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K14 Ecodiesel turbo into 82 Vanagon drain and wastegate clocking??
by
williamtaygan
on 18 Jun, 2013 09:16
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Mount: I followed Andrew's suggestion by cutting off the end of the driver side engine mount and bolting a piece of steel underneath it with a bend at the end to effectively lower motor mount and allow wastegate clearance.
Drain clocking: trying for straight down, although if I clock the wastegate fitting away from the pipe, I can cut the stock pipe down and get it to within 5 or 10 degrees. Is this sufficient??
Drain option 1: I picked up a 3/8 inch NPT by half inch hose barb and was considering tapping that 16 x 1.5 hole larger as suggested, but will that small 3/8 hole the large enough? It's half the diameter of the stock pipe!
Drain option 2: I see other folks have trimmed down number eight banjo fittings, or welded and bent the stock pipe to clear the wastegate. I'm still trying with these options too.
CLOCKING THE WASTEGATE: This is driving me a bit crazy. The easiest option would be to move the fitting straight down, but I'm worried about lowering the mount so significantly. I might be able to leave the fitting where it is (pointing up and away from the engine) if I use the brass 45 fitting?? I also may be able to shave the banjo down and point it towards the manifold, which solves the fitment problems, but it seems too close for heat?? ARGH!
I knew this would be a custom fit, but I'm getting a bit frustrated!
Thanks for your opinions and insights!
Will in Alaska
(Cross posted to diesel-vanagon yahoo group)
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#1
by
Gizmoman
on 18 Jun, 2013 17:26
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The banjo even trimmed down is impossible to get a wrench on. I had to tighten mine with a punch and hammer on the wrench flats.
I like the 3/8" 45 brass fitting myself and may go to that before I'm done. If you're worried about the ID diameter, drill it out a bit - just be careful - brass grabs somthin' terrible.
"0" is best and is worth the effort IMHO. Oil that sits in the hot body will tend to coke up - again just an opinion.
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#2
by
Luckypabst
on 18 Jun, 2013 22:11
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Jetta exhaust manifold? I'm not around here very often anymore so I'm not familiar with your specific setup...
What I found is that the drain cavity of the K14 isn't entirely circular... it's more of an ellipse, with the drain located at what would be one 'tip' of the ellipse. This shape allows the turbo to drain just fine when it's not clocked perfectly vertical.
Of course this doesn't follow internet wisdom, but it does roughly mimic the drain clocking in the factory TD vanagon and the VW engineers must have known something. Also, my engine ran nothing but synthetic oil, changed religiously for 80,000 miles from new with no issues. YMMV in your specific case.
Anyhow, I found the appropriate metric to AN adapter and ran -10 braided hose to a custom NPT bung that I welded into the pan (only because I didn't have the OEM TD oil pan).
Chris
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#3
by
Gizmoman
on 19 Jun, 2013 05:39
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Jetta exhaust manifold? I'm not around here very often anymore so I'm not familiar with your specific setup...
What I found is that the drain cavity of the K14 isn't entirely circular... it's more of an ellipse, with the drain located at what would be one 'tip' of the ellipse. This shape allows the turbo to drain just fine when it's not clocked perfectly vertical.
Of course this doesn't follow internet wisdom, but it does roughly mimic the drain clocking in the factory TD vanagon and the VW engineers must have known something. Also, my engine ran nothing but synthetic oil, changed religiously for 80,000 miles from new with no issues. YMMV in your specific case.
Anyhow, I found the appropriate metric to AN adapter and ran -10 braided hose to a custom NPT bung that I welded into the pan (only because I didn't have the OEM TD oil pan).
Chris
"Internet wisdom" - that's funny
I didn't do the swap in the van so no idea if the manifold is from a jetta or not.
I concur on the slight off zero due to the drain shape - well described. I used #8 for the drain - #10should certainly cause no restriction. The PO had already had a #8 male welded to the pan. All I can say is I had a constant oil film in the bay around my turbo and I think it was from the stock (not zero) drain. I made every effort to get it to zero - guess it was more of a challenge accomplished sort of thing.
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#4
by
Luckypabst
on 19 Jun, 2013 09:56
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Hey Gizmo, I was curious if the OP had a Jetta manifold, because I was gonna post a photo of my drain with the Quantum/Vanagon turbo exhaust which leaves even less room for the downhill run, but then that wouldn't be all that appropriate if he's running a different setup.
Anyway... looking back through the metric to AN adapters, I guess I was running a -8 drain as well. No problemo...
I seem to recall reading your (Gizmoman) problems with a leaky, new turbo. That'll make you pull your hair out for sure. I was chasing oil spotting on the tailgate for a few years until I realized the OEM plastic oil filler tube was cracked and spitting at speed. Replacing the tube with a simple alloy cover seemed to solve a problem that I was blaming on bad turbo seals.
Chris
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#5
by
williamtaygan
on 19 Jun, 2013 14:29
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Yes, 91 Jetta ecodiesel manifold. I'm especially curious if the 3/8 npt x 1/2 hose 45 will leave me enough room to keep the wastegate clocked so the hard line is in the stock position. It's hard to find fittings locally, and the one I ordered has a what appears to be a smaller than usual opening on the 3/8 npt side.
Thanks, Will.
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#6
by
Gizmoman
on 19 Jun, 2013 17:01
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Here's a fitting (aint local but it's cheap)
http://www.amazonsupply.com/dp/B006PKLGZC/ref=sp_dp_g2c_asinHere's a photo from the link above. As I mentioned, if you're concerned about the ID, slightly dull the cutting edges of a slightly larger drill bit and open it up some. Brass will grab a sharp drill and cause all kinds of havoc. There's no pressure on the line so if the walls are thinned a bit you'll be fine.
Hey Gizmo, I was curious if the OP had a Jetta manifold, because I was gonna post a photo of my drain with the Quantum/Vanagon turbo exhaust which leaves even less room for the downhill run, but then that wouldn't be all that appropriate if he's running a different setup.
Anyway... looking back through the metric to AN adapters, I guess I was running a -8 drain as well. No problemo...
I seem to recall reading your (Gizmoman) problems with a leaky, new turbo. That'll make you pull your hair out for sure. I was chasing oil spotting on the tailgate for a few years until I realized the OEM plastic oil filler tube was cracked and spitting at speed. Replacing the tube with a simple alloy cover seemed to solve a problem that I was blaming on bad turbo seals.
Chris
My turbo wasn't new - I think it was another post. It did produce an oil film in the bay and I have since rebuilt it. I do think that having it clocked correctly will help, but only time will tell as It's not running yet.
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#7
by
williamtaygan
on 22 Jun, 2013 21:53
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Gizmo, any tricks to removing the intake side of the turbo like it shows in your picture? My welding buddy cut and TIG welded the stock pipe at an angle, but I need to remove the intake side of the turbo to screw it in. I figure I can try this first, and still tap if I need to later. Maybe not the easiest, but I'm a bit worried about getting the tap in deep enough around this tab I see at the bottom of the threads. By the way, that is that little metal tab, anyway?
Thanks, everyone! Will.
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#8
by
Gizmoman
on 22 Jun, 2013 22:49
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Gizmo, any tricks to removing the intake side of the turbo like it shows in your picture? My welding buddy cut and TIG welded the stock pipe at an angle, but I need to remove the intake side of the turbo to screw it in. I figure I can try this first, and still tap if I need to later. Maybe not the easiest, but I'm a bit worried about getting the tap in deep enough around this tab I see at the bottom of the threads. By the way, that is that little metal tab, anyway?
Thanks, everyone! Will.
Will,
Not sure which picture your referring to.
I took the turbo entirely apart during a rebuild. I believe that tang you're seeing is a plate that diverts the oil to the dump port. I wouldn't tap it while it's still together as you'll end up with metal shavings inside - not good.
It should all come apart once you get all the bolts out and the clamp plates. It may take some raps with a hammer but be smart and don't smack it too hard. I think the casting is chrome steel and could crack.
libby really is the expert on clocking - he's done several while I've only done one (twice
)