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Massive Oil Leak
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 17:41
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So I jump in the car to go for a ride to get it hot and then bring it home to chane the oil. I went longer than necessary because there is a trailer for sale a few towns over that I wanted to check out. When I got to the trailer I noticed I had to press unusually hard to stop and noticed a little bit of an oil smell. I stopped on the street infront of the yard where the trailer is and left it running. After about 5 minutes I am walking back to the car and notice a large black puddle under the passenger side of the motor. I quickly shut it off and popped the hood. Oil all over the pass side of the engine getting slung everywhere from the belts. I checked the dipstick and it was dry. Fortunately, I carry a gallon of Rotella with me, so I pour the entire gallon in and it only came 3/4 up the stick. I started it back up and got it home. Just as I was pulling in the driveway did the low light start to flash, it was about a 5 - 8 mile ride home.
I pulled it into the barn and shoved a pan under it and some absorbant material under the rest of the pass side of the car which is dripping oil. I only pulled the top timing belt cover and the cam seal and head look good. Tommorow I plan to really dig into it. I have been looking in the Bentley for where there is high pressure. I can't imagine losing that much oil that fast if it wasn't a pressurised area that developed the leak. It looks like the intermediate shaft has pressurized oil just behind its seal. I would think the bearing on the crank is far enough away from the crank seal to be pressurized, but I don't know.
The only other thing I can think of is that the block cracked on that side of the motor, but I really don't want to think about that and kind of find it hard to believe that the block would just crack.
Any words of wisdom on this matter would really be appreciated.
Thanks
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#1
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 18:12
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This is on my 1.6L N/A in my 1991 Jetta, stock motor.
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#2
by
theman53
on 13 Feb, 2010 18:24
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I would check for a broken gasket. Maybe the oil pan gasket is fighting you or if it was on the hill running the valve cover gasket fought me a lot on my old N/A. While driving it could fly out of the valve cover gasket too. Just guesses, but I bet it is something like that...or a hole in the oil pan. I have had oil pans rust and get real thin one little rock and then you have a nice little hole.
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#3
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 18:40
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I checked the back of the valve cover when I got home and its dry. I would thing the leak has to be above the oil pan because it was getting slung all over by the belts, there is oil on the back side of the pass side headlight!
2 years ago or so, I removed and reinstalled the head. While the T-belt was off I replaced the intermediate and crank seals. I remember that I pulled the crank seal carrier when I changed out the seal and it wasn't real easy to reinstall it, I didn't drop the oil pan when I did this, so that might have been why it wasn't easy. I have been driving it for 2 years and about 20,000 miles since, so I figured it was good.
I have never experienced a leak like this before, the amount and quantity in the amount of time that past really makes me think the leak is on a pressurized area, but I don't really know...
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#4
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 19:31
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Whats an oil galley plug and how can it cause this?
I didn't really want to drive it home leaking oil like it was, but my options were limited. I figured if the light didn't come on and everything was operating normally, I was OK. After I get the leak fixed, I guess I find out if anything got damaged...
Thanks for your reply
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#5
by
truckinwagen
on 13 Feb, 2010 19:37
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the oil galleys are drilled into the block after it is cast, and then plugged with a small plug, much like a freeze plug.
I suppose it is possible that one of them failed, but I would expect a cracked block to go along with it(have ever seen one fail on its own)
clean the engine really good, and see if there are any unplugged holes on the end of the block.
also, clean and degrease the motor really good, start it, and look to see where the oil starts coming from.
I'll bet it is the intermediate shaft, the bearing can fail and dump lots of oil into the seal, making it leak like mad.
-Owen
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#6
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 19:45
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the oil galleys are drilled into the block after it is cast, and then plugged with a small plug, much like a freeze plug.
I suppose it is possible that one of them failed, but I would expect a cracked block to go along with it(have ever seen one fail on its own)
clean the engine really good, and see if there are any unplugged holes on the end of the block.
also, clean and degrease the motor really good, start it, and look to see where the oil starts coming from.
I'll bet it is the intermediate shaft, the bearing can fail and dump lots of oil into the seal, making it leak like mad.
-Owen
If the IM bearing failed, does the motor need to be pulled to change it?
Thanks
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#7
by
SolarSteve
on 13 Feb, 2010 19:52
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OK, well I was able to get it home while it was still running, so hopefully I will be OK there. I'm going to get started on it in the morning, maybe I'll get luck and find a missing/loose plug. Does anyone sell these plugs? I am going to check GAP now.
Thank you all very much for the help.
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#8
by
truckinwagen
on 13 Feb, 2010 19:52
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If the IM bearing failed, does the motor need to be pulled to change it?
Thanks
it might, depends if there is enough room to pull the IM shaft out.
you will definitely have to pull a motor mount or two and tilt the motor quite a bit to get it out, if at all.
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#9
by
8v-of-fury
on 13 Feb, 2010 20:15
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I don't think you got low enough on oil to damage anything really... if you poured a liter in and it brought you to three quarters of the cross hatch.. then you were only a 1/4 liter of oil under the accepted area or so. Isn't the cross hatch in these engines only a liter or liter and a half? either way.. it was still getting oil up top or that buzzer would have come on much sooner..
I just fixed a leaking oil pressure sender on my 1.7 gasser, and the small drip every two seconds was enough to take out 3/4 of a liter over a 110km trip.. so its only a bit bigger then that..I'd say
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#10
by
mystery3
on 13 Feb, 2010 21:55
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I don't think you got low enough on oil to damage anything really... if you poured a liter in and it brought you to three quarters of the cross hatch.. then you were only a 1/4 liter of oil under the accepted area or so. Isn't the cross hatch in these engines only a liter or liter and a half? either way.. it was still getting oil up top or that buzzer would have come on much sooner..
I just fixed a leaking oil pressure sender on my 1.7 gasser, and the small drip every two seconds was enough to take out 3/4 of a liter over a 110km trip.. so its only a bit bigger then that..I'd say
I believe he said a gallon of oil so 3.78L IIRC. Sounds like a lot, I hope your motor is ok! If it wasn't making any odd noises it probably is.
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#11
by
rabbitman
on 14 Feb, 2010 01:40
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It seems to me that if a galley plug came out it would empty the pan REALLY fast. I'd guess the IM or crank seal popped out.
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#12
by
rs899
on 14 Feb, 2010 04:29
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If the IM bearing failed, does the motor need to be pulled to change it?
it might, depends if there is enough room to pull the IM shaft out.
you will definitely have to pull a motor mount or two and tilt the motor quite a bit to get it out, if at all.
I replaced the outer intermediate shaft bearing on mine a few months ago. You need to remove the rear mount and drop the front subframe. The shaft can be pulled through the wheel well. It's tedious...
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#13
by
SolarSteve
on 14 Feb, 2010 06:36
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Yeah, I added a gallon to get it to 3/4 up the crosshatching on the dipstick... I didn't hear any strange noises from the engine so hopefully I'll be ok there.
I just got the fire lit in the woodstove out in my barn about 30 minutes ago and in another 30 I'll be out there taking things apart. I'll report back as soon as I find something.
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#14
by
8v-of-fury
on 14 Feb, 2010 07:49
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I believe he said a gallon of oil so 3.78L IIRC. Sounds like a lot, I hope your motor is ok! If it wasn't making any odd noises it probably is.
Sorry, I'm Canadian
A GALLON. oh man.. that's 3/4 of a liter away from empty.. you say oil light came on just as you hit the driveway.. if it only got down to 7psi at the head when you were already in the driveway.. it shows you had oil pressure the whole ride.. i assume it is fine