Author Topic: A1 Caddy TD intercooler install  (Read 12617 times)

October 27, 2006, 09:10:21 am

veeman

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A1 Caddy TD intercooler install
« on: October 27, 2006, 09:10:21 am »
All...

I'm getting ready to do my front mount intercooler install on my caddy and I ran into a problem.

I'm using a mitsubishi starion intercooler and had planned to mount it in front of the radiator (car now has a/c removed).  For the piping I was going to go in through the passenger side above the alternator , through the IC and then back out just in front of the battery.

Last night we checked everything out and it appears that the radiator fan switch is RIGHT in the spot where the piping would come out.  I'm pretty certain this is a 1.6NA radiator that I used, but other rabbit radiators seem to have the switch in the bottom.  Odd.  Can anyone confirm?

The other issue is that the battery is in the way.  Do most people end up turning the battery sideways and moving the washer bottle?  Smaller battery?

My other idea was to run the piping so that it goes in and comes out the same side of the radiator...  Kind of like this (not my car, but thanks to whoever I snatched the photo from):



Almost seems easier than redoing the battery / radiator.   If I do this method, I'll have to figure out how to make the intake spigot work / clear the other piping...

Any comments or things to watch out for?
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #1October 31, 2006, 06:49:16 am

vwnut20

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A1 Caddy TD intercooler install
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2006, 06:49:16 am »
Ever thought about relocating the battery in the back?  This is what most people do for weight distrisbution but in your case it will give enough room for your intercooler pipping.  Just make sure you use at least 1 gauge welding cable.  Anything smaller and you'll run in to some problems.

Reply #2October 31, 2006, 07:05:25 am

veeman

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« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2006, 07:05:25 am »
Yes, you're right, I could relocate the battery, but this is going in a rabbit truck and that makes things a little different.  I use my truck quite often for hauling and I'm not crazy about having the battery back there exposed to everything / everyone.  

I'll have to figure something out...  Should happen this week.
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #3October 31, 2006, 09:49:44 am

mk1vdub

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« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2006, 09:49:44 am »
yep I had this problem, I moved my battery back basically as far as it would go, I just cut the old securing bar off, moved it to the front and re-welded it, and made up a new bolt down securing plate.





as you can see the piping now just fits - I'm sure its not the best in terms of flow because of the turns it makes but I don't care as it just seemed to work out nicely

HTH :D

1983 mk1 golf GTD
1980 mk1 scirocco Gli, in bits, in the garage, awaiting full restoration

Reply #4October 31, 2006, 10:29:05 am

veeman

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« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2006, 10:29:05 am »
Thanks for the pics...  Is that the standard size battery?  Seemed like when I tried to move my battery back, it interfered with the strut tower / inner fender.

The other problem I was trying to work around was relocating the washer tank.  Wouldn't fit in the rain tray when we tried... I see yours is on the passenger side.  Is that the stock location?  What are you doing for an airbox?
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #5October 31, 2006, 03:44:28 pm

RabbitJockey

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A1 Caddy TD intercooler install
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2006, 03:44:28 pm »
i just bought the same intercooler, how does it fit in front of the radiator? i plan on doing mine where the piping comes out on the same side of the radiator, the passenger side... let me know how yours goes
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #6November 01, 2006, 06:16:15 am

veeman

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« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2006, 06:16:15 am »
Quote
i just bought the same intercooler, how does it fit in front of the radiator?


Seems like it'll fit great.  We'll have to fab up some brackets, but now that there's no a/c condensor in the way, we should be fine.  

I'll be posting pics of the install...  Do I start another thread or can I change the name of this one?   Moderators?
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #7November 01, 2006, 01:34:55 pm

burn_your_money

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« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2006, 01:34:55 pm »
I have a washer tank that fits in the raintray. You can have it. I could be wrong, and it might be an expansion tank but I'm sure you could figure something out. I've seen mk1s were the washer tank is located about where the TD air box would be in a MK1.
Tyler

Reply #8November 02, 2006, 12:10:23 pm

veeman

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« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2006, 12:10:23 pm »
We started the intercooler project last night.  I'm working with Kevin from DTR Performance in Florence, KY so we were using his shop and equipment.

After looking at my radiator and battery in the caddy, I decided to go with the idea of making the intercooler inlet and outlet route through the passenger side of the engine / radiator area.   There just wasn't an easy way to do the "flow through design" without buying a new battery or relocating other components.  In addition, the return piping would have actually been LONGER than the "same side" idea we went with.   You'll see later on.

The first step was to pull the radiator and reroute some fuel lines, vacuum lines and a block heater cord from the valve cover area.  Since my fuel filter is in the passenger fender well, I'm going to try to route everything around the airbox to the front, then up to the pump.

Next, Kevin took the port-a-band to the Starion intercooler and started adapting the new inlet / outlets.  We're going for 2" piping on this install, so the original OEM outlets had to come off.  I ordered a 2" mandrel bend from Burns_Stainless for this part...  

Here's a shot of Kevin tigging the outlets on there (that's the twin VR6-T Corrado in the background, by the way)....



Here's a shot of the first test fits with and without the radiator.





In this one, you can see how the return piping parallels the IC on its way back to the side of the radiator.   Fits great!  The radiator sits in the factory location with no problems.   The other cool part is that the whole setup is somewhat visible through the grill from the front.    

The IC is offset to the passenger side, so the inlet is basically a straight shot down.  



I had originally ordered carbon steel tubing for the piping, but we decided to go with stainless at the last minute.  I'm not so much interested in the "bling" factor so much as I am with keeping rust at bay...

Now...  Kevin prides himself on "clean" installs, so we came up with the idea to run the charge piping next to each other.  It became clear that there were some problems with this design in that the piping would block the oil filler cap, the pop-off valve piping, etc.  In addition, the stock intake "spigot" is at the wrong angle.  We spent some time reconfiguring some hoses and Kevin spent some time eyeballing the angles.  He then got the first pipe tacked together...



They pipes will be parallel to each other until they have to go around the oil cap.  As far as the spigot goes, we decided to make a new one with a 2" inlet and the correct angle.  Kevin had some spare aluminum, so I started on making a flange for that.

Here's the second pipe (the return) in progress...  



I'll be picking the silicone hoses up here locally, but as of last night, we made good progress.   Here's a little cheater shot of roughly how the pipes will look when installed.  The pipes are actually next to each other... in the pic, it looks like they're on top of each other.    You'll just have to imagine that the hoses and new spigot are on there.



So far, things have gone really quickly and Kevin / DTR has done a great job of adding a personal touch to the project.  More updates to come!
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #9November 02, 2006, 12:16:16 pm

veeman

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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2006, 12:16:16 pm »
Another (camera phone) shot from above with the spigot in place...  

81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #10November 02, 2006, 04:11:10 pm

burn_your_money

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« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2006, 04:11:10 pm »
Looks awesome :D
Tyler

Reply #11November 02, 2006, 04:17:00 pm

malone

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« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2006, 04:17:00 pm »
Yep.. it looks great!
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Reply #12November 02, 2006, 05:16:47 pm

larry104

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« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2006, 05:16:47 pm »
Beautiful work!

Reply #13November 03, 2006, 08:20:25 am

veeman

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« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2006, 08:20:25 am »
Update.... Last night we were able to put everything back together with the clamps and the silicone hoses.  By the time I got to the shop, Kevin had everything tigged together and had started grinding down the welds.

Since I didn't want polished piping, he smoothed everything out and then used sandpaper to create a "brushed" look on the stainless.  It looks really neat and industrial although you probably can't tell from the pics.  

When Kevin was done, the pipes looked like they were bend from one stick of pipe. I'm really thrilled with it and the piping runs are actually quite short.



In that pic, you can also see the new intake spigot that we made.  It's a bit larger ID than the stock one and it's even blended / polished on the inside.  The boost signal now comes from a new nipple located on the undesisde fo the charge return pipe...

Here's another shot from the front...



...and another shot of what you can see from the front grill coming at you.



The Starion intercooler, it seems,  is almost perfect for this fitment.  It just fits in the spot where the condensor sits and just clears the hood release mechanism.  Radiator goes in fine although we had to elongate one of the mounting tab holes on the alt side for the rubber mount to sit correctly.

I decided to use T-bolt clamps where I could, but I'm not so sure I like them.  They seem to be a bit awkward to position and I'm not a huge fan of how the bolts stick way out when you tighten them up.  We'll see about that.

After getting everything back together, I took a test drive with it last night.  I noticed just a touch of boost lag, but nothing huge.  I can get up to around 13 or 14 psi in 2nd gear and then full boost (approx 15 or so) in the other gears. I'd say the pressure drop with the IC in place is less than 1psi according to my gauge.

The biggest improvement I noticed is that it seems I can hold third and fourth at full boost longer without the power dropping off like it would before (heat soak?).  In general, the car runs smoother and has more power than it did before.  I had some fun blasting around some of the roads near the shop.

After the test drive, when I got back to the shop, I felt the boost tubes.  The tube from the compressor was warm to the touch , but the return tube was quite cold.  It felt like I was holding a can of soda from the fridge ((it was a cool night though).   I'd say the IC is doing its job.  

I think I'm going to drive it a bit "as is" to see how things have changed, then start looking at the boost / fuel settings again.     I'll be dynoing the truck again here in two weeks, so I'll have back-to-back results from the install...
81 Caddy TD
98 Audi A4 Quattro V6 TDI
83 VW GTI FSP
86 4ktq

Reply #14November 03, 2006, 03:54:10 pm

RabbitJockey

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« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2006, 03:54:10 pm »
damn when are you guys doing my install? XD, what size is the stock piping on them?  is do you think it's possible at all to use the stock intake top thing?  i was hoping to put mine on using radiator hose and pipe
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit