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building first TD. newb needs direction
by
DieselPwr
on 04 Dec, 2009 23:31
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so i have an 82 jetta coupe 1.6d that was converted to a TD with a T3, everything except the front mount and turbo is pretty much stock. i want to build it for strength and reliability (hopefully boosting around 15lbs, current is around 6), advice on everything from fueling to tranny/clutch/flywheel setup would be much appreciated. i figure i could swap it but i'd rather dump money into something unique with sufficient power for a little fun and good mileage. i will post pics of car later. Thanks, also would it be worth it to invest in a lsd??
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#1
by
rabbitman
on 04 Dec, 2009 23:59
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The stock tranny will be fine at 15psi, as for the clutch I don't think you'll have a problem and if you do then you can change it. Do a search, lots of people have put bigger clutches on I'm not sure what though.
As for the lsd, I assume your talking about the LDA?
You can swap one over but it requires cutting the fixed stop off inside the pump. Not too hard but it MUST stay clean in there!! Also they aren't very easy to find, you'd probably have to get lucky at a junk yard or pay to have it converted.
Search in the FAQ section, there's lots of writeups on how make these faster.
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#2
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 00:17
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well i pretty much want to run as much boost as safely possible, from what i understand the t3 can hold in the low 20's. would my motor, if well built, be able to handle this? would the tranny?
i meant limited slip dif, because i'm hoping for high torque
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#3
by
rabbitman
on 05 Dec, 2009 00:31
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I'd put 20psi into my engine stock anyday, but that's just me.
You'll want an egt gauge so you don't fry anything too.
There is "some" LSD's out there but they cost quite a bit. I don't know how bad you'll need one.
BTW if you're still running the NA pump an LDA will decrease the smoke and "I think" be able to give you more power.
A boost gauge wouldn't be a bad idea either.
This is just one example of a thread in the FAQ:
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=645.0
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#4
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 00:38
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already have egt, never gets above 1000 right now, unless i'm driving over the pass to oregon, know of anywhere i could get reman td pump?
thnks
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#5
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 03:00
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I'd put 20psi into my engine stock anyday, but that's just me.
You'll want an egt gauge so you don't fry anything too.
There is "some" LSD's out there but they cost quite a bit. I don't know how bad you'll need one.
BTW if you're still running the NA pump an LDA will decrease the smoke and "I think" be able to give you more power.
A boost gauge wouldn't be a bad idea either.
This is just one example of a thread in the FAQ: http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=645.0
so i want to say thanks again, and i have read through the entire and it has kind of brought up more questions, or at least allowed me to pin point my questions... so and LDA is basically a TD injection pump or??(newb) and my N/A pump will do until i track a new pump down? and to make significant power gains i need only to get a 1.9TD metal head gasket, stronger head studs and tweak the boost to 20ish lbs?
where could i find a LDa???
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#6
by
theman53
on 05 Dec, 2009 06:31
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The FAQ has some threads for you called something like "make your 1.6N/A a faster car" and "how to make your 1.6/1.9 TD faster" or something along those lines. You have seen the one, but the other 2 maybe worth reading.
To add- Many people on here have made N/A into turbos. I think most on the stock setup/hardware are running around 20PSI boost. The T3 will handle much more than that-some with TD engines are in the 30PSI range. VW overengineered just about everything in these engines so now you don't have much to worry about. If you were really concerned some have machined the block to accept oil squirters and ran it as hard as a TD with no ill results.
The only thing to worry about is the headgasket. If yours is an 82 you might have the 11mm head bolts-I don't think you would, but I don't know exactly when VW quit the 11mm. Those stink. If it is an 82 then it is for sure a mechanical head and you have to plug some hole in the 1.9L MLS head gasket to run it. Some have ordered a special made for well over 100 dollars to fix this. The point is you can run the gasket if you want. To run over 20 PSI boost I would get the head studs, under or until the HG blows I wouldn't worry.
Your LDA could possibly be sourced on ebay, here, or somewhere on the internet and I believe it is just taking the top off and putting the LDA top on and having it calibrated. You could find complete TD pump and send it to Giles--see vendors section.
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#7
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 09:22
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The FAQ has some threads for you called something like "make your 1.6N/A a faster car" and "how to make your 1.6/1.9 TD faster" or something along those lines. You have seen the one, but the other 2 maybe worth reading.
To add- Many people on here have made N/A into turbos. I think most on the stock setup/hardware are running around 20PSI boost. The T3 will handle much more than that-some with TD engines are in the 30PSI range. VW overengineered just about everything in these engines so now you don't have much to worry about. If you were really concerned some have machined the block to accept oil squirters and ran it as hard as a TD with no ill results.
The only thing to worry about is the headgasket. If yours is an 82 you might have the 11mm head bolts-I don't think you would, but I don't know exactly when VW quit the 11mm. Those stink. If it is an 82 then it is for sure a mechanical head and you have to plug some hole in the 1.9L MLS head gasket to run it. Some have ordered a special made for well over 100 dollars to fix this. The point is you can run the gasket if you want. To run over 20 PSI boost I would get the head studs, under or until the HG blows I wouldn't worry.
Your LDA could possibly be sourced on ebay, here, or somewhere on the internet and I believe it is just taking the top off and putting the LDA top on and having it calibrated. You could find complete TD pump and send it to Giles--see vendors section.
if i dont source an LDA, which i found the majority of one i believe in the classified section (the only thing missing is some rubber piece?) would i be able to tune my N/A pump to load more fuel for the time being? from what i understand the LDA cuts the fuel at idle and lets more flow under boost? whereas the N/A top will dump more fuel at idle and less under boost? so would this make my egt burn hotter? cus right now if i'm boosting 5lbs for awhile on the hwy i'll creep close to 1200, which i dont want and i have an N/A pump. so would the egt go even higher if i turned up the boost and didnt change to LDA top?
do you know what hole to plug in the 1.9 gasket? or does anyone have a diagram or picture? i'm definitely going to read more faqs are do some searches to reduce the mount of newb questions.
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#8
by
rabbitman
on 05 Dec, 2009 10:37
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if i dont source an LDA, which i found the majority of one i believe in the classified section (the only thing missing is some rubber piece?) would i be able to tune my N/A pump to load more fuel for the time being? from what i understand the LDA cuts the fuel at idle and lets more flow under boost? whereas the N/A top will dump more fuel at idle and less under boost? so would this make my egt burn hotter? cus right now if i'm boosting 5lbs for awhile on the hwy i'll creep close to 1200, which i dont want and i have an N/A pump. so would the egt go even higher if i turned up the boost and didnt change to LDA top?
do you know what hole to plug in the 1.9 gasket? or does anyone have a diagram or picture? i'm definitely going to read more faqs are do some searches to reduce the mount of newb questions.
If you turn the boost up that will lower your egt's, I don't know exactly how to do that, maybe make sure your bov and wastegate isn't leaking.
At idle it doesn't matter what pump you have it will inject the same amount. The whole point of the LDA on the pump is so you can't blow black smoke, as boost rises the LDA let's the pump inject more but the added air burns it all.
With a NA pump you can turn it up enough to run a turbo but if you floor it before boost it'll inject too much fuel and so will smoke, as boost rises the smoke will get less.
You can swap one over but it requires cutting the fixed pin/stop off inside the pump. Not too hard but it MUST stay clean in there!! Also they aren't very easy to find, you'd probably have to get lucky at a junk yard or pay to have it converted.
Ebay sometimes has 'em.
Yes you can turn your NA pump up, but if you're already getting high egt's they'll only go higher.
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#9
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 10:51
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"Ebay sometimes has 'em....."
link? i searched and came up with nothing...
sorry if i'm reiterating or anything, but i should be okay with a N/A pump if i turn up the fuel a little on 20lbs of boost? i'm assuming i'd have alittle smoke at lower rpm's with it burning off as the turbo spools? i do have an EGT gauge so i can monitor the temp, but as long as it stays under 1100-1200 most of the time i should be golden??? i'm just trying to figure a decent temporary setup till i can get a LDA top and send my pump to giles. or should i just buy TD pump and send it off?
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#10
by
Rabbit on Roids
on 05 Dec, 2009 11:53
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a better way to describe these pumps:
(i dont remember who originally posted it, but i liked the comparison)
N/A pump: more like a holley double pumper, dumps all fuel when at WOT, no matter if the engine is ready for it or not.
TD pump: more like a carb with vacuum secondaries, it only pushes out as much fuel as to the engines demands.
you guys get the idea.
to your last question..
yes, you can use a n/a pump. i ran one for a long time. just didnt have near the power or smoke i got out of the TD pump. im sure i never even saw 1000* egt. but never had a pyro..
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#11
by
kaneb
on 05 Dec, 2009 12:16
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im running a NA with a kkk24 turbo set-up until my TD's is done being built. I have hit 20psi of boost but didn't know how it would like it. So i try to keep it at 12psi with out any issues. Stock head gasket, i turned the fuel up, egt's stay under 1000. Stock clutch is ok but it is starting to go but it's the original clutch of a 26 yr old car.
It's running fine and healthy so i say do it up.
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#12
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 13:04
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a better way to describe these pumps:
(i dont remember who originally posted it, but i liked the comparison)
N/A pump: more like a holley double pumper, dumps all fuel when at WOT, no matter if the engine is ready for it or not.
TD pump: more like a carb with vacuum secondaries, it only pushes out as much fuel as to the engines demands.
you guys get the idea.
to your last question..
yes, you can use a n/a pump. i ran one for a long time. just didnt have near the power or smoke i got out of the TD pump. im sure i never even saw 1000* egt. but never had a pyro..
im running a NA with a kkk24 turbo set-up until my TD's is done being built. I have hit 20psi of boost but didn't know how it would like it. So i try to keep it at 12psi with out any issues. Stock head gasket, i turned the fuel up, egt's stay under 1000. Stock clutch is ok but it is starting to go but it's the original clutch of a 26 yr old car.
It's running fine and healthy so i say do it up.
i think to be on the safer side and for furture plans i'll get some apr studs and a new oem HG, anyone know what the thickest offered is? just replaced clutch maybe 350 mi ago. i'm very impressed with the wealth of knowledge on this site,and am greatful for advice, it has saved me money i wouldnt have had to spend. my last question is about a bov? i dont have one now and was wondering if it's normal to boost 3-4 lbs while driving down the hwy? is this normal and how would a bov effect this?
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#13
by
vanbcguy
on 05 Dec, 2009 13:12
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BOV's are for cars with throttle plates - they release manifold pressure when the throttle closes, as it otherwise has nowhere to go. Diesels don't have throttles, therefore they don't need BOV's.
Yes, it's completely normal to have boost at highway speeds. It's a GOOD thing - reduces your EGT's and ensures all the fuel burns completely.
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#14
by
DieselPwr
on 05 Dec, 2009 13:25
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BOV's are for cars with throttle plates - they release manifold pressure when the throttle closes, as it otherwise has nowhere to go. Diesels don't have throttles, therefore they don't need BOV's.
Yes, it's completely normal to have boost at highway speeds. It's a GOOD thing - reduces your EGT's and ensures all the fuel burns completely.
i knew it didnt have a throttle plate, i thought the td pumps had some sort of vac line? i've seen a bunch with BOV's? but i dont claim to be an authority by any means.