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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: kane66 on July 22, 2009, 10:08:39 pm
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My Volkswagen just hit the 200000 mile mark and I thought I would celebrate by changing the oil early, and since I had no Idea when the timing belt was done I decided to do that as well. It also needed a new valve cover gasket as well as the old one had developed a small leak. During my timing belt installation I noticed a bit of diesel on the front of the engine. One of the Injector return lines seamed a little ratty so i figured that was the culprit. So I changed the belt "no small task", and the valve cover during the process. Got everything buttoned up timed and rotated to check for binding and fired her up........ and noticed fuel dripping in a rather quick rate out of the back of the injector pump >:( >:( >:(..... how is it that I could be blessed with two leaky injector pumps in 2 years. Even though it was leaking I figured it would be good for a few more miles so i drove it to work... with a haze of half cooked diesel fumes surrounding my car. On my way back is when my second misfortune struck... the oil "idiot light" in the dash started flickering a little bit. By time I got home it had become a steady blink..... when I check the oil my dipstick there was nothing on it... It took a quart and a half just to get it into the add oil section.... It doesn't seem to be leaking from any where. I'm really hoping that some of that haze wasn't burning oil. Bad rings ??? I don't know. right now I'm working on removing the injector pump, so I can send it out for a reseal. In the mean time I'm going to install the POS Prothe pump I have to see if I can get it running well enough to determine where my oil is going. Figures this would all happen just before my tdi swap.
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Ahh I love old cars. Hopefully you can find the oil problem and it's nothing serious. The drain on the pan is tight?
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you might need to spray the engine down so you can determine the leaky area. maybe its the valve cover (bent, or whatever)? leaky pumps really do suck :( do you have the oil baffle in the head? they can really help reduce oil consumption. also make sure that oil isn't leaking on your new timing belt just to be on the safe side...
when did you get the prothe pump? mind letting us know how it pans out?
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burn_your_money... First thing I checked was the plug, and it was tight, so I'm guessing another culprit.
jtanguay: Defiantly plan on giving it a good spray down with a pressure washer when I get it running again. I got the Prothe pump about 2 years ago.... 2 years of trying to make it work ("hell")... and a thousand dollars later it still doesn't, even though the latest rendition might be gunk from a tank of diesel that had been sitting for to long (my fault). Anyway hoping a bottle of diesel purge will get me back up and running.
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Check your oil filter mount gasket. That's where I was leaking some mad oil on my Quantum, enough to set off that pressure switch that's sitting on the filter mount.
Unless you have the oil-coolant heat exchanger, it's a really easy gasket to replace. Don't strip your socket head screws. :D
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You should do your own pump reseal. It's not that hard, especially if it's just the cold start seal. Then you know what was actually done and you save yourself a boatload of cash.
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You should do your own pump reseal. It's not that hard, especially if it's just the cold start seal. Then you know what was actually done and you save yourself a boatload of cash.
just follow the online pictorial and remember to mark the alignment for the throttle linkage
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rallydiesel : jtanguay, I would love to do my own reseal but unfortunately I wont have the time for a week, and I will need my car afterwords. So I'll have to spend the extra money :'( and just have some one else do it. Defiantly not my style, but its hard to live without a car. And mine sure isn't making it easy for me.
Now for updates: Pulled the leaking pump today (man am I getting tired of changing pumps) and installed the Prothe pump. When I pulled the valve cover it was pretty obvious where all the oil had gone... new valve cover seal slipped in on spot and was hanging down into the gally :o. Anyway threw in a used one I had and a oil baffle off of another engine. Rolled it over by hand to insure no binding and tried to bleed the injectors. Ran a battery down before I realized I had forgot to turn the key to the on position. Anyway finally go it bleed and started on the Prothe pump ( at least it will idle) and ran the diesel purge through it. Noticed a few things. Smokey exhaust. There is defiantly a white smokey quality to the exhaust. Could be unburnt diesel but I have it timed to 98 mm so plenty advanced for it to be smoking. Also while running there is smoke coming from the oil fill cap ??? if I take it off quiet a bit of smoke pores out. Is that normal ???. I !REALLY! hope the rings haven't gone south as I have a tdi project to start and I need my IDI to get around in. >:( Guess I'll be buying a compression testing kit to see what I have going on in the cylinders. Any thought or suggestions are greatly appreciated.
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How did you kill a battery without turning the key on ??? I think it's normal to turn the key in order to kill the battery.
For the smoke coming out the oil filler, if you can hold your hand over it without getting soaked pretty quick then I bet it's good, rev it and see what happens.
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How did you kill a battery without turning the key on ??? I think it's normal to turn the key in order to kill the battery.
For the smoke coming out the oil filler, if you can hold your hand over it without getting soaked pretty quick then I bet it's good, rev it and see what happens.
Thought that might stump someone. I was using a push button start, strait from the battery to the starter, so no need of a key. Sure makes bleeding the injectors easy if you remember to turn the key to the on run position "activate fuel solenoid".
...rev it and see what happens..... ;D ::) ;D thats something that prothe pump is good at, it'll rev and hand out there for a few minutes :o. so I'll have plenty of time to see if I'm getting a lot of oil out of the crank case. I'm assuming soaked with oil is what your referring to. I'm guessing it's not worn rings with the white smoke, as oil in the combustion chamber would cause blue smoke. But maybe a blown head gasket or work valve guides..... ???...... something sure is pressurizing my crank case, as there is also a small stream of oil coming out of the dipstick :(. Again any ideas and suggestions would be appreciated.
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Maybe time for a leak down test?
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How did you kill a battery without turning the key on ??? I think it's normal to turn the key in order to kill the battery.
For the smoke coming out the oil filler, if you can hold your hand over it without getting soaked pretty quick then I bet it's good, rev it and see what happens.
Thought that might stump someone. I was using a push button start, strait from the battery to the starter, so no need of a key. Sure makes bleeding the injectors easy if you remember to turn the key to the on run position "activate fuel solenoid".
...rev it and see what happens..... ;D ::) ;D thats something that prothe pump is good at, it'll rev and hand out there for a few minutes :o. so I'll have plenty of time to see if I'm getting a lot of oil out of the crank case. I'm assuming soaked with oil is what your referring to. I'm guessing it's not worn rings with the white smoke, as oil in the combustion chamber would cause blue smoke. But maybe a blown head gasket or work valve guides..... ???...... something sure is pressurizing my crank case, as there is also a small stream of oil coming out of the dipstick :(. Again any ideas and suggestions would be appreciated.
getting the rpm's to stop hanging isn't a big deal. you can either back out the max fuel screw, or play with the residual fuel screw (the idle stop for the throttle linkage)
i think you might need to take this car for an italian tune up... either that or just install new rings. oil shooting out the dipstick is not right, but very common on worn out 1.6's at high rpms.
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getting the rpm's to stop hanging isn't a big deal. you can either back out the max fuel screw, or play with the residual fuel screw (the idle stop for the throttle linkage)
i think you might need to take this car for an italian tune up... either that or just install new rings. oil shooting out the dipstick is not right, but very common on worn out 1.6's at high rpms.
I actually tried that about a month ago.... you probably where the one who recommended it. What happens is that if I back the fuel screw so far out there is no throttle response and then turn it in a quarter turn it hangs... so essentially no matter where the fuel screw is the pump hangs ???. I called the last diesel shop that looked at it and they recommended I try Diesel Purge. to see if something had "gummed it up" not expecting much but who knows maybe it will work. Anyone know a affordable place to get a reseal with a quick turn-around. It looks like libbybapa has moved on to bigger and better things.
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hey kane, do you have an 88 scirocco 16 v? is it white?
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No but that would be sweet.... Im not a member of the 503 area code. I leave way up in the boonies east of Salem.
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hmm, cause there was a white rocco for sale outside of portland, was a pretty pimpin car. came with 2 engines too. no diesels tho, so i passed on it. ended up calling on an 83 Audi 5000 TD.
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well..... it just keeps getting better. Car wont even start this morning. :'(. I'm guessing that there really was gunk in the injector pump and leaving the diesel purge in it for two days did a really good job of loosening it up. Good enough to send it straight to the injectors. Here is what I have planned to check. Glow plugs.. even though it's 80 and beautiful and I doubt that I would even need the glow plugs. Compression test, as its always good to know the condition of your cylinders. And rebuild the injectors because I don't know if these have ever been rebuilt before, but if they haven't after 200000 miles they could use it. At this point I'm willing to do anything to get my car back on the road. Any suggestions on anything else I should try.
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well..... it just keeps getting better. Car wont even start this morning. :'(. I'm guessing that there really was gunk in the injector pump and leaving the diesel purge in it for two days did a really good job of loosening it up. Good enough to send it straight to the injectors. Here is what I have planned to check. Glow plugs.. even though it's 80 and beautiful and I doubt that I would even need the glow plugs. Compression test, as its always good to know the condition of your cylinders. And rebuild the injectors because I don't know if these have ever been rebuilt before, but if they haven't after 200000 miles they could use it. At this point I'm willing to do anything to get my car back on the road. Any suggestions on anything else I should try.
the diesel purge shouldn't be left inside the pump... you should run the engine with varying rpm's while on pure diesel purge. that stuff can clean clogged injectors pretty good. i don't think that the injectors can get so clogged that the engine won't run though. your problem lies somewhere else in the system. does it sputter? does it catch at all?
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sputters a little bit but not even close to starting. Thing is ran the diesel purge through it until It ran out. Then reattached the fuel lines and let it sit. Figured that leaving the diesel purge in over night should degunk anything thats in there. tried to start it this morning, wouldn't start. Bleed the injectors still wont start. ??? I figured clogged injectors. Any ideas
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sputters a little bit but not even close to starting. Thing is ran the diesel purge through it until It ran out. Then reattached the fuel lines and let it sit. Figured that leaving the diesel purge in over night should degunk anything thats in there. tried to start it this morning, wouldn't start. Bleed the injectors still wont start. ??? I figured clogged injectors. Any ideas
Are you sure the fuel solenoid is opening far enough, someone else here had a problem like that recently, it clicked but evidently the plunger stuck. If you're not sure just take out the plunger and the spring and see if it starts. You will have to stall the engine somehow to stop it though.
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I'll give that a try. But I'm getting fuel to the injectors as i cracked the lines to bleed the fuel out. So that means the fuel cutoff should be open. Guess its worth checking though.
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sputters a little bit but not even close to starting. Thing is ran the diesel purge through it until It ran out. Then reattached the fuel lines and let it sit. Figured that leaving the diesel purge in over night should degunk anything thats in there. tried to start it this morning, wouldn't start. Bleed the injectors still wont start. ??? I figured clogged injectors. Any ideas
Are you sure the fuel solenoid is opening far enough, someone else here had a problem like that recently, it clicked but evidently the plunger stuck. If you're not sure just take out the plunger and the spring and see if it starts. You will have to stall the engine somehow to stop it though.
Or a screwdriver will work as a plunger.
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Or a screwdriver will work as a plunger.
How's that?
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I have been able to turn mine on and off with no seliniod with a screwdriver...don't know if it is good or not.
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I have been able to turn mine on and off with no seliniod with a screwdriver...don't know if it is good or not.
Are we talking about the fuel solenoid, I can't imagine it running at all without one in the hole just to keep fuel from blowing out.
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Anyone know what size wrench is needed to remove the cut of solenoid. I'll be heading over to the HF to buy some "junk" I mean tools tomorrow.