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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 10, 2012, 04:06:06 pm

Title: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 10, 2012, 04:06:06 pm
I've replaced all the leaky seals in the ACN tranny that I bought recently so it's almost ready to be swapped out the AVX in my 92 Ecodiesel. No lift access. Will ramps work or will I need to turn the wheels during tranny removal? I have an engine support bar, the kind that rests on the fender. Any tips and tricks? Will try to do the swap in the next week or 2.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 10, 2012, 04:14:50 pm
put it up on ramps. you can do most of the work from above, if you are BIG enough..

like was mentioned, its very easy to leave the trans attached by an upper bell bolt, then come in from under the hood, take out the bolt, slide the trans off the engine, and lower it to the ground, thru the engine bay..

you can support the engine with a jack under the drivers side of the oil pan, or with your engine support bar. ive always used a jack.

if at all possible, leave the rear ENGINE mount attached.. then the engine will be supported by something, rather than just hanging there..

be ready to twist/turn the trans to get it off of, and back on to the engine..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 10, 2012, 04:20:20 pm
Do I just take off the 6 XZN axle bolts off both flanges? Axles do not need to be pulled is that right? They won't get in the way?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 10, 2012, 08:01:18 pm
i pull the axles... at min the drivers side... ball joint has to come apart for that on a mk2... next.. on pass side the axle flange needs removed to get it out with ease... if 90mm... if 100mm has to come off no matter what...

so ramps no working to remove drivers axel..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: bbob203 on May 10, 2012, 08:12:43 pm
when i pulled an engine on a 91 few weeks ago all i had to do trans wise was remove mount brackets and the axle flange bolts.i pushed the axles out the way once loose
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: billybobf on May 10, 2012, 08:28:41 pm
weird, we just changed a cv on an mk2 but I guess we lowered the tire, but didnt touch the ball joint.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 11, 2012, 06:48:11 am
So which is it???  One says to use ramps, other says ramps won't work.

Don't forget, I am pulling the tranny only! Not engine and tranny together.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rs899 on May 11, 2012, 07:23:12 am
When I did mine, I think I left the axles on at the hubs.  The big problem was clearancing that blasted bump on the driver's side, rear of the subframe.  I removed the front subframe beam ( the bit that the front motor mount goes on).  You will need to twist the engine so that it points a bit toward the front driver's corner to get the tranny past the subframe protrusion.

I found the MKII nastier than the MkI to do this....
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 11, 2012, 08:21:43 am
you dont have to trust/belive me... ive only been doing clutches on vws since i was 10.... just rember 1 thing... 2 items cannot take up the same physical space... if you think the axle will not be in the way for you to slide the tranny off.. go for it.. i prefer ease...

on a mk1 no ball joint issue.. mk2.. it sometimes possible.. but again.. 1 pinchbolt = ease.. why fight it... jackstand.. out of way.. ramp.. i find to be in way..

long ago.. till 100mm joints you actually loosened up and dropped subframe... so you could twist the tranny to clear the flywheel with 90mm joint cup still on tranny... when 100mm came about and does not clear flywheel figured out removing the tranny cup eliminated that.. why i suggest removing the pass side cv cup off tranny... slide out and off the clutch and off it comes with ease..

so do as you wish.. rember my tips as well you can "still do them" once stuck beating your head on the wall... takes me 3-4hr for r&r and clutch job with seals on a mk2... thats with pulling both axles, the drive cup on jack stands with support bar for engine..

also another reason ramps= fail.... xzn bolts on axles... really want to turn the wheel so you can get to all the bolts with ease...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: bbob203 on May 11, 2012, 09:00:56 am
in my opinion ramps are a pain inless all your doing is an oil change. just use jackstands you lose no advantage by using them ramps you might regret not being able to spin wheels.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: billybobf on May 11, 2012, 10:31:44 am
I must comment again,

 GO WITH STANDS IF YOU CAN ;) I was using stands so I shouldnt have commented that I "thought" ramps would be good.  ALSO, if I could go back and do it again, I didnt need to pull the pinch bolt to change the CV axle, but I wish I would have! and I wish I had some anti seize to put on it. I tried to pull it, it didnt come, so I left it together and just pulled the shaft. on something like that, if youve got time, space and tools, doesnt hurt to make it more likely to come apart when you NEED it to.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 11, 2012, 12:44:49 pm
So which is it???  One says to use ramps, other says ramps won't work.

Don't forget, I am pulling the tranny only! Not engine and tranny together.

i leave the axles there, just un-bolt the drive flanges, and hang the axles from some bailing wire..

and do it on ramps..

if you take the axles out, or remove the pinch bolts, then its easier to do it on stands..

use your support bar, hook it to the DRIVERS SIDE of the head only.

and remove the front engine, and rear trans mount, and lower the engine/trans down a bit..

remove trans...


there were a few parts left out, but they will become real apparent once you get in there..

its a VERY simple job..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rodpaslow on May 11, 2012, 02:00:22 pm
92 Jetta, I don't know if you have 90mm or 100mm, I've taken out 90mm without removing the flange from the tranny (pass side).  If it's 100mm it needs to be removed to get it out.  You may be able to support it just off the ground after the axles have dropped away.  You can use a jack if you have one to pull the ball joints, get the cv out of the way and then stick it back on the ramp after the ball joint is bolted back in place.  It's not real good for the wheel bearings, as long as it's not moved it should be okay.  Plan on 2 litres of tranny oil req'd.

I agree with the jack-stands.  Makes the job a 4 hr one, not an all weekend job.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: fatmobile on May 11, 2012, 10:46:18 pm
Drain it first, especially if you are going to pull a flange.
 and x2 on the need to lower that end of the engine before you can pull trany past the wheel well.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 12, 2012, 11:07:19 am

i leave the axles there, just un-bolt the drive flanges, and hang the axles from some bailing wire..

and do it on ramps..

if you take the axles out, or remove the pinch bolts, then its easier to do it on stands..

use your support bar, hook it to the DRIVERS SIDE of the head only.

and remove the front engine, and rear trans mount, and lower the engine/trans down a bit..

remove trans...


there were a few parts left out, but they will become real apparent once you get in there..

its a VERY simple job..

With wheels on ramps, how do I get the flange XZN bolts out? When I pulled the passenger axle to drill the exh manifold for an EGT probe, the only way to get those bolts (with good access) was to do each at 6 o'clock meaning I had to turn the wheel 6 times.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 12, 2012, 11:08:57 am

i leave the axles there, just un-bolt the drive flanges, and hang the axles from some bailing wire..

and do it on ramps..

if you take the axles out, or remove the pinch bolts, then its easier to do it on stands..

use your support bar, hook it to the DRIVERS SIDE of the head only.

and remove the front engine, and rear trans mount, and lower the engine/trans down a bit..

remove trans...


there were a few parts left out, but they will become real apparent once you get in there..

its a VERY simple job..

With wheels on ramps, how do I get the flange XZN bolts out? When I pulled the passenger axle to drill the exh manifold for an EGT probe, the only way to get those bolts (with good access) was to do each at 6 o'clock meaning I had to turn the wheel 6 times.

come to think of it, i must have done it on stands..

because i turn the wheels to get the flange bolts out too...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 14, 2012, 08:41:31 am

come to think of it, i must have done it on ramps..

because i turn the wheels to get the flange bolts out too...

Did you mean to say: "I must have done it on jack stands" ?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 14, 2012, 09:50:20 pm
yes..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 15, 2012, 09:36:26 am
i pull the axles... at min the drivers side... ball joint has to come apart for that on a mk2... next.. on pass side the axle flange needs removed to get it out with ease... if 90mm... if 100mm has to come off no matter what...

so ramps no working to remove drivers axel..

I've got only the driver's side on a jack stand, XZN bolts loosened and need to take the ball joint pinch bolt out and hopefully that will give room for the axle to swing out out of the way.

You said: "pass side the axle flange needs removed to get it out with ease.". Did you mean I have to pull the flange off of the tranny? Doing so would require destroying the flange center cap seal and a special puller is also needed to pull the flange. Please clarify if that is what you meant and why it is necessary.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 15, 2012, 11:05:20 am
i pull the axles... at min the drivers side... ball joint has to come apart for that on a mk2... next.. on pass side the axle flange needs removed to get it out with ease... if 90mm... if 100mm has to come off no matter what...

so ramps no working to remove drivers axel..

I've got only the driver's side on a jack stand, XZN bolts loosened and need to take the ball joint pinch bolt out and hopefully that will give room for the axle to swing out out of the way.

You said: "pass side the axle flange needs removed to get it out with ease.". Did you mean I have to pull the flange off of the tranny? Doing so would require destroying the flange center cap seal and a special puller is also needed to pull the flange. Please clarify if that is what you meant and why it is necessary.

ive NEVER removed a drive flange to remove a trans..

if you twist it just right, it comes right out.. whole trans, no disassembly required..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: damac on May 16, 2012, 12:25:34 am
on my 85 jetta i have always left the car on its wheels.

take the little plate off the tranny shield, zip tie and move axles out of the way and leave yhe passenger side mount installed.  then i raise and take off the other mounts and their hardware.

then i can mess with 2 jacks if need be on engine side and tranny side.  you will get a feel for it but basically you are dropping the tranny side down and then spinning housing up to clear the adle flanges.   then support tranny weight on way down as you go to seperate instead of it hanging on shaft.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 16, 2012, 02:11:15 pm
I have most everything disconnected. front engine mount is out. power steering line is in the way of the transmission mount top bolt. I suppose the only way to get that bolt out is to get that power steering line off? what a pita!
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 16, 2012, 06:49:47 pm
just bend line so it out of way....

do you have 90 or 100mm inner joints?? if 100mm the flange HAS to come off.. and no puller required... snap ring pliers to unclip and it pops off... if 90 you can leve it on.. but ill say it again.. makes life so easy as you DO NOT HAVE to twist/dick around...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 16, 2012, 07:35:45 pm
just bend line so it out of way....

do you have 90 or 100mm inner joints?? if 100mm the flange HAS to come off.. and no puller required... snap ring pliers to unclip and it pops off... if 90 you can leve it on.. but ill say it again.. makes life so easy as you DO NOT HAVE to twist/dick around...

That's what I ended up doing, bend the line out of the way, which looked not possible because the ferrule/pipe  is directly over the bolt, preventing access. This was after spending an hour trying (unsuccessfully) to get the pwr steering line off the pinion valve. The 18 mm flare nut wrench was not a tight fit on the flare nut (likely due to rust), had too much play, and couldn't get the nut to break loose.

I have 90 mm axles. Are you saying I should take the flanges off? That means destroying 2 center caps and a special puller. The ACN I'm putting in has new flange center caps, do I destroy those too and pull the flanges off to get the ACN in easier? That's just crazy!
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 16, 2012, 08:37:36 pm
only the pass side flange... drivers is not a issue.. and it is for "ease" so up to you... me.. id pull it... ive done it both ways... i prefer ease.. no silly twisting and such to get it on/off engine/flywheel... worth buyin a new cap.. till you do a 100mm set up with flange off.. you will never see how easy life is...

again.. if you try with it on, get stuck, pissed off so on.. you can slide tranny back on, add a bolt.. pull flange and try again..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CrazyAndy on May 16, 2012, 09:30:36 pm
I'm going with CRS on this one.  I've had to to the trans rotation all the while maneuvering it from under the car.  Rotating AND bench pressing a trans?  Should have cataloged all the new swear words I invented; might have made me public enemy #1 of Websters New College English Dictionary.  ;D
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 16, 2012, 10:08:46 pm
I don't have new center caps. new caps at least 4 days away and I need the car this weekend so I'm going to have to do it the hard way.

 do I slide the transmission input shaft completely off the engine first before rotating?   how much rotation?

 I want to use two winches  to do the holding of the transmission and rotation. is that doable?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: smutts on May 17, 2012, 03:09:10 am
If you do need to undo those triple square bolts, use a small screwdriver to dig out the congealed gunk in the bolt heads, then gently tap the tool in with a hammer to fully seat it. This prevents LOTS of swearing if otherwise  the wretched things strip. I am a hater of those things. Ditto if you are doing the cylinder head, get a syringe to suck out that pool of oil in the headbolt, or roll the car onto its roof for a few seconds. ::)
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 17, 2012, 03:16:04 am
there is only 1 sweet spot it comes off.... and it is a twist, slide main off clutch same time, then tilt nose cone of tranny towards say drivers seat too.... the issue is the flange clearing the flywheel... back in 75-77ish they had a cut out on the flywheel to clear the flange.. then eliminated that...

i too bench press method.. i see no way with 2 wenches with flange on it... you have to hit the sweet spot just right.. its a "feel" thing..

old tranny = who cares if you pull the flange... aka one your taking out... problem is you reinsalled the flange on new one too quick after doing its seals... you did put in new drive flange seals i hope... if not.. do them... your asking for problems if not..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rs899 on May 17, 2012, 06:14:56 am
Every night , I kneel down and pray that my clutch has a long and useful life.  This is such a royal pain on the MkII.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 17, 2012, 11:17:29 am
only the pass side flange... drivers is not a issue.. and it is for "ease" so up to you... me.. id pull it... ive done it both ways... i prefer ease.. no silly twisting and such to get it on/off engine/flywheel... worth buyin a new cap.. till you do a 100mm set up with flange off.. you will never see how easy life is...

again.. if you try with it on, get stuck, pissed off so on.. you can slide tranny back on, add a bolt.. pull flange and try again..
[/quote

I am confused as hell. You say only remove the passenger side flange? In your post below, you say the problem is the flange clearing the flywheel? However, the flywheel is on the drivers side, so shouldn't the driver's flange be removed and not the passenger's flange?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rodpaslow on May 17, 2012, 11:31:24 am
The passenger flange is the problem because it doesn't clear the bottom part of the block.  There is a bolt that holds the tranny on (near the flange) and the block has a fairly heavy/ thick area there that the flange doesn't clear easily unless your the 'Hulk'.  It's much easier to remove the flange - it's only one circlip and it usually taps out easily after the clip is off.  Drivers side theirs nothing close to it, so it can stay on without causing any problems.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 17, 2012, 11:48:10 am
  If I remove the passenger flange will the transmission drop straight down without rotation? I am no hulk and don't want to bench press it out. I want to lower it with a winch. will that work?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: nathan_b on May 17, 2012, 12:21:53 pm
  If I remove the passenger flange will the transmission drop straight down without rotation? I am no hulk and don't want to bench press it out. I want to lower it with a winch. will that work?

it is up to you if it works or not ;)
probably will.

Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 17, 2012, 12:35:41 pm
think of passengers side flange.... behind engine block.... flywheel between the block and tranny... and its not the block that holds you up its the flywheel.... look at how the flange covers over the opening of the bell housing (look at one you puttin in)... flywheel pretty much fills that hole... you have to tip *** to clear..

with flange off you slide to drivers side... then down... does not fall straight down as shaft in clutch...

taking drivers flange off no help at all... not even close to flywheel... unless you got right hand drive...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 17, 2012, 01:27:09 pm
Every night , I kneel down and pray that my clutch has a long and useful life.  This is such a royal pain on the MkII.

pfft.. mk2 is easier than mk1. and WAY easier than mk3..

but then again, ive been under the hood of a mk2 a time or 400..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rodpaslow on May 17, 2012, 01:54:16 pm
I would agree MK2 is easier than MK1,  I've done a few MK3 with 020, I find they are easier than MK2 (golf, Don't know about jetta) because they don't have that stamped steel brace that the MK2 has on the tranny mount.  I have an 02a I want to get redone, then we'll see how it fits in MK3...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 17, 2012, 06:05:47 pm
Well, got the clip off. I took a cheapo pair of c clip pliers I have with round sides and shaped it with a file to flat sides with a sharp edge for better grip. The metal was not very hard so it slipped a bunch of times before i got it to bite and got it off. The flange didn't want to come off. I tried prying and hammering on it but it didn't give. Any other ideal? Going to make a puller.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 18, 2012, 11:46:21 am
I would agree MK2 is easier than MK1,  I've done a few MK3 with 020, I find they are easier than MK2 (golf, Don't know about jetta) because they don't have that stamped steel brace that the MK2 has on the tranny mount.  I have an 02a I want to get redone, then we'll see how it fits in MK3...

i take that stamped steel bracket off, throw it as far as i can, and put everything back together.. its not there on the mk3, so it wasnt very important on the mk2s either!
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 19, 2012, 07:16:48 pm
The passenger flange is the problem because it doesn't clear the bottom part of the block.  There is a bolt that holds the tranny on (near the flange) and the block has a fairly heavy/ thick area there that the flange doesn't clear easily unless your the 'Hulk'.  It's much easier to remove the flange - it's only one circlip and it usually taps out easily after the clip is off.  Drivers side theirs nothing close to it, so it can stay on without causing any problems.

Is this (empty block bolt hole, center of pic) where the flange doesn't clear? Flange has been removed in this pic.

(http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x480/Ecodiesel92/IMG_20120519_150134.jpg)

I wish the flange just taps out easily. I made a puller and couldn't get it to budge, I had to heat it a bit with a propane torch then it it finally came off.

(http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x480/Ecodiesel92/IMG_20120518_182618.jpg)

The passenger motor mount untouched, front mount has been removed, top bolt of tranny mount is out. all bolts except one top bolt of tranny has been removed. I need to get the 2 horizontal bolts out but the frame is in the way. The engine is hung from the support bar and if I lower it anymore, it will crush the oil filter (pic), which is almost touching the frame. Do I winch the engine back? Take the oil filter off? Do I need to take the passenger engine mount off?

(http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x480/Ecodiesel92/IMG_20120519_150331.jpg)




Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 19, 2012, 07:21:21 pm
I would agree MK2 is easier than MK1,  I've done a few MK3 with 020, I find they are easier than MK2 (golf, Don't know about jetta) because they don't have that stamped steel brace that the MK2 has on the tranny mount.  I have an 02a I want to get redone, then we'll see how it fits in MK3...

i take that stamped steel bracket off, throw it as far as i can, and put everything back together.. its not there on the mk3, so it wasnt very important on the mk2s either!

Is that what you did to your mk2? So you only have the front and passenger engine mounts and no tranny mount???
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 19, 2012, 07:27:54 pm
the piece of tin wiht a 10mm headed bolt and a 11mm headed bolt between flange area and block has to come off too.... still on in pic you took..

like i said.. the engine block and flange is NOT the issue... the flywheel and flange is...


remove aluminum rear mount.. 3 13mm headed bolts on diff housing area... then tranny drops enough to remove the 17mm bolts that holds the stamped steel one in place..

Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 19, 2012, 07:51:48 pm
Good eyes! I took that small piece of tin off after i took the pics.

I forget who it was but I thought someone says specifically to leave the passenger motor mount on?    
Apparently that no worky?

I want to try to put the ACN in without taking off the flange. I will not have any help. Please give details on how to.

Here's the ACN patiently waiting.

(http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x480/Ecodiesel92/IMG_20120516_171225.jpg)
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 19, 2012, 08:29:52 pm
there is no tell how to... its fight it via tip/tilt till tranny flange clears the flywheel... no hoist/cable gotta be by feel... so benchpress method...

sadly you like to listen to everyone... i know how i do it between 3-4hr with clutch/seals... i keep saying easy best... removing mounts = easy... to leve mounts on... how does it mis the subframe/rear mount?? like one of my inital posts.. 2 things cannot occupy the same place.. the more crap you get out of the way.. the easier it is to remove..

now.. ill be brutal here... put the flange back on if your going to not remove the other one.. there is only 1 way in/out.. to know how to get out.. makes easier to put in.. else you will not know how to tip/tilt/fight it to get it back in... bench pressing out far easier then benchpressing back in..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 19, 2012, 08:49:26 pm
Alright, you've convinced me. I'll order flange seal kits. How do you install the seal and clrclip with tranny in car? What tools do I need to make?

Does the clutch stay on the engine when I pull the tranny? Is it possible to check clutch thickness and condition without removing it?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 19, 2012, 09:29:24 pm
first... gotta say stop smokin pot...

till tranny removed no way to get to clutch to remove bolts to even inspect it... so once its out you can look at it.. will require a 12 point 9mm socket and a vw clutch alignment DISK as its unlike any other car mfg tool

you said you resealed new tranny.... so you did not do flange seals?? if not you wanna do both.. drivers side way easier out of car vs in car.. rear mount lower subframe makes it harder to do in car..

a long bolt that threads into the shaft that holds the cup, a nut that fits said bolt.. ans a simple piece of angle iron can be used.. drill hole in angle iron, run nut to top of bolt.. stuck thru hole into threaded shaft.. run in a good 10 turns.. then using the nut press cup on.. install clip and remove.. sadly i cannot think of thread pitch/size for bolt.. but i think its 10x1.5 and longer is better.. nut takes up the extra length..

make sure to have the clip on the bolt between angle and flange.. its gap is not big enough to put over the bolt once its all in place..

also best part od doing other flange whe outta car.. you get to test this install with lots of room vs in car with stuff in the way..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 19, 2012, 09:50:48 pm
I only replaced seals that leaked, flange seals did not leak. I will replace them since I am getting the kits. Once the flange is pushed in to clear the circlip groove, how do you get the circlip into the groove without screwing it up? What tools do you use?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on May 20, 2012, 04:10:09 am
circlip pliers.....
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 20, 2012, 11:48:39 am
I'll be ordering the flange seal kit from Germanautoparts.com. They can get it to me next day. Are there seal kits ok?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 20, 2012, 12:19:06 pm
This Germanautoparts seal kit looks like it includes the flange seals and caps but no circlips. Shouldn't the circlips be included since they are not to be re-used?

(http://www.germanautoparts.com/images/large/ec2d70fda863f21ace1d9907fb0dec88.jpg)
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 20, 2012, 04:28:26 pm
I would agree MK2 is easier than MK1,  I've done a few MK3 with 020, I find they are easier than MK2 (golf, Don't know about jetta) because they don't have that stamped steel brace that the MK2 has on the tranny mount.  I have an 02a I want to get redone, then we'll see how it fits in MK3...

i take that stamped steel bracket off, throw it as far as i can, and put everything back together.. its not there on the mk3, so it wasnt very important on the mk2s either!

Is that what you did to your mk2? So you only have the front and passenger engine mounts and no tranny mount???

no, the stamped steel piece that connects the 5th gear housing to the trans bracket..

you must use all 3 engine mounts, or else your engine wont be supported in the car.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 20, 2012, 06:06:37 pm

no, the stamped steel piece that connects the 5th gear housing to the trans bracket..

you must use all 3 engine mounts, or else your engine wont be supported in the car.

W/o that stamped steel piece, the transmission is less rigid as a whole. Wouldn't the torque on that single bolt mounting point stress and break that aluminum bracket on the tranny?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 20, 2012, 06:12:26 pm
This Germanautoparts seal kit looks like it includes the flange seals and caps but no circlips. Shouldn't the circlips be included since they are not to be re-used?

(http://www.germanautoparts.com/images/large/ec2d70fda863f21ace1d9907fb0dec88.jpg)

What threw me off was I was looking for 2 circlips. After enlarging the pic, I see one circlip. They must have left one circlip out when the pic was taken.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 21, 2012, 11:56:29 am

no, the stamped steel piece that connects the 5th gear housing to the trans bracket..

you must use all 3 engine mounts, or else your engine wont be supported in the car.

W/o that stamped steel piece, the transmission is less rigid as a whole. Wouldn't the torque on that single bolt mounting point stress and break that aluminum bracket on the tranny?

dude, that stamped steel bracket is made out of POP CANS.. you can FLEX IT BY HAND.. its not very structurally important..

the mk3 never had that piece either, so its not important, in my mind..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on May 21, 2012, 02:07:41 pm

no, the stamped steel piece that connects the 5th gear housing to the trans bracket..

you must use all 3 engine mounts, or else your engine wont be supported in the car.

W/o that stamped steel piece, the transmission is less rigid as a whole. Wouldn't the torque on that single bolt mounting point stress and break that aluminum bracket on the tranny?

dude, that stamped steel bracket is made out of POP CANS.. you can FLEX IT BY HAND.. its not very structurally important..

the mk3 never had that piece either, so its not important, in my mind..

Doesn't the MK3 use a different transmission? Any other opinion on this? I'd love to leave that piece out if it is indeed is not necessary.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on May 21, 2012, 05:04:23 pm

no, the stamped steel piece that connects the 5th gear housing to the trans bracket..

you must use all 3 engine mounts, or else your engine wont be supported in the car.

W/o that stamped steel piece, the transmission is less rigid as a whole. Wouldn't the torque on that single bolt mounting point stress and break that aluminum bracket on the tranny?

dude, that stamped steel bracket is made out of POP CANS.. you can FLEX IT BY HAND.. its not very structurally important..

the mk3 never had that piece either, so its not important, in my mind..

Doesn't the MK3 use a different transmission? Any other opinion on this? I'd love to leave that piece out if it is indeed is not necessary.

mk3 2.0L 4 cylinder used an 020 style trans still..

VR6 & TDI used the 02A...
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: rodpaslow on May 22, 2012, 09:08:39 am
R.O.R. is right 02A is used in MK3 tdi & vr6 - just FYI they are hydraulic not cable operated clutch and cable shift, not linkage like MK1 & 2.  Mk3 020 is same tranny as MK2.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: Jvan_wert on May 26, 2012, 05:18:06 pm
there is only 1 sweet spot it comes off.... and it is a twist, slide main off clutch same time, then tilt nose cone of tranny towards say drivers seat too.... the issue is the flange clearing the flywheel... back in 75-77ish they had a cut out on the flywheel to clear the flange.. then eliminated that...

i too bench press method.. i see no way with 2 wenches with flange on it... you have to hit the sweet spot just right.. its a "feel" thing..

old tranny = who cares if you pull the flange... aka one your taking out... problem is you reinsalled the flange on new one too quick after doing its seals... you did put in new drive flange seals i hope... if not.. do them... your asking for problems if not..

Two wenches? Man if I had two wenches helping me with my car I'd never get anything done. ;D
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on June 15, 2012, 11:49:29 am
I have a few hundred miles on the ACN now and everything seems fine except 5th pops out of gear occasionally. I think it needs an adjustment of the shift linkages since it does not feel quite right.

I love how the ACN drives! I really don't feel any reduction in power with the taller gearing but I do notice the lower RPM.

Here's a video of the tach/speedo with the ACN.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIrQNiyF2SM&feature=plcp

Thanks for all the tips on the tranny swap. It was a long and difficult ordeal since it was my first time doing this job and I did not have any of the special tools, some of which I had to make. Special thanks to Brian of brokevw (not sure if you read this forum) who answered my many questions on the ACN prep (bought from a junkyard) before I felt confident installing it.

My flange tool I fabricated made installing the flange and circlip with tranny in car a snap. I made a circlip install attachment to the flange tool where cir-clip pliers is not needed and it literally was tapped and snaps into the groove.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on June 15, 2012, 11:58:45 am
I have a few hundred miles on the ACN now and everything seems fine except 5th pops out of gear occasionally. I think it needs an adjustment of the shift linkages since it does not feel quite right.

I love how the ACN drives! I really don't feel any reduction in power with the taller gearing but I do notice the lower RPM.

Here's a video of the tach/speedo with the ACN.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIrQNiyF2SM&feature=plcp

Thanks for all the tips on the tranny swap. It was a long and difficult ordeal since it was my first time doing this job and I did not have any of the special tools, some of which I had to make. Special thanks to Brian of brokevw (not sure if you read this forum) who answered my many questions on the ACN prep (bought from a junkyard) before I felt confident installing it.

My flange tool I fabricated made installing the flange and circlip with tranny in car a snap. I made a circlip install attachment to the flange tool where cir-clip pliers is not needed and it literally was tapped and snaps into the groove.

usually when 5th pops out, its because there is a problem with 5th gear, not the linkage..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: bbob203 on June 23, 2012, 02:52:55 pm
your A C N didn't have 100mm flanges correct?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on June 24, 2012, 11:13:46 am
your A C N didn't have 100mm flanges correct?

NO ACN has 100mm flanges.. i had to put make mine that way..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on July 06, 2012, 07:38:30 am
well my acn is doing great! I flushed the tranny a few times
 with valvoline gl4 / gl5, then I put in pennzoil synchromesh, which stopped it from popping out of 5th. shifting into all gears is smooth,not notchy. 

 does anyone know if pennzoil synchromesh is the same as gm synchromesh? pennzoil is $6.99 a qt at advance auto parts. gm synchromesh is $18.

 my acn requires adding half a liter through the speedo hole after it spills out the side filler hole. is there a spec for oil level at the speedo hole? seems like I should make a speedo hole dipstick and do all my level checking and filling from there and never have to touch that side plug again.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: CRSMP5 on July 06, 2012, 08:11:37 am
if dry... 2.25 quarts... i only speedo hole my stuff..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on July 06, 2012, 11:47:18 am
if dry... 2.25 quarts... i only speedo hole my stuff..

speedo hole FTW, 2.25 qts as well..

2 qts GL4 gear oil, and a half pint of suspended moly lube..
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on July 07, 2012, 04:33:29 am
if dry... 2.25 quarts... i only speedo hole my stuff..

speedo hole FTW, 2.25 qts as well..

2 qts GL4 gear oil, and a half pint of suspended moly lube..

 What brand GL4 are you using? what's the moly for? wouldn't that change the friction characteristics  of the oil for the synchros?
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: theman53 on July 07, 2012, 05:58:45 am
http://www.brokevw.com/020oil.html
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on July 07, 2012, 07:17:50 am
http://www.brokevw.com/020oil.html

That's a great site and I've read that one before. What I am trying to do is make it easier for any future 020 oil level checks and changes. I guess I will have to make my own speedo hole dipstick and calibrate it.
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: theman53 on July 07, 2012, 07:51:09 am
this is what I did
http://www.flickr.com/photos/13558423@N02/2170694143/
Title: Re: getting ready to swap tranny
Post by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on July 07, 2012, 08:02:52 am
this is what I did
http://www.flickr.com/photos/13558423@N02/2170694143/

That's cool. I was thinking of something similar. Have you tried to mark the speedo and read the level on the cable/ gear? That would eliminate a special tool (that can get lost).

Does anyone know the viscoisty index of the VW GL4 gear oil? The Pennzoil Synchromesh is 9.08 cSt at 100C, I've read somewhere that it may be too thin and should not be used. Anyone used Pennzoil Synchromesh longterm and have done oil analysis?

http://www.pennzoil.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Synchromesh-Manual-Trans-Fluid.pdf