-
Oil pressure on Rebuilt AAZ
by
TonyTDTruck
on 10 May, 2012 17:17
-
I just got to the point of adding oil to my rebuilt engine. What I have done in the past is run the auxiliary shaft that turns the oil pump and vaccum pump to prime the engine with oil before starting. I have never done this to a diesel engine but I didn't expect too much of a difference. The turbo cold outlet is pointing to the floor and I noticed a couple of oil drops coming out of the cold side exhaust. And I don't see the oil pressure out at the cam like I expect. Usually I see oil dripping from below the cam, but this time its minimal.
The head is new and the turbo has been rebuilt.
Any thoughts or am I just paranoid?
Thanks
-
#1
by
R.O.R-2.0
on 10 May, 2012 17:20
-
I just got to the point of adding oil to my rebuilt engine. What I have done in the past is run the auxiliary shaft that turns the oil pump and vaccum pump to prime the engine with oil before starting. I have never done this to a diesel engine but I didn't expect too much of a difference. The turbo cold outlet is pointing to the floor and I noticed a couple of oil drops coming out of the cold side exhaust. And I don't see the oil pressure out at the cam like I expect. Usually I see oil dripping from below the cam, but this time its minimal.
The head is new and the turbo has been rebuilt.
Any thoughts or am I just paranoid?
Thanks
oil SHOULD NOT BE DRIPPING FROM YOUR TURBO..
and it should be HEAVILY FLOWING around the cam and lifters.. like LOTS of oil, inside the head.
-
#2
by
TonyTDTruck
on 10 May, 2012 19:21
-
Ok, I pulled the cam and ran the hand drill to run the pump and HOLY SMOKE! It squirted just like a teenage boy in a bathroom at a girls pajama night.
I figured it's do to the new head and cam not letting oil get by like a worn out unit.
Big relief there, but the turbo has to go back. What a pain in the ass. Better now than down the road I suppose.
Thanks r.o.r.-2.0
-
#3
by
Syncroincity
on 10 May, 2012 19:37
-
Is your turbo drain pointing more or less downward? If it's off kilter too much oil will pool up and leak out the seal. You may just have to clock it a little.
-
#4
by
TonyTDTruck
on 10 May, 2012 19:40
-
I thought about that in a way. I can't clock it because the oil return line wont let it. How about the turbine spinning and centering the shaft? And with lots of air pressure on that side, maybe it would leak less. Has anybody ran oil pressure in a turbo not spinning? Huh. I wonder.
-
#5
by
libbydiesel
on 10 May, 2012 22:29
-
Yes, you can clock it. I've clocked ALL of them for install in a vanagon.
-
#6
by
TonyTDTruck
on 10 May, 2012 23:35
-
Yes, you can clock it. I've clocked ALL of them for install in a vanagon.
How do I clock it? This motor sits at 50 deg and the oil inlet is at the top near the turbo housing. The oil return, is almost horizontal. The K14 that came stock with this motor has a hard line going from the waste gate to the cold side of the turbo not allowing the cold side housing to move. The center part of the turbo with the oil lines can move around 360deg, but the oil lines don't allow it to move too much. Maybe I'm missing something.
-
#7
by
TonyTDTruck
on 11 May, 2012 08:13
-
I just got off the phone with the turbo re-builder guy and he said that the turbo needs to be turning. There are scraper seals that help push the oil back in. When they test the turbos they do it with power and check for leaks as well. Glad to hear that. If he is wrong, I will find out the hard way.
Just another figure it out the hard way situation. Something to remember next time.
Thanks for the input.
-
#8
by
libbydiesel
on 11 May, 2012 10:48
-
Yes, you can clock it. I've clocked ALL of them for install in a vanagon.
How do I clock it? This motor sits at 50 deg and the oil inlet is at the top near the turbo housing. The oil return, is almost horizontal. The K14 that came stock with this motor has a hard line going from the waste gate to the cold side of the turbo not allowing the cold side housing to move. The center part of the turbo with the oil lines can move around 360deg, but the oil lines don't allow it to move too much. Maybe I'm missing something.
I'm familiar with the K14 installed in the vanagon @ 50°. I've installed several. Previously I have tapped the drain to NPT and added an elbow. Doing so prior to turbo dis-assembly is best, but having it angled down and using a heavily greased tap is also doable. The other option I have been toying with is using a banjo fitting but have not done it that way yet and am not sure if there is enough space between the wastegate and the center cartridge to fit the banjo bolt/fitting. The threaded oil return pipe is m16x1.5 and many VW power steering pumps (quantum/vanagon) use a banjo fitting that is that thread. To gain clearance I have been thinking that it might be necessary to machine the two sides of the banjo and the head of the banjo bolt. As far as the line to the wastegate line is concerned, there it has nothing to do with the orientation of the center cartridge. It just establishes the relationship between the turbine housing and the compressor scroll. Regardless, I have clocked the intake scroll and to do so previously I have cut the metal line and added a piece of flexible hose. That is also highly convenient (and necessary) if adding an MBC to increase boost above the 10 psi stock pressure. The k14 wastegate "adjustment" screw really is fairly useless as it only has a psi or so of adjustment before it starts limiting the motion of the valve I have re-bent the oil supply line to fit easily enough and have also made custom lines before. Regardless, none of the things you've mentioned came anywhere near being deal-breakers. There are certainly other aspects of the swap that are similarly or more challenging. Without clocking the turbo properly you WILL leak some oil from the shaft seals and risk coking the turbo bearing due to the puddle of oil that is always sitting in the center cartridge.
-
#9
by
TonyTDTruck
on 11 May, 2012 11:01
-
Li bbeyI think I see what you mean. At 50deg, the oil return line should be pointing down and not towards the oil pan at horizontal? That would put the inlet side of the oil port closer to the turbo housing. The only thing I would need is a longer drain line I can have made locally.
Here is a picture showing it at 50deg more or less.
-
#10
by
libbydiesel
on 11 May, 2012 11:10
-
Yeah, that will leak like that for sure. Supply should be @ 12:00 or within 15° MAXIMUM. Drain should be @ 6:00. Get rid of that pipe at the turbo and get an elbow that is m16x1.5 to go to your braided line.
-
#11
by
TonyTDTruck
on 11 May, 2012 11:56
-
Yeah, that will leak like that for sure. Supply should be @ 12:00 or within 15° MAXIMUM. Drain should be @ 6:00. Get rid of that pipe at the turbo and get an elbow that is m16x1.5 to go to your braided line.
Super thanks Libby.
-
#12
by
TonyTDTruck
on 11 May, 2012 16:23
-
Libbey, I went back to the pipe and hose store A1 Coupling here in Tualatin Oregon, and got a longer hose and a 90 and 45deg fittings. At 90 the inlet oil line gets buried under the exhaust and it's difficult to get to. With the 45 I can still access the fitting. But it still puts the inlet next to the exhaust and turbo. Will the heat affect the oil trying to get in?
I know that fuel will vaporize but not sure what oil will do with so much heat. I am thinking of a heat shield.
Thanks
-
#13
by
libbydiesel
on 11 May, 2012 19:56
-
I know it stinks to make something more than once (or twice) but for the supply at the turbo you could use a banjo fitting like the one you used on the filter flange. Then you'd have plenty of clearance at the exhaust manifold.
-
#14
by
TonyTDTruck
on 11 May, 2012 20:48
-
