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95 Jetta 1.9TD --- Just changed injectors, now smoldering
by
kwalsh24
on 29 Jun, 2008 00:48
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I just changed the injectors in my 95 Jetta 1.9TD, I put new complete injectors along with new heat rings in and everything and the car is just smoldering black smoke and wont clear up, the car is running rather poorly and has no power and sometimes wont idle.... I followed everything by the books, the only thing I can think of is that i somehow crossed a fuel pump feed line to one or more of the injectors. I know this sounds stupid, but my repair manual doesnt show a layout of the fuel lines to injectors like it does for the gas engines, Can someone help me out with the mapping of the fuel line from pump to injector so I can get my car running right again (I hope)?
I even put the old injectors in to see if it was the new injectors at fault and no, the car ran just as bad.... The car ran perfectly fine before i swapped out the injectors, the only reason why I am installing new ones is because the injectors I am replacing have well over 400k on them and I wanted to see if installing new injectors would improve fuel millage any.... Was averaging around 700k per tank....
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#1
by
burn_your_money
on 29 Jun, 2008 09:13
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you should add your location to your profile so we know where you are.
The hard metal fuel lines are the fuel in, the soft cloth lines are return. As long as you have all the injectors hooked up in series with the cloth lines and one end capped off and the other end going to the OUT fitting on the pump you should be alright.
Is the car running rough? did you make sure not to get any crap in the injectors, the lines, and the engine? Torqued everything properly?
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#2
by
kwalsh24
on 29 Jun, 2008 10:34
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Yeah I followed the book exactly, I cleaned around the injectors before I removed the originals, I kept the plastic caps on the new ones untill I was ready to install the lines, the rubber lines are all on one feeding the other and the one on the end near the belts is capped off the other is feeding the return...
I'm located in London....
The car hardly starts and when it does its down in power, black smoke constantly out of the rear and doesnt clear up
I even put in the old injectors that the car was running fine on and its no better....
I just would like to see a photo of someones engine with the fuel lines so i can see how they are hooked up compared to mine...
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#3
by
Op-Ivy
on 29 Jun, 2008 10:45
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#4
by
Vincent Waldon
on 29 Jun, 2008 11:42
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In this case perhaps some words are worth 1000 pictures ?? Well, maybe not 1000. :wink:
Cylinder #1 (passenger side) feeds from the IP port at 2 o'clock
Cylinder #2 feeds from the IP port at 4 o'clock
Cylinder #3 feeds from the IP port at 10 o'clock
Cylinder #4 feeds from the IP port at 8 o'clock
making the firing order the good old VW 1-3-4-2, since the pump is rotating counterclockwise when viewed from the IP ports.
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#5
by
jtanguay
on 29 Jun, 2008 13:11
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any air in the lines??? could just be coincidental that some of your lines are now leaking...
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#6
by
kwalsh24
on 29 Jun, 2008 14:14
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Hey guys, thanks for your help
My lines were all separate not joined. I ended up mixing up the lines coming from the pump to the injectors, the front lines were on the back the back on the front.... the car runs again!
Now the only thing I notice now is that if I like punch the throttle, there is black smoke.... is this normal? other than that at idle or at a steady rpm there is no smoke....
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#7
by
Vincent Waldon
on 29 Jun, 2008 15:32
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This is with the new nozzles installed ?? New heat shields again ??
Many would say that if you don't get a bit of black smoke at WOT you're not trying hard enough. Billowing black clouds: bad. Some black wisps: probably OK in moderation, although it means your EGTs are climbing.
BTW, the injector lines are supposed to come with a bunch of rubber-lined clamps that:
(a) hold them into the right order so you don't mix 'em up :wink:
but most importantly
(b) damp the vibrations from the engine and the injection pressures themselves so that they don't fracture over time.
The lines are hardened steel and are surprisingly brittle. Assuming that you plan to keep this car for a while it might be worth keeping your eyes open for a set of clamps... doubt they're a dealer part but depending on your location you might find them at a junkyard one fine day.
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#8
by
kwalsh24
on 29 Jun, 2008 15:44
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Well its not a whisp i dont think, its more bwllowing but I will check again, I will keep my eye open for a few clamps, but they may not fit now that the lines have been bent slightly?
I have the new seals in and injectors.... yes... the car is alive again with the new parts...
How can i cure the black billowing and the climbing EGTs? Like i just ahve the car in my garage., and I am under the hoot and "punching" the cable and i see black smoking coming from the rear of the car... I think its a long puff nothing constant but i will double check...
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#9
by
Vincent Waldon
on 29 Jun, 2008 16:29
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To be rigorous in your troubleshooting the next step would likely be to put the old injectors back in (now that you have the plumbing straightened out) and see if the smoke goes away... if so you've pretty much proved where the issue lies.
Then we're back to our conversation on Vortex "you got these from
http://www.volkswaparts.com who sells non-OEM parts including injectors with Mercs nozzles... are these the right injectors and/or are they working correctly ?"
You should not have to make any adjustments to the car when renewing the injectors.... period !
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#10
by
kwalsh24
on 29 Jun, 2008 18:25
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The only thing that the car did differently was that on warm idle it was at 1200rpm compared to 1000rpm the car was at prior, so i adjusted that down with the screw stop on the throttle so the car idled back down at 1000rpm (thats as lkow as i can get the car to go) I took the car for a test drive and i felt power increase over the old injectors, now that could just be from the old ones having miles on them and these new ones being new aren't worn... I however read the old injectors and the are 150bar and the new ones are 155bar... Now seeing how I am not sure what these number really mean, like I think its the pressure it takes to have the injector pop(?) with the 5bar difference in the two shouldnt cause and real big issues would it?
If its these damn replacement injectors I bought, I am going to return them, but where can i go to buy new ones? Minus the dealer that is, i dont feel like getting it up the bum from them lol Or can i send my old injectors somewhere to have them rebuilt?
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#11
by
kwalsh24
on 30 Jun, 2008 05:10
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okay so i was driving home from work this am and i noticed the black smoke, so i drove the car a little harer and sure enough it was bellowing black... So I changed out the injectors put my old ones back in.... I think I am going to send these ones back and seek others... Or a rebuild...
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#12
by
bluemotion
on 01 Jul, 2008 20:42
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The strange thing is that your pump is still putting out the same amount of fuel, and you are getting more power with the new injectors, and some extra unburned fuel as well! Are you still getting smoke with the pump turned down? Are you smoking when you aren't flooring the car? Is your mileage down or the same?
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#13
by
kwalsh24
on 02 Jul, 2008 15:02
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this is with the car stock, I havent adjust anything other than the idle.... Now with the original injectors in i dont smoke, with these aftermarket ones I do smoke heavily under acceleration and I think i smoke a little at speed im not sure tho.... I dont know how to turn the pump down or where to run it at a safe rate so i havent even touched it....
The issue I am now having with the car back to stock with the old injectors is that the car is hard starting and smokes a little at the initial start up... maybe a little black puff and thats it but thats probably due to the car not starting and flooding itself... it didnt do this before i started all this, i think it could be the return lines getting air in them somehow?