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Horrible cold starts.
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 Oct, 2011 13:44
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I need to get this figured out before it actually gets cold... Or I'll be sooo screwed. It can easily drop to like -40C here being off Georgian Bay.
I just put in new glowplugs, as they are cheap and I figured it could use em anyhow. And set the timing to 0.95-0.96mm. I also have an electric pump inline before my fuel filter so its not as if I have drainback issues and the pump looses prime.. It started real rough like all cylinders weren't firing.. Which leads me to think I installed some bad new plugs... (Yeah my own damn fault) Did the job so quick afterwOrds I'm like shiiii I didn't test em.
It started last night fine colder. Started ok today at one.. And now at 430 you'd sware it sat all night again... Godd dammmn!
Brainstorm! Lol
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#1
by
wdkingery
on 20 Oct, 2011 15:11
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i'm fixin to ditch my entire glowplug wiring in favor of some of Ford's finest.. one real big relay, like this:
one five dollar battery cable, straight from positive on battery to this thing, and then all glow plugs to this thing.
wire the small terminals to a switch to activate the relay.
i'm beginnin to question my 26 year old glow plug wiring.. cause i too have rough starts, now granted i probably haz zero compression at this point, but my god it's only 49 degrees farhenheit at this point is it really that tough to get fired up?? i even double dip my GP's on the first start of the day
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#2
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 Oct, 2011 16:48
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I have a completely manual setup already. First mod when I got my diesel.
I have it straight off the battery with 4awg to the solenoid, 4awg to my distro block. And then each has its own 20a fuse, and 10awg to each GP.
I have all 4 Bosch Duraterms. Which are capable of maintaining perfect glow for over 5 minutes.. I once had a failure that left my old plugs on for a half hour. That was last year. Till two days ago they were still in my engine
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So basically I know it is not the gp's. I am fairly sure it isn't compression either.. As it runs great and doesn't use any oil.. Other than a leak at the front of the HG..
I just can't wrap my head on this one.. sometimes its fine sometimes it isn't?? Could it be my battery? Just not getting a good enough spin??
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#3
by
wdkingery
on 20 Oct, 2011 16:55
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yeah spin speed is very important
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#4
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 Oct, 2011 17:00
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It doesn't spin that slow.. But the battery is definitely at least 5 years old, and was a reman at that! I got it and its counterpart out of an F350 I scrapped. The other one spins my Ford 302 like a tiny engine. Lmao
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#5
by
rabbitman
on 20 Oct, 2011 19:07
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If you have good compression then cranking speed is not nearly as important. Yesterday my battery was almost dead but it started even though it cranked very slow like "it's not gonna make it past compression" kinda slow.
Yesterday morning it was barely above 20F and cranked slowish after sitting all night and 4 hours later at 30F it was even even slower as mentioned above.........something's up with my alternator though.
Does your cold start knob make it better or worse?
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#6
by
R.O.R-2.0
on 20 Oct, 2011 19:18
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If you have good compression then cranking speed is not nearly as important. Yesterday my battery was almost dead but it started even though it cranked very slow like "it's not gonna make it past compression" kinda slow.
Yesterday morning it was barely above 20F and cranked slowish after sitting all night and 4 hours later at 30F it was even even slower as mentioned above.........something's up with my alternator though.
Does your cold start knob make it better or worse?
my rabbit starts just like this sometimes, if the battery is very low. you dont think its even gonna finish that compression stroke, then it fires off..
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#7
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 Oct, 2011 19:20
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Does your cold start knob make it better or worse?
While cranking? or after the car has started?
I have not actually given it a try before starting.. Possibly because I used to run my other pump timed to like 1.03mm and the CS would make it crank slower.. This pump being timed to 0.95-0.96mm may actually benefit from starting with the CS pulled out.. I'll have to give that a try tomorrow morning.
After the car has started and is running like total shiz, pulling the CS jumps the idle up to like 1500 and advances timing so it purrs..
Just had an epiphany... What if how I have my pump set up right now it is not fueling properly for idle..
Like If i had the residual fuel screw (throttle rest screw) out to far, and the max fuel screw in to far.. it may not be providing enough idle fueling to fire off? Or maybe I just need to raise my idle? SOO MANY VARIABLES when you mess with every adjustment the pump has.. lol
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#8
by
rabbitman
on 20 Oct, 2011 19:32
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While cranking? or after the car has started?
Like If i had the residual fuel screw (throttle rest screw) out to far, and the max fuel screw in to far.. it may not be providing enough idle fueling to fire off? Or maybe I just need to raise my idle? SOO MANY VARIABLES when you mess with every adjustment the pump has.. lol
While cranking, and yeah I know it can make it crank slower but it's worth trying.
Yeah I know about messing up adjustments, when they're so far off you can't get it to run right it's time to reset it like factory (if you can) or just experiment away.
Do you ever press the go pedal while cranking? Maybe glow it a bit longer.
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#9
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 Oct, 2011 20:15
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With the duraterms They get tips hot in 5 seconds, middle hot in 13, and fully glowing by 20 seconds. I'll try the normal 10 second glow with the CS out tomorrow.
The only thing that sucks with my adjustments is I have it perfect right now. The most power i've ever had out of it, with the least smoke! It's seriously like a raped ape right now. 3" cold air intake, and straight through exhaust really help out. I am going to put it against my brothers 1.6td and see how she does lol.
But yeah i will try a few things out tomorrow before work. then let it sit till lunch and try a different approach, then after work see whats up. Bro works at a local shop so he can get stuff at shop cost, I may throw a new truck battery (1100CCA) in for ***s and giggles.
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#10
by
maxfax
on 20 Oct, 2011 21:31
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Try the go pedal and the CS as Rabbitman suggested.. Not to rain down a lot of doom and gloom, a compression check would be the next thing in order... These buggers will actually run pretty good and not use tons of oil with low compression...
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#11
by
rabbitman
on 20 Oct, 2011 22:52
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Forgot to say that my last compression check about two years and 30-40K miles ago was 400-420psi. Checked as hot as possible before it cooled down.
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#12
by
vanbcguy
on 21 Oct, 2011 07:38
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Jezzie needs the CS handle most of the time and she's got plenty of advance as it is. She's got a fair bit of blow-by though so I think new rings are in her future.
Anyhow, for me I have the best results with the CS handle if I crank her till she's sort of catching (not more than a few revolutions) and THEN pull the handle. Usually she fires to life as I pull it. That way she can get cranking with it out, and then once the starter is up to speed I throw in the extra advance. I believe that's actually how it says to do it in the owner's manual though I can't say I've looked in a loooong time.
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#13
by
8v-of-fury
on 21 Oct, 2011 08:18
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Well it idles fine right after start up with CS out, but stumbles if you push it in.. So I think it just needs a little higher idle and a little more advance..
However i am in the car right now.. And just started up.. There was a ton of start up smoke. Which I believe to be incomplete combustion. Each miss of the engine a second later would produce a smoke puff.. Kind of blueish.. Oil??
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#14
by
vanbcguy
on 21 Oct, 2011 08:44
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That'd be unburned diesel... Was that with or without the CS handle pulled out? I get that if my CS handle is in and I don't give Jezzie enough glow before starting...
I see you put new GPs in, but have you actually verified that they're all working? If you overtighten them on installation they can die pretty much right away. With the engine cold just cycle the plugs and stick your finger on the terminal of each of them - they should feel warm. If not... they ain't working.
Jezzie needs the cold start handle pulled out for the first 20 seconds or so after starting once it's below 10°C out or she runs kinda rough. She cleans up pretty darn quick, but she DOES have afterglow on the GPs since she's a Mk III. The GPs stay on for about 3-5 minutes after starting when it's at all cold out.