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1991 ECO diesel with new M&h inc modded TD pump
by
quickrip
on 01 Apr, 2016 22:50
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So I've been working on my 91 eco jetta over the last year getting it dialed in before putting it back together. I've tried to take my time and put together a really hard running reliable weekend fun car. To start I was playing with the stock setup and just having fun with it. I turned up the stock eco pump and upped the boost to about 15 psi on the original k14 turbo. It made a big difference from stock but wasn't all that impressive. I also own a modified cummins first gen with the ve pump which gets up and goes very well. I have the M&H timing advance spacer in it and was curious if they made this for the vw pump.
I called up the folks over at M&H inc to see what they had to offer for our pumps and was rather disappointed when they said it wouldn't work for my pump (I have since learned from Mark there that it will work on some of the vw pumps without the auto mechanical timing advance). About 10 min later Mark called me back and after we talked for a bit, He had me sending him the recently purchased td pump so he could test a few mods out on it. Let me tell you it didn't take all that much convincing.
In the end he modified a few things in the pump to allow the fuel pin a longer stroke and thus allowing us to make use of his array of boost pins. He also took care of the gov mod for me while it was there.
After getting the pump back I added the aaz mls headgasket, k24 turbo, saab intercooler, and upped the boost to 27psi. All I can say is WOW!!! This is what I've been trying to achieve. I have a real good tune on it now allowing me to run around town below boost with no smoke and with a heavier foot it takes off like a small version of my cummins. It has a bit of lag which is easily avoided with quick shifting, or a bit higher rev before the shift. This places you in the meat of the next gear and off she goes. What an absolute blast this car is to drive now. To be honest the power curve reminds me of a 4 cyl gas ride but with a lower rpm power curve. Short shifting is also really fun, and feeling the torque pull from the bottom as the boost builds. It reaches about 10 psi and then shoots quickly up to 27. Also for those of you looking to run bigger turbos and possibly dual setups this thing fuels hard. I had to turn it way down to avoid smoking out the streets. the k24 is working great but the pump has ability way beyond this small turbo. I'm really having fun with my car so I figured I'd share. Without this forum and all the great info all of you provide I'd never have pulled off the 1.6td eco build. What a blast!
I know Mark at M & H Inc is willing to build more of these if anyone is interested. I believe also that he can put them together with just the pump tops so it isn't necessary to remove the pump from the car. A pretty simple overall hp gain.
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#1
by
vanbcguy
on 03 Apr, 2016 18:19
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Very cool.
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#2
by
mk216td
on 03 Apr, 2016 18:35
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Sounds great! I might have to go this route on my eco. I'm looking into buying a small Holset turbo as we speak.
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#3
by
quickrip
on 03 Apr, 2016 19:56
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Sounds great! I might have to go this route on my eco. I'm looking into buying a small Holset turbo as we speak.
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Which holset are you thinking about. I love the he351cw on my 12 valve cummins.
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#4
by
mk216td
on 03 Apr, 2016 20:01
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I'm leaning towards the he221w with 5.5cm exhaust housing, it might be pretty laggy compared to my K14 but I can run crazy boost out of it, plus I think the tranny in our cars would better suit a big turbo compared to a wide ratio 020.
Funny thing is, I own 2, 2nd gen 12 valves. I like your taste in vehicles haha.
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#5
by
quickrip
on 03 Apr, 2016 20:11
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I will say tgat the k24 was a big improvement over the k14 for my taste.
My cummins is a 1st gen ve pump. That's what got me curious about these vw's. But I tossed the cummins into my 86 gmc crew cab. I love my two diesels.
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#6
by
mk216td
on 03 Apr, 2016 22:19
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We'll see how this turbo works out, it won't be as simple to install as yours, I gotta buy a custom manifold and clock the turbo to get it to work and who knows what else.
Is your car intercooled? I'm assuming so.
I always wondered the same about the Cummins/VW VE pump performance mods and parts interchangeability. I've actually watched 1st gen Cummins videos and read forums to learn how to mess with my pump. Glad to hear it's working good for ya!
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#7
by
quickrip
on 03 Apr, 2016 22:35
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Yeah, I have a Saab 9000 intercooler. I can't figure out how to post a pic on this forum. I'd love to show off my 1.6td. The car itself is not much to speak of. really it's an all red stock looking sleeper. But the engine bay looks nice and it's running great.
Clocking the turbo isn't too hard I had to do that on the 1st gen to put the newer '04 holset on it. Have to fabricate a bracket for the waste gate mount but otherwise pretty simple.
Running this k24 really has worked well with the Eco trans. Once it spools you can keep it there even through shifts. I'm not sure how much bigger the holset is but hopefully that gives a good comparison for you. I know that this modded pump would certainly help out with the fuel end of things. Good luck, and happy dieseling.
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#8
by
RabbitJockey
on 04 Apr, 2016 04:36
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what are the costs on this stuff? It'd be nice if they had some bolt on pump mods that we can do ourselves,which would be nice for lightly modded cars, but if its going to be 500+ and needing to send a pump some where, i'd rather spend more money and send my pump to giles, goran, zoltan kiss, or ls performance and get some guys with lots of experience on small diesel pumps building me a good pump.
but i'd think something like a kit with a timing advance space, an upgraded boost pin, and a stronger main spring or shim kit would be a nice little starter kit for modifiying a vw pump, and include some seals.
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#9
by
quickrip
on 04 Apr, 2016 05:40
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what are the costs on this stuff? It'd be nice if they had some bolt on pump mods that we can do ourselves,which would be nice for lightly modded cars, but if its going to be 500+ and needing to send a pump some where, i'd rather spend more money and send my pump to giles, goran, zoltan kiss, or ls performance and get some guys with lots of experience on small diesel pumps building me a good pump.
but i'd think something like a kit with a timing advance space, an upgraded boost pin, and a stronger main spring or shim kit would be a nice little starter kit for modifiying a vw pump, and include some seals.
So far my pump is the crash test dummy of sorts. I did send my entire pump to them but it sounds like all he needs is the pump top to modify.
As far as getting the parts to modify yourself, that may be possible also just contact them and see. They will clarify I'm sure.
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#10
by
RabbitJockey
on 04 Apr, 2016 05:50
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im just trying to help with what would be marketable, because like i said if its over 500 or 600 bucks, my pumps going to one of the well known and credentialed builders, but if its a parts kit with a good price point for someone just starting to mod their vw diesel, it will definitely be a hit. or for someone just doing light mods, like you did with an intercooler and a stock turbo its a great option to increase performance with out spending a grand on a pump.
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#11
by
92EcoDiesel Jetta
on 04 Apr, 2016 07:50
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Host your pics on Photobucket, copy and paste the IMG link into your post.[/size]Did you try the governor mod first before trying these other mods? If you did, I'd like to hear your opinion on the difference in performance and smoke between them.
Yeah, I have a Saab 9000 intercooler. I can't figure out how to post a pic on this forum. I'd love to show off my 1.6td. .....[quote ]
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#12
by
RabbitJockey
on 04 Apr, 2016 10:01
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Host your pics on Photobucket, copy and paste the IMG link into your post. Did you try the governor mod first before trying these other mods? If you did, I'd like to hear your opinion on the difference in performance and smoke between them.
Yeah, I have a Saab 9000 intercooler. I can't figure out how to post a pic on this forum. I'd love to show off my 1.6td. .....
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#13
by
quickrip
on 04 Apr, 2016 12:34
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I did the gov mod on my Eco pump with the k14 at 15psi boost. It ran good but not great power. Then I removed that setup to install the current one explained above. I can say that my car revs about the same as before but with a lot more smoke and a lot more pull. I did have boost quicker before but not much with my Eco trans it is a great combo now. I wish I had installed the td pump prior to modding for comparison reasons but it didn't make much sense to do it twice.
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#14
by
RabbitJockey
on 04 Apr, 2016 12:48
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yeah, also a difference in turbo and boost pressure.