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First time piecing together a turbo setup- couple of questions
by
leporidae
on 09 Jan, 2014 10:34
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in general i know how turbos work but the specifics are evading me
engine is a idi 1.9 diesel. adding an intercooled garrett gt15 turbo
I don't have any hardware. what grade? local hardware store stuff ok? for turbo to manifold, turbo to downpipe
is there supposed to be a gasket between downpipe and turbo, turbo and manifold? triangular flange
block off plate for egr on manifold. anyone sell these or make your own kind of thing?
here is the turbo i am using
where are these two nipples supposed to go? circled in red
circled in black- what are those for? they are tapped. OE mounting bracket?
i'm a little unclear on the wastegate and how that is supposed to work. i connect those two circled nipples and the wastegate will open when it reaches a certain psi? at what point does it open? how is that psi where it opens adjusted?
how do folks control the boost in these? where would a manual boost controller go?
thanks. i have been searching and reading these forums a bunch but i apologize if these are obvious to most of you
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#1
by
TimpanogosSlim
on 09 Jan, 2014 10:47
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in general i know how turbos work but the specifics are evading me
engine is a idi 1.9 diesel. adding an intercooled garrett gt15 turbo
I don't have any hardware. what grade? local hardware store stuff ok? for turbo to manifold, turbo to downpipe
Hardware store grade isn't going to be worse than what VW used, I think, but hardware stores may not have much metric hardware.
In general I'd say use class 10.9 (like 'grade 8') stainless with copper anti-seize, but if class 8.8 is what you can get, that's not horrible.
is there supposed to be a gasket between downpipe and turbo, turbo and manifold? triangular flange
Of course. ctsturbo and atpturbo are some vendors to check with. I'm no expert here though - you and i are working on essentially the same project, from the same perspective.
block off plate for egr on manifold. anyone sell these or make your own kind of thing?
Yes. And IMHO this would be a great piece to drill and tap for an EGT sensor. idparts _may_ have it, and may not call it an EGR blockoff. The EPA has been cracking down on EGR delete products recently.
Your manifold is from an AHU or something?
where are these two nipples supposed to go? circled in red
circled in black- what are those for? they are tapped. OE mounting bracket?
i'm a little unclear on the wastegate and how that is supposed to work. i connect those two circled nipples and the wastegate will open when it reaches a certain psi? at what point does it open? how is that psi where it opens adjusted?
how do folks control the boost in these? where would a manual boost controller go?
You run a high temperature air line between those nipples. That's how the wastegate works, yes. You would insert a manual boost controller right there between those nipples.
A little while back i posted some links to articles about manual boost control over in the general section. I recommend reading 'em.
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#2
by
leporidae
on 09 Jan, 2014 11:24
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#3
by
air-cooled or diesel
on 09 Jan, 2014 12:06
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the grade 10.9 may be over-kill here, that's a lot of bolt, like the kind you can use on the suspension. and stainless 10.9 may be real hard, and its heavier too. over time as the exhaust flexes with the engine you may find the flanges they connect will fatigue. I know this is true on aluminum and al/steel applications, that 'heavy' of a metal wears contacting parts. the stainless isn't supposed to rust, but with the heat and debris, etc, I haven't found a big benefit from stainless hardware,, a good dose of anti-seize, and I can easily find metric hardware, 8.8, normally common.
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#4
by
TimpanogosSlim
on 09 Jan, 2014 12:15
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I guess that makes sense, about stainless hardware vs. exhaust.
The o2 sensors on my land cruiser are installed with a pair of stainless steel lock nuts - the kind with a top that has a cross cut and has been squeezed together.
After 10+ years of exhaust temperatures, they are little meteorites. Pitted such that they are not recognizable as nuts and have no flat sides on which to fit a wrench. iirc this is why vw prefers copper or copper-clad nuts on exhaust systems.
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#5
by
theman53
on 09 Jan, 2014 16:25
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Stainless will not be graded in 10.9 and I would use stainless when I could on the exhaust stuff if you have the option as it takes heat well. On the carbon bolts I would use the 10.9 as they have a higher carbon content and will come out better years down the road than the 8.8.
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#6
by
Gizmoman
on 09 Jan, 2014 17:23
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Stainless will not be graded in 10.9 and I would use stainless when I could on the exhaust stuff if you have the option as it takes heat well. On the carbon bolts I would use the 10.9 as they have a higher carbon content and will come out better years down the road than the 8.8.
X2 /\
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#7
by
leporidae
on 09 Jan, 2014 18:57
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ok i'll look for some stainless hardware.
i spoke to someone in aviation and he mentioned drilled heads and a specific way of safety wiring them to keep anything from backing out after heat cycles. you guys familiar with that?
i found the egr block off at idparts thanks for the link. originally i was planning on drilling and tapping the manifold for my egr probe but i saw this over at idparts
http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=3070i read on here that you would probably get a more accurate reading if you drill and tap the manifold in the middle rather than use the egr port. can anyone speak of the difference in accuracy? i doubt it would be substantial enough to make a whole lot of difference but what do i know. for me and the equipment i have, it would be a PITA to drill and tap the manifold.
didn't have any luck finding the gaskets i need yet
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#8
by
TimpanogosSlim
on 09 Jan, 2014 19:37
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ok i'll look for some stainless hardware.
i spoke to someone in aviation and he mentioned drilled heads and a specific way of safety wiring them to keep anything from backing out after heat cycles. you guys familiar with that?
yeah, aviation techs do that. They will drill a small diameter hole through the bolt heads - parallel with the head, not the bolt - and then run a steel wire through all of the bolt heads and tie the wire down.
I know an ex-airforce mechanic who safety wired the axle bolts on his 1Z-powered caddy after someone at a GTG noticed that one of them had backed out.
on exhaust parts, eh, i haven't heard of it being done?
Do you have a really good drill press with a vise, a bunch of small diameter carbide bits, and a very steady hand? keep in mind that aviation guys have to worry about tons of metal hurtling through the sky with people inside.
i found the egr block off at idparts thanks for the link. originally i was planning on drilling and tapping the manifold for my egr probe but i saw this over at idparts
http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=3070
i read on here that you would probably get a more accurate reading if you drill and tap the manifold in the middle rather than use the egr port. can anyone speak of the difference in accuracy? i doubt it would be substantial enough to make a whole lot of difference but what do i know. for me and the equipment i have, it would be a PITA to drill and tap the manifold.
didn't have any luck finding the gaskets i need yet
that's a good looking plate.
I suppose it would depend on the EGT probe whether the EGR port is an adequate spot or not. If your probe is just the nubbin, if it's in the EGR port it's going to be sort of out of the flow. if it's down inside a stainless steel tube that reaches further into the manifold, well, you probably need the extra space the EGR port gives you.
finding the gaskets . . . it's a matter of knowing what flanges are involved. The trick with those triangular turbo flanges is, uh, there are about a dozen different ones. What did the turbo come off of?
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#9
by
81 vw pu
on 09 Jan, 2014 21:56
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#10
by
TimpanogosSlim
on 10 Jan, 2014 23:48
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I forgot to mention cxracing.com - the C is for China! but as long as you're not buying an actual turbo or turbo cartridge how far wrong could they get it?
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#11
by
vanbcguy
on 11 Jan, 2014 17:00
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I think their manifolds are perfectly fine, though I seem to recall checking them out and realizing that a lot of them wouldn't fit all that well between the engine and the firewall. I think back when I was looking at universal manifolds there were some SPA Turbo ones that looked like they'd work (would need an adapter though)
I do have an AHU stock exhaust manifold I'm not using that I think might have the same flange as your turbo...
I bought one of those IDParts EGR blockoff plates for my build - I'm using it as a port for my EMP gauge. On the Passat PD manifold I'm using it would actually be in exactly the right spot for an EGT probe, but on the AHU manifold I've got the EGR port is way off to one end of the manifold, no good for EGT purposes.
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#12
by
TimpanogosSlim
on 11 Jan, 2014 18:32
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I think their manifolds are perfectly fine, though I seem to recall checking them out and realizing that a lot of them wouldn't fit all that well between the engine and the firewall. I think back when I was looking at universal manifolds there were some SPA Turbo ones that looked like they'd work (would need an adapter though)
I do have an AHU stock exhaust manifold I'm not using that I think might have the same flange as your turbo...
I bought one of those IDParts EGR blockoff plates for my build - I'm using it as a port for my EMP gauge. On the Passat PD manifold I'm using it would actually be in exactly the right spot for an EGT probe, but on the AHU manifold I've got the EGR port is way off to one end of the manifold, no good for EGT purposes.
idparts has an egt probe that is really long for exactly that reason.
I could use an AHU exhaust manifold. A GT15 too.
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#13
by
leporidae
on 19 Jan, 2014 12:16
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ok so i took the car off the road and am in the middle of this.
the outlet on the turbo, which is 1.5", pretty much faces the firewall at a 90 degree angle
i got some silicon elbows but it isn't ideal.
what have other folks done with these?
if the turbo was clocked upwards...can i do that?
i have the 1y intake manifold which is pretty bulky
and the downpipe i have isn't close to fitting. ruh roh. i will find a shop to do it but i hope the gear selector rod isn't in the way.
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#14
by
leporidae
on 19 Jan, 2014 15:46
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