300 tdi landrover pump on an ALH TDI engine - page 1 - mTDI Mechanical TDI Conversions - VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.

• 300 tdi landrover pump on an ALH TDI engine by fatmobile on 14 Dec, 2019 17:03
•   I'm working on the MTDI MK2 project.
   It's time to play with the pump.
   There's a lever on the pump that I haven't seen on any others.
   After reading the MTDI FAQ thread it looks like it's not needed.
   But it doesn't say how to get rid of it.
   It does get in the way of the accelerator cable and generally clutters the place up.
   
  Should I just pull it out and cut the lever off the inside and trim down the lever on the outside?
   On the old 1.6 pumps I always had to cut the nubs off the lid gasket
   but the slots are wider on the landrover pump and it fit nice with the nubs.
  
  
   I also need to swap the hub from the TDI to this pump.
  
   But as you can see the TDI hub has a small slot for the alignment pin to go into,
   and the landrover pump has a large slot and uses a larger alignment pin.
   I'm thinking i will just make the TDI hub slot as large as the landrover slot.
  Is there a better plan?
  Also wondering where to set this slot on the rover pump?
   Use a dial gauge to set it to 154?
  
   I'd like to use a MK2 accelerator arm and springs.
   Has that been tried?
  
• #1 by libbydiesel on 14 Dec, 2019 21:29
• To remove that extra lever, I have removed it, tapped the hole to NPT and threaded in an allen plug.  What you propose would also work.  That extra lever (if all is adjusted correctly) will reduce the puff of smoke at startup.  That is all that it does. 
  
  If you want to be precise with the hub, then you could either cut the VW hub to match the larger hole or put a small bushing into the hole so it matches the VW hub.  To install the hub, make sure the shaft keyway is aligned with the delivery valve for the #1 injector, make sure the dial indicator is rising as you turn CW, and when you arrive at the dial indicator setting you desire, lock the pump shaft with the side bolt.  With the shaft locked, install the hub with the pin in place and tighten the hub nut.  Whenever the pin fits should then equal the dial indicator reading you used previously.  I think 1.40mm is a good baseline timing spec for the LR pump.  You might want to adjust from there, though.  Set to 12° BTDC at idle with the pulse adapter.   
  
  
• #2 by fatmobile on 15 Dec, 2019 00:32
•   I hadn't thought about plugging that hole with an NPT plug.
  
   And filling the pin alignment hole in the front of the pump.
   That might be easier than making the slot precisely bigger.
  
   So take the dial indicator to it's lowest spot going counter clockwise.
   Just like when it's on the car I'd push the car backwards until the dial gauge hits it's lowest spot.
   Then turn it clockwise until it reaches 1.4mm.
   Lock it in place with the allen head bolt on the side of the pump near the mainshaft:
  
    Obvious, even through all that dirt.
  After that the bolts on the sprocket get used for fine tuning?
  
   I made a 12° BTDC mark on the flywheel.
  
   Soooo use the short accelerator arm that came with it?
  Or see if I can swap to the MK2 cable bracket and lever?
  Thanks Andrew.
   You went through some of this with me awhile ago.
• #3 by libbydiesel on 15 Dec, 2019 01:33
• Yup, you've got all the main points.  Just to reiterate, you need the shaft keyway pointing toward the #1 delivery valve when you're doing the process.  From there you can rotate CCW to zero the gauge.  I think you'll need a longer bolt with the same pitch to lock the shaft.  Yup, fine timing is done by adjusting the alignment between the sprocket and the hub. 
• #4 by fatmobile on 15 Dec, 2019 22:55
•  Oh, so that allen head bolt gets pulled and a longer bolt gets used to lock the shaft.
   I didn't get a chance to look at that today.
  
   I got rid of the extra lever.
   I tried to push it inward, take it out, and cut it.
   But it runs into the LDA arm,..
   as you can see in the first picture of this thread.
   So I cut off the outside end with a cutoff wheel
   which made it short enough.
  Then cleaned up the edge and shoved it through.
   The hole was almost too big to tap to 1/8" NPT but I think it will seal.
  
   With that out of the way I should be able to use the 1.6 accelerator cable bracket.
  
   The whiteish paint shows what needs removed.
   You can see the hole plugged below it.
  
   I also got a chance to do the governor mod.
   The MTDI FAQ thread suggested it works great with this pump.
   But didn't really tell what kind of governor mod they did.
  Here's how I do them:
  
  The spring gets removed and replaced by (in this case) 2 washers.
  I tried one shim and there was some slop,
   the spring wasn't under pressure.
  
   Left to do are:
   find hub swap bushing size.
   Swap the TDI delivery valves to this pump.
   Figure out best accelerator lever to use.
   Set the hub on the mainshaft at 1.4mm.
   
  
• #5 by libbydiesel on 16 Dec, 2019 00:59
• That all looks good to me. 
• #6 by fatmobile on 22 Dec, 2019 17:46
•  I got some more done with the pump.
   For the rear mounting bracket I went with one from a MK1:
  
  
  There are holes in the metal high pressure head that are supposed to support the bracket.
   The Land Rover pump had them in a different spot so the TDI bracket had little support.
   The MK1 bracket didn't line up with the right holes either so I drilled them into the bracket.
   Where the 2 allen bolts are.
   
   To drill the right spot I screwed the pointy bolt into the hole and bolted the bracket on,..
   then tapped it with a hammer to use it like a center punch.
  
  To make the pointy bolt I put a bolt in the drill press and held a grinder up to it while it was spinning,..
   then filed a couple flat spots so I could grip it.
  
   I took some other pictures but they aren't showing up on the SD card.
   So I'll just explain what I did on the other end.
   First off the shaft locking bolt is 10M1 thread and needs to have at least 1 3/8" of threads.
   
   I made a bushing to fill the alignment pin hole,
   instead of grinding the hub slot to fit the pin.
   I found a piece of about 3/8" aluminum rod and drilled the center to 15/64" on my cheesy 1945 altas lathe.
   
   It seemed cleaner but I ended up having to grind the hub slot too.
   Because the alignment pin hole on the TDI is up higher
  so I had to grind the slot deeper to match the LR pump hole.
  
   I locked the shaft at 1.4mm,.. my dial gauge isn't metric so I used .055".
  Then cleaned and degreased the hub center and shaft before sticking them together with a nut.
   
   Where that pin hole is on the LR pump also stands out farther
   so the 3 TDI sprocket mounting bolts hit the pump.
    I broke out the bolt shortener but probably could have removed some from the pump.
   Only talking about 1/8".
  
   The TDI pump is bolted on  from the timing belt side.
   So it's threaded.
   The LR pump isn't tapped.
   I installed 8M1.25 helicoils.
   The hole was almost too big to use a helicoil but I think it will work.
  
   On the top of the pump I used the LR accel lever and spring setup.
   I think the LR pump uses the tall bushing like the MK2.
   So I think the MK2 accel lever and spring setup would work but I didn't have one to try.
   The ball the MK1 and MK2 accel cable snaps to fits the LR lever with a little drilling.
  But I might still weld a piece of early adjustable bracket to the end.
   Having the cable attach farther from the center
   means small movement of the foot moves the lever less.
   Might not be as sensitive to movement. 
• #7 by fatmobile on 22 Dec, 2019 17:47
• Since the pin sits lower I had to mill out a little from the sprocket slot
   so the pin could be inserted with the sprocket on.
  
   The timing belt and transmission are on.
• #8 by libbydiesel on 22 Dec, 2019 19:55
• I used a 1.6 rear pump plate on my ALH mTDI (LR pump).  I drilled the extra holes also, but I think they probably aren't even necessary.  The 2 corner bolts and the mount bolt triangulate the plate nicely without the added allen bolts. 
  
  I ground the pump case to prevent the stock sprocket bolts from hitting it.
  
  I tapped the 3 LR pump mounting holes to M10.  The M10 bolts fit fine through the timing belt backing plate and the accessory bracket. 
  
  It wouldn't be a bad thing to get a new serp belt tensioner.  I didn't replace the one on my mTDI ALH and it seized, shredded the belt and lots of belt pieces got wrapped around the crank.
• #9 by fatmobile on 22 Dec, 2019 22:26
•  I'll check the price of a new tensioner,..
   or see if Bill changed that when he did the timing belt.
  
   Was that 10 M 1 you tapped the pump mounting holes?
  Or something courser?
  
   I'm going to have to get new sprocket bolts anyway.
   So I might cut the pump down for clearance  now and in the future.
• #10 by libbydiesel on 22 Dec, 2019 22:34
• On the m10 bolts I used I don't recall offhand what pitch they were although I believe they were typical coarse (1.5).  It was 6-1/2 years ago that I did it and those details got purged from my RAM.   
• #11 by fatmobile on 23 Dec, 2019 21:02
•   Oh, I have a 10M1, for temps sensors etc.
   I'll have to get a coarse one for the next MTDI build.
   I'll probably use long 8x 1.25 bolts in the top two holes,
  using the helicoil.
   I will back them up with nuts on the top 2,..
   because that would be easy to do.
• #12 by libbydiesel on 24 Dec, 2019 11:53
• If you would like to avoid the heli-coils, your heli-coil outside thread is probably m10 x 1.25 (or the holes could easily be tapped to that).  Bolts of that thread should be available at most hardware stores and will fit through the bracket holes.  The heli-coils are probably fine, though, and the added nut is a good belt + suspenders.   
• #13 by fatmobile on 27 Apr, 2020 01:11
• The plug (shown in post #4 of this thread ) I put in place of the lever was a leaker.
   So I put it in with JB weld and now it doesn't.
• #14 by fatmobile on 03 Jul, 2020 00:46
•  Took it into town for the first time today.
   It has plenty of power.
   Enough to slip the clutch when launching,.. I know the wheels weren't spinning but something was.
    This 1.9 is a little much for the 020 trany
   so a slipping clutch will probably keep me from breaking it
   before I install an 02A.
   Still very driveable.
  
   Only problem is the RPMs like to hang.
   Rev it up and they don't go back down very quickly.
   Just kinda hang there, and if the clutch is in; the RPMs climb.
  
   I've moved the accelerator lever on the shaft a few times.
   Pretty sure this is where it should be.
   Have moved the max fuel screw in and out while playing with the spline settings.
   Does it even when moved in and gutless.
  
  I might have to go through the injectors.
   Probably run some diesel purge through it first.