LPG??? Anyone do any testing with this??

[jtanguay]

Would you recommend the setup for a 1.6 TD mechanical lifters?

[MK3 GTD]

i keep hearing about an episode of fifth gear where they put nitrous on a 1.9TD and raced an Acura NSX and they were near equal up to 60mph and then the NSX only won by a car length or something. wish i had seen it

[fspGTD]

I have done some experimenting with LPG on a 1.6lTD.  Details should be in the archives.  In a nutshell, the results were disappointing - heavy detonation without a lot of power increase in the IDI Diesel.

[jtanguay]

detonation.. ouch.  Well I guess that settles that!

[diffdude]

I have used lpg on my 01 cummins dodge. I used the liquid type it uses a regulator off a forklift and the motor has to suck the lpg in.You regulate the amount of lpg by the size of the feed tube going into the intake. I did have to run the engine coolant through the regulator or it would freeze up. On my dodge I got 100hp to the rear wheels at the flick of a switch. I have a friend that used the vapor type system like in the above link and had nothing but problems with detination, he swithched to the liquid type and had no problems. I am just finishing up the rebuild on my caddy and going to install the propane when its done.

[jtanguay]

thats awesome.  100 hp extra boost, and I'm only looking for an extra 10-20 hp for a hill climb

[VWRacer]

Yeah, but that's 100 hp on a 6 liter engine, not a 1.6 liter...

Which translates to about 27 hp for a 1.6. Might be just what you're looking for!

[fspGTD]

More relevant is that the significant power boost was on a DI diesel (cummins), which has a significantly different shaped combustion chamber (no prechamber or narrow port connecting prechamber to main chamber) combined with a lower compression ratio, which means it is much more detonation resistant than the IDI VW diesels (which are 23:1'ish compresison ratio.)  DI Diesels are typically where you hear of LPG fumigation contributing to substantial power gains.

On a VW IDI, don't expect on seeing more than a mild 5% power gain with LPG fumigation.

Regarding liquid vs vapor draw, I doubt there would be much difference in fumigated air temperature, since both fumigate with gas and so the liquid boils and thereby cools down when doing so in either case.  In fact, I would think that a vapor draw would inject cooler vapors than the liquid draw, since the liquid draw system uses heat of the engine coolant in the regulator to reliably boil the LPG, which in most cases adds more heat than is necessary.

Now, having a genuine liquid LPG injection system reportedly makes a real difference in cooling doing the air intake charge, and might also give some added detonation resistance... but this is quite new technology and very expensive, and has not been applied to diesel fumigation application before.  (It requires computer controlled duty-cycle injectors, with a special LPG tank incorporating a high pressure in-tank pump to sufficiently pressurize the LPG to keep it liquid passing through the pressure regulator and past the fuel injector.  I have yet to hear of anyone trying a liquid injection LPG fumigated diesel.

[fspGTD]

Also, here are some pics of the LPG system I developed and did testing with on the VW IDI Diesel (1.6lTD) application (note, these are older pics; the LPG system pictured has since been removed from the car):




some info on it is available in this thread: http://www.hostboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=4037&t=143

other propane threads of interest on the old board:
http://www.hostboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=4037&t=164

http://www.hostboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=4037&t=4

[GTD.]

i keep hearing about an episode of fifth gear where they put nitrous on a 1.9TD and raced an Acura NSX and they were near equal up to 60mph and then the NSX only won by a car length or something. wish i had seen it

Yeah seen it VBH was diving it an Tiff was in the Honda (UK program so it was a Honda) they gave the golf away afterwards, they sid something like it was the fastest MK3 TDi im the country as it aint the fastest Golf Diesel in the country, that accoled peobabbly goes to Simon Cooper of Central VW Audi, his mk2 GTD has a modified TDi engne with mechaical fuel injection and a t28 hybrid turbo and probabbly a few other tricks up its sleeve, faster down the strip than a VR6 apparently.
http://www.centralvwaudi.com/

[diffdude]

fspGTD, thanks for the good info. I dont think i will even try it with the problems you had.

[gldgti]

has anyone used this with biodiesel, and is it better worse or not apparently different?

also, i just had an idea....

could you use a carburettor as a kind of self regulating "constant feed" fumigator? i'm thinking for use in a low percentage dose application, like for a N/A IDI engine or something......the ventury could be usilised then as a direct measure of engine load, etc....just an idea...

love it when you guys talk tech!