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#15
by
81 vw pu
on 03 Aug, 2010 10:13
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When the camshaft is in TDC can't the crank rotate freely b/c all the valves are closed?
No, there is no position on the cam that all the valves are closed. You can remove the cam and then spin the crank.
And likewise if you have the crank positioned with all 4 cylinders halfway, you can turn the camshaft all around b/c none of the valves will touch the pistons
This is correct.
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#16
by
Luckypabst
on 03 Aug, 2010 11:43
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There's some scary noises in that video... sorta metal on metal tapping.
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#17
by
Dakotakid
on 03 Aug, 2010 13:37
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It seems as though several of the lifters are loosing oil pressure prior to the bang.
When you inserted the vacuum pump, did you make sure it seated all the way down onto the oil pump rod?
Did you happen to use any really good hi-temp assembly lube when you put this engine together??? I'm thinking there was little or no oil in the top end and a lifter siezed (really quickly) and one or more valves were left handing in dangerous space.
Once, when assembling an engine, I used bolts (that hold the fuel pump in time/mountings) which were just a little too long. The engine immediately started up and ran. Then I revved it. As the revs built (very quickly), the pump pulled the pump gear inward on the shaft, and the backside of the pump gear made contact with the tips of the mounting bolts.....cutting a circular arch into the back on the gear.....and the engine seized.
However, the seize took a few milliseconds longer to seize and there was not quite such an accompaning BANG.
After I kicked everything on the farm and cracked off a couple of teeth in my mouth....it took a long time to determine what the problem was because the engine would turn over just fine with a wrench. Only, the engine would not start because the pump shaft was internally now damaged and fuel delivery was now not possible.
But, Andrew is right about always using GREAT caution with placement of the cam gear.
You may have to simply walk away from this project until you can cool down....I understand...I have to take cardiac meds these days!
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#18
by
jpedro
on 04 Aug, 2010 13:25
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no i didnt pre prime the system, i used assembly lube on everything that required oil on assembly. after just a few seconds of cranking i had 20psi and at an 1000rpm idle i have just over 70 psi of oil preasure. so other then re doing the timming and trying again i might just look for a decently priced motor as im not screwing with this one again. any of you guys know of a motor somewhere in british columbia i could pick up. and whats a decent price on a motor?
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#19
by
Smokey Eddy
on 04 Aug, 2010 13:44
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I think you're giving up too soon to be honest.
These engines are extremely simple.
if there is atomized fuel getting into the cylinder and it is rotating and building compression it WILL burn the diesel. just sit and think for a bit on it.
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#20
by
jpedro
on 04 Aug, 2010 15:20
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Its getting everything it required to run and was running for a breif minute then bang. Ive checked everthing out i could possibly check with out pulling apart the motor. So
Im gunna retime it then try her out again and if thats a now go ill be looking for a new motor for. So if any of you know of any in canada leme know please thanks
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#21
by
rabbitman
on 04 Aug, 2010 16:42
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When you retime it torque the cam gear bolt to 45ft-lbs, tap bolt with hammer and torque again until it doesn't tighten any more.
While you're in there it wouldn't hurt to put the crank at halfway and turn the cam a full circle to make sure the lifters are moving up and down.
After the belt is on turn the crank at least two turns to make sure nothing hits.
Did you torque all of the rod cap bolts? I'm thinkin' if one came off it would've stopped it pretty quick and maaaayyyybeeee didn't hurt anything too awful bad.
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#22
by
smutts
on 06 Aug, 2010 15:35
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Good luck on finding what that crack of doom sound was.
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#23
by
wolf_walker
on 06 Aug, 2010 15:41
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It looks like it rocks with rotational inertia for a second it stops so suddenly. Man that's nasty.
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#24
by
Rabbit on Roids
on 07 Aug, 2010 14:20
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so i tryed to turn the engine over at the crank with a ratchet and it wouldnt go very much so i took of the T belt and tried the crank again it went around many times nice and easly.
I don't believe the engine would ever turn one complete revolution with the timing belt removed. Do I understand the statement above correctly? Did you also rotate the cam by hand at the same time as the crank?
Chris
When the camshaft is in TDC can't the crank rotate freely b/c all the valves are closed?
And likewise if you have the crank positioned with all 4 cylinders halfway, you can turn the camshaft all around b/c none of the valves will touch the pistons?
I think I have done this.
there is no spot on the cam where all the valves are closed.. there is always 2 valves open atleast a little bit all the time, no matter what position the cam is..
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#25
by
Vincent Waldon
on 07 Aug, 2010 16:43
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Yup, that bears repeating, since it's a common misconception that can bend valves and ruin your day... there's no spot the cam sits where all valves are closed and thus safe from a crankshaft rotation perspective.
Specifically at TDC: #2 and #3 pistons are at BDC, and both have valves open:
The *only* safe way to rotate an engine without a timing belt is to loosen all the cam saddle bearings (evenly and slowly ;-) ) so that the cam floats up and all valves are closed.
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#26
by
jpedro
on 10 Aug, 2010 00:39
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one of these days when im not busy working on my truck ill try timming the car again and try starting. If not ive got a line on Vw Rabbit Diesel N/A with a man trans. That should bolt up to my trans right? and my intake and exhaust manifold should all bolt up as well? it is a mechanical head as well, runs like a top. but i think id have to use my turbo injector pump. unless one of you know of a 1.6L TD i could use...... or would using a na and adding the turbo in be easier, whats your ideas / takes on this......
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#27
by
jpedro
on 10 Aug, 2010 23:43
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? ANYONE ?
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#28
by
theman53
on 11 Aug, 2010 06:04
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all of your parts, except the cylinder head, will swap. That is assuming the one in the car was a hydro head.
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#29
by
Baron VonZeppelin
on 12 Aug, 2010 21:09
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I was at the library today using their hi-speed internet, and remembered to check out your video.
Luckily i put the headphones on.
You have my deepest sympathy friend.
That sounded like hell from the very start.
If your initial timing parameters all still show right - i would not attempt to run it again until a deep inspection.
Will it still rotate with a socket on the crankshaft ?
It sounded like it rattle-banged til it locked up. Not saying that is what happened - saying that is how it sounded. You already said it showed pressures on the guage.
Where does the gauge get its reading ? The oil filter pedestal or the cylinder head ?