best turbo for home built eco? 1.6 n/a with bov - IDI Engine - VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
-
best turbo for home built eco? 1.6 n/a with bov by billybobf on 14 Apr, 2012 19:51
-
Ok, so like it says, I just want a little bit more out of my 1.6 n/a, I wont run it without a BOV. thinking just a gov mod when I reseal the pump (or just a fuel screw adjustment if I dont open the pump)
I plan on low boost, like less then 15psi for sure, with a BOV.
should I go big turbo small turbo, vnt? whats going to be the best option for something like this.
can I run 15psi on a stock 1.6 n/a MECHANICAL engine? -
#1 by Blocksmith on 14 Apr, 2012 22:32
-
Yes, yes, and yes.
But first things first: You neither need nor want a BOV. The stock motor can handle all the boost you throw at it 'till 20, 25+ psi. (some say quite a bit more than that, even). Without further mods, you're probably not going to fuel it enough to even see those numbers. Proof of the unnecessary status of a BOV on these motors is that VW deleted them from subsequent turbo motors; mk3 onward don't have them. What you DO want is a functioning wastegate, to protect the turbo and motor from excessive exhaust manifold pressure, which is what kills things.
If you're just 'looking for a little more' out of the motor, but perhaps plan on continuing to turn up the fuel, etc., then something like a k14 would be a good choice for a wastegated turbo (small enough to spool quickly, but not so small as to severely restrict exhaust flow at higher rpm). If you're not looking to ever make any more power out of it, then a T2 or K03 would supply sufficient boost, but start spooling more or less instantaneously.
I would stay away from anything larger than a k14 (like a T3 or k24). Without significantly increased fueling, it would just spool too late in the rpm band.
A vnt, while nice, would probably be rather severe overkill, unless you're looking to the future, trying to install mods the rest of the motor can grow into, so to speak. If you can get one cheap, then do it, but for the parameters you specified, there's no need to have one.
-
#2 by billybobf on 14 Apr, 2012 22:41
-
Nope no further upgrades. I prefer stock'ish
dont want to burn up a motor.
ok so I need an exhaust manifold and a turbo, do I need a manifold or can I build my own custom manifold (with boost does air flow matter as much?)
I would prefer low rpm power increases, as well as steady power increase across the board.
whos got what I need and how much?
this would really be to have a good mileage daily driver that isnt GUTLESS -
#3 by 745 turbogreasel on 14 Apr, 2012 23:07
-
I plan on low boost, like less then 15psi for sure, with a BOV.
How is doubling the factory boost low? -
#4 by billybobf on 14 Apr, 2012 23:25
-
I said LESS THEN FOR SURE! but Im hearing guys saying 20 plus, Id be cool with 8psi, whatever I need to run without causin problems, I do have an egt on the way. just want it to run good and run right, and be reliable, and honestly if the means no turbo, I guess so be it, open intake and open exhaust.
-
#5 by billybobf on 15 Apr, 2012 00:17
-
so is the VNT 15 not a good option if I can get one for the right price?
pros cons need LOTS more info, or should I just buy an 8v header and run open air intake and call it good? -
#6 by R.O.R-2.0 on 15 Apr, 2012 09:49
-
Ok, so like it says, I just want a little bit more out of my 1.6 n/a, I wont run it without a BOV. thinking just a gov mod when I reseal the pump (or just a fuel screw adjustment if I dont open the pump)
I plan on low boost, like less then 15psi for sure, with a BOV.
should I go big turbo small turbo, vnt? whats going to be the best option for something like this.
can I run 15psi on a stock 1.6 n/a MECHANICAL engine?
the engine in my Jetta is a 1.6D n/a out of a vanagon... CS code..
its got 25psi boost, a stock re-used fiber head gasket, and stock stretch bolts..
K24 turbo also.
it does just fine, although i suspect my gasket started leaking one of the last times i drove the car..
almost saw my boost gauge @ 30psi tho.. and after that, it oil smoked, and got to operating temp QUICK.. it doesnt over heat, but it comes up faster than normal.
anyways, it depends on what you want it to perform like..
if you want instant boost, throw a K14, or even better, a K03 on there..
if you want boost that lags, but comes on HARD, then a T3 or K24 would be what you want.. maybe even a K26. -
#7 by Blocksmith on 15 Apr, 2012 10:20
-
Nope no further upgrades. I prefer stock'ish
dont want to burn up a motor.
ok so I need an exhaust manifold and a turbo, do I need a manifold or can I build my own custom manifold (with boost does air flow matter as much?)
I would prefer low rpm power increases, as well as steady power increase across the board.
whos got what I need and how much?
this would really be to have a good mileage daily driver that isnt GUTLESS
anyways, it depends on what you want it to perform like..
if you want instant boost, throw a K14, or even better, a K03 on there..
if you want boost that lags, but comes on HARD, then a T3 or K24 would be what you want.. maybe even a K26.
It sounds like you're wanting more 'driveability', i.e. torque, so you're gonna want an insta-spool turbo. If you're only going to run 7-10 psi of boost, use a k03. Just make sure the wastegate works.
Diesel specific K03's were one of the factory turbos on Canadian 1.9l idi's (AAZ code). They crop up in the for sale section from time to time, and on ebay as well. Also might try the Samba. Just keep your eyes open. Be sure to get the manifold too, since they're k03 specific. The only real issue I've heard of with using a k03 is the downpipe flange--it might be a little tough to get your hands on one. I'd see if any of our Canadian members could help you out there.
You'll need a turbo intake manifold from a 1.6, unless you plan on flipping the turbo upside down, which creates its own problems.
You'll need the oil feed and drain lines, and either a turbo oil pan, or modify your existing one to accept the drain line.
Do a lot of reading---I knew NOTHING about these diesels (or motors in general, for that matter) before I started perusing this site. It really is a gold mine of information.
As a side note: A vnt is nice, don't get me wrong. But for what you're describing, there is absolutely no need for one. And they usually cost significantly more than a wastegated turbo. Furthermore, you'd have to hook up a vane control mechanism to avoid overspooling and ruining it. More work and expense than it'd be worth, if you only ran it at 10 psi.
-
#8 by billybobf on 15 Apr, 2012 17:40
-
well, right now that guy has his vnt 15 for sale with the exhuast manifold. I can tig weld aluminum. Ive got a mill and lathe at work, so I could make adapters for flanges NO problem at all. as far as linkage, the stock shift linkage on the mk2 seems complicated enough. is the VNT actuator not linear? plug in a line from the intake and set a screw for the desired PSI? (this is where my turbo NEWB is showing right?)
really, custom should be my middle name
I have welded things on engines you wouldnt want to know about. I rebuild my own engines transmissions and transfer cases, I set up my own differentials on my 4x4, I do timing belts, timing chains and all that good junk, Ive operated mills lathes, welders, boring bars, head machines, surfacers, hones, benders, brakes, presses, shears, chop saws, I do my own body work, I do my own glass work, I mount and balance my own tires (used to use a dual plane dynamic balancer, now I throw airsoft beads in my 4x4 tires, lol) Ive rebuilt carbs, Ive rebuilt computers.
Let go back to what would be best bang for buck.
not worried about "work" involved, just cost, reliability and doing it RIGHT, and I dont mind over complicated fail safes.
I have an odd form of ADHD, I enjoy tinkering to an extreme, and rare engines are my tink of choice. I like to rebuild rotary engines, diesels, and four stroke weedeater motors (those little rockers and valves are so cute)
ok, so power over a wide rpm range?
I would really like this thing to get good fuel mileage if my driving style permits, but would also love for it to light up when I ask it to even if Im already higher in the RPM range.
My ebay EGT is on its way so I will be watching temps -
#9 by JamesT on 16 Apr, 2012 13:07
-
A VNT system isn't as simple as a wastegate. From my understanding, it seems counter intuitive. You want the vanes to restrict more as you increase throttle, then open more as boost builds. Basically, the vanes are in the same position at full boost as at idle. This prevents overspooling when you let off the throttle hard from full load. Linkages require some creativity and fine tuning to get right.
I run a k14 on my AAZ and I have no complaints. It builds and maintains boost in all the right places. -
#10 by billybobf on 16 Apr, 2012 15:37
-
so that is EXACTLY what I needed to know,
the vnt is WAY over complicated for a non performance upgrade. although a standard WG actuator mounted on a bracket that moves with the throttle peddle might work ok? where the waste gate actuator would have final say, but the throttle peddle would act first for quick spools, and the actuator would open it back up once it was at the higher boost? -
#11 by JamesT on 16 Apr, 2012 21:22
-
so that is EXACTLY what I needed to know,
the vnt is WAY over complicated for a non performance upgrade. although a standard WG actuator mounted on a bracket that moves with the throttle peddle might work ok? where the waste gate actuator would have final say, but the throttle peddle would act first for quick spools, and the actuator would open it back up once it was at the higher boost?
I've just been doing research and playing with a VNT apart on a bench. I'm not going to say that's the way I'd actuate it, but that is similar to some setups I've read. What I would say is that it necessitates far more complexity and failure points than I would want for a simple daily driver's first turbo. -
#12 by keaton on 16 Apr, 2012 21:33
-
see sig for stand alone VNT controller
-
#13 by billybobf on 16 Apr, 2012 21:41
-
see sig for stand alone VNT controller
THAT, is too much for me, small easy to spool turbo with a wastegate sounds good to me. NO vnt. in theory it would be cool, the right turbo for the job from idle to redline. but probably not good for just a little more bottom end power. -
#14 by Blocksmith on 17 Apr, 2012 11:20
-
Perfect timing:
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=31327.0