor; EGR, MAFs, MAPs, etc etc not to mention miles of wires and vacuum hoses. A lot of these are wear items and need to be replaced. That's more resources pulled from the earth, refined, transported and then disposed of.

At the end of the day, are the newest "green cars" any better then my 91 NA that only requires filters, nozzles and glowplugs every now and again? I have my doubts, but I've been wrong before.

[jtanguay]

regcheese, did you get this sorted?

God no! I got really worried and confused about emissions so I'm sticking to petrol.

blasphemy!

[lyeinyoureye]

actually technically arp is right... the air going out of the car has to be cleaner than the air going in... when you factor in the air cleaner  :lol:

Saying people are right is fine but where's the proof? It shouldn't be too hard to show.

people also don't realize that diesels make up for the higher fuel price in extra miles per gallon.  that and the fact that diesel engines generally last longer, means it is a great investment.  but there are so many uneducated people out there who don't know this.  they think they're comparing apples to apples with fuel prices, but they aren't. its more like.. apples to bananas.. and i'll take a banana anyday over an apple.  :lol: (no sexual reference intended  :roll:)

People also don't realize that an electric velomobile would be the cheapest of just about anything for personal transportation, but that doesn't mean they're uneducated IMO, just that they haven't been exposed to the information. In terms of diesels, or any new vehicle in the U.S. market during a recessions w/ gas prices at 5-10 year lows, it just isn't something manufacturers are willing to risk. It's not an emissions problem it's a money problem.

[lyeinyoureye]

In regards to emissions, I  think we are just wasting time, money and effort trying to get an internal combustion engine to be environmentally friendly.

For example, a lot of the emission controls on a vehicle reduce it's fuel economy. This results in the need to pump more crude from the ground, transport through pipelines, then to tankers to cross the ocean, then more pipelines some transports etc etc. Each one of these stages increase the amount of pollutants created while making the car more environmentally friendly.

That's why refineries and the like have emissions regulations they have to adhere to, at least in the states.

Then there is all the electronic and mechanical add-ons to the motor; EGR, MAFs, MAPs, etc etc not to mention miles of wires and vacuum hoses. A lot of these are wear items and need to be replaced. That's more resources pulled from the earth, refined, transported and then disposed of.

MAF/MAP are just air flow/pressure sensors, not strictly an emissions component. Anyway, maybe if you're looking at a vehicle from the 80s, when emissions systems were in their infancy and god awful, it's a rats nest of crap, but these days most cars don't even have EGR valves anymore. They just phase the exhaust cam to keep some of the gases trapped, internal EGR IIRC. The engine bay is incredibly clean w/ more room in it than my diesel bunny has.

At the end of the day, are the newest "green cars" any better then my 91 NA that only requires filters, nozzles and glowplugs every now and again? I have my doubts, but I've been wrong before.

In terms of emissions, maintenance, safety. and power output compared to economy. probably. But it's your choice whether or not the MSRP/extra insurance is worth getting something that's better in those aspects.

[Typrus]

Honda made several concept cars that literally, in all but the cleanest downtown major cities, pushed cleaner air out the tailpipe than it pumped through the intake (post-filter  :lol: ) Not sure if they hit production.

I still think that keeping the chamber temps uniform and getting optimum swirl is the best way to go. Now how to keep the temps more or less equal? No clue. Maybe a sleeve of metal that has low heat transfer and keeps more of it in the chamber to be used for air expansion, rather than hot coolant?

I work parts.
I sell starters, alternators, maybe some gaskets to the older engine crowd. Even in the case of a rebuild, most people are only staring a few hundred down.
I sell Cam Position Sensors, Crank Pos Sens, VSS's, MAF's, AFM's, MAP's, ICM's, IAT's, IAC's, etc to the new car crowd.

HEck, there's several people with 5 or less year old cars that are just out of warranty that have spent hundreds (one guy well into the thousands) trying to keep good sensors in their cars.

One bum hydraulic actuator- forget about your variable valve anything, say hello to mediocre performance and high fuel consumption.

One bum knock sensor, kiss fuel economy good bye and maybe even a piston or two, depending how advanced it keeps it.

Bad O2 sensor? Fuel economy, power, and emissions.

Slightly worn sparkers? All kinds of fun potentially.

Yea, a lot of that is gasser type stuff, but regardless.

Heck, we have a guy with a 60's Opel GT who comes in and gets great fuel economy, and all he usually needs are filters or contact points. I once sold him a head gasket set (that took 6 days to get in lol) but in the last year he's maybe spent $400?


Now, when your super-electronic-noodle wire-everywhere car is running right, its awesome. But just let one little electrical demon sneak in and cue hundreds of dollars trying to diagnose it. Maybe you'll get lucky and it'll take a half hour to find. But probably not.

Heh. My 80's Toyota Tercel 4wd's with their little 1.5L I-4 have 22 feet of vacuum hose in a big spidery mess. Solution? Weber 32/36 baby.

[arb]

Honda made several concept cars that literally, in all but the cleanest downtown major cities, pushed cleaner air out the tailpipe than it pumped through the intake (post-filter  :lol: ) Not sure if they hit production.

They have a modern version of the CVCC in the way of a diesel they are going to stell here in the states around 2009.  http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061002/SUB/60929098/1124/TOC&refcat=Automotive%20News%20Table%20of%20Contents



Heh. My 80's Toyota Tercel 4wd's with their little 1.5L I-4 have 22 feet of vacuum hose in a big spidery mess. Solution? Weber 32/36 baby.[/quote]
I have plan "B" for you - Drop an IDI in your Toyota !!

[jackbombay]

One bum knock sensor, kiss fuel economy good bye and maybe even a piston or two, depending how advanced it keeps it.

  When knock sensors fail they typically become hypersensitive, and retard timing more than it should be, no harm to the engine, but reduced power and increased emissions are the result.

[burn_your_money]

Honda made several concept cars that literally, in all but the cleanest downtown major cities, pushed cleaner air out the tailpipe than it pumped through the intake (post-filter  :lol: ) Not sure if they hit production.

That really doesn't impress me at all. Basically rather then pushing the pollutants out the tailpipe, they get trapped in the various filters which then have to be disposed of. It's not solving anything, just putting it in a different form to be dealt with later.

[jackbombay]

Honda made several concept cars that literally, in all but the cleanest downtown major cities, pushed cleaner air out the tailpipe than it pumped through the intake (post-filter  :lol: ) Not sure if they hit production.

That really doesn't impress me at all. Basically rather then pushing the pollutants out the tailpipe, they get trapped in the various filters which then have to be disposed of. It's not solving anything, just putting it in a different form to be dealt with later.

  There are no extra filters that clog and need to be disposed of in those ultra clean cars.

[lyeinyoureye]

HEck, there's several people with 5 or less year old cars that are just out of warranty that have spent hundreds (one guy well into the thousands) trying to keep good sensors in their cars.
[...]
Bad O2 sensor? Fuel economy, power, and emissions

Depends on whether or not that's the only O2 sensor and how fast the ECU throws a code and runs only in open loop. My friend's dad had an old Dodge w/ a bum O2 sensor that would run like crap for a full half hour or so after it started up and finally throw a code and run o.k. But my Toyota car was fine w/ the O2 sensors out, and it even passed smog. Same economy, same emissions, same power. What you're talking about seems more like a model to model thing, not gasser versus diesel. Even w/ a rat's nest of emissions crap I have a Toyota pickup w/ ~240k miles and my cousin ha one w/ ~500k miles. About the same level of drivetrain build quality, and way better interior/etc. It's not what something is, but how it's built IME.

[burn_your_money]

Honda made several concept cars that literally, in all but the cleanest downtown major cities, pushed cleaner air out the tailpipe than it pumped through the intake (post-filter  :lol: ) Not sure if they hit production.

That really doesn't impress me at all. Basically rather then pushing the pollutants out the tailpipe, they get trapped in the various filters which then have to be disposed of. It's not solving anything, just putting it in a different form to be dealt with later.

  There are no extra filters that clog and need to be disposed of in those ultra clean cars.

Do you have some links to the cars you are talking about? I'm not familiar with these ultra clean cars

[jackbombay]

Basically rather then pushing the pollutants out the tailpipe, they get trapped in the various filters which then have to be disposed of.

   Do you have a link to the car(s) you are talking about? ;-)

  I was referring to PZEVs (Partial Zero Emissions Vehicles), which I have heard, when run in LA, have emissions cleaner than the air that went into the engine.

  Also, the EPA doens't allow emissions equipment that needs servicing before 150,000 miles, which is why urea injection for NOx control in Diesels has not happened here yet.

[lyeinyoureye]

I was referring to PZEVs (Partial Zero Emissions Vehicles), which I have heard, when run in LA, have emissions cleaner than the air that went into the engine.

Where in LA? If it's by the port then my diesel bunny probably emits fewer pollutants than are in the air. We're talking ~30 extra deaths/year attributed to pollution in that area.