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Author Topic: MK1 Help!!!  (Read 1930 times)

February 15, 2015, 06:55:11 pm

Soldier

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MK1 Help!!!
« on: February 15, 2015, 06:55:11 pm »
 :o  I recently obtained a MK1 Jetta 1.6 TD, it was not running. The previous owner stated after rebuilding the top end from a belt failure he drove it 2 years, before it began hard to start and then stopped. I got it 2 years after that. I had the IP rebuilt by Hans, and installed it. with a new belt. I cant seem to get the timing right, it cranks but wont start.
      I was told turbo's need to be at 6 degrees BTDC, the book states TDC? does anyone know for certain?
       I have checked that cylinder 1 lobes are up/valves closed. The flywheel is at TDC (by some miracle the pump is full of fuel and I do have fuel at the injectors. (when cracked)
    The glow plugs have 9-10 volts at the plugs and the stop solenoid, with the key on.
    But wont start, I have even tried starting fuel, without success.
   I am getting ready to repeat the timming for the injection pump, I had done it previously but did not feel confident the pump was moving as it should? in addition the book nor video did not suggest loosening the belt? will this lift around the pulley if the belt is tight.
    Any help would be appreciated, new to the site my other car is a TDI, guess I got spoiled!



Reply #1February 15, 2015, 10:21:02 pm

theman53

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2015, 10:21:02 pm »
Everything should have close to 12v.

What timing are you talking? If it is belt timing then they need to be at TDC. Make sure the flywheel is marked correctly if you had issues with it in the past.

Reply #2February 16, 2015, 12:08:47 am

ORCoaster

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2015, 12:08:47 am »
Never heard the 6 BTDC before.  Take a picture of the flywheel at what you are calling TDC.  We will look and see if we agree.  That might be the best way to do this.  And double check on the IP timing too.  It may be wrong and you are off on both counts and that would make for a hard starter. 


Now Own 1981 Caddy as the NEW DISTRACTION to all that is around me.  Project Away!

Reply #3February 16, 2015, 11:24:42 pm

745 turbogreasel

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2015, 11:24:42 pm »
The old pump gears have 2 holes that would fit the  lock pin,  useful  only if the pump is 180 out internally, otherwise possible grounds for error.
You should be able to crack the lines, power  the pump, and rotate the motor to be sure #1  fuels on the  compression stroke.

Reply #4February 17, 2015, 10:27:16 pm

Soldier

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Re: MK1 Help!!! Update
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2015, 10:27:16 pm »
 Thank you I have everything lined up TDC Compression stroke, 2 lobes for cyl #1 up, TDC on flywheel and the marks on th IP all in line, the pin lined up in the pump.
    My only issue is getting the gauge (dial ) set. I fit it in with the adapter, but I am unsure if it is suppose to bottom out? As I stated before the pump does not move freely, part of this could be due to the IP lines? do they need to be loose? I know this has to be right on and I apparently didn't do it right the first 6 times so any input would be much appreciated.
                In addition, all the cam lock, IP pump pin are removed during the process of timing the pump correct. I appreciate all your help. Thank s

Reply #5February 17, 2015, 11:36:26 pm

theman53

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Reply #6February 18, 2015, 12:32:15 am

ORCoaster

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2015, 12:32:15 am »
Hopefully the Vince stuff will straighten him out.  But just to answer his questions.

Getting the dial set is sort of a trick in that you are installing it as all parts are lined up with pins in place and all that.  Then you insert the gauge such that instead of reading a zero on the dial you push it in so that there is pressure on the gauge enough to make it register say 2 or 3 wraps of the dial indicator needle.  There are two dials on these gauges one for MM and one for CM the next highest value up.  You want that little dial to read between 2-3. 

Have that first then you pull the locks out of the system, IP and Cam lock plate.  Then you put a 17mm wrench or socket on the crankshaft, yeah down low and hard to make this visual but you turn the crank backwards until the dial indicator on the gauge no longer is getting less in value.  At this point the pin in the gauge touching the cam inside the IP will be on the low point of the travel path.  This is where you now twist the outside of the dial gauge to make the needle pointer align with the Zero value on the dial.  Now it is time to time.  Roll the engine with the wrench or socket forward a little each time as you watch the dial indicator.  It should be rolling up on the 70 mark and then you look into the hole for the timing mark to come up into view.  Bump the wrench a bit and watch till the mark on the flywheel comes across the pointer and to TDC.  What is the dial gauge reading?   That is your time for you particular setup.


Want to change it because it is to low?   or too high?  Well then yes you are going to have to loosen the nuts that hold the IP in place to do that.  Because you need to move the IP towards or away from the engine to make it a higher or lower number.  That will advance or retard the timing.  To get movement the nuts on the back of the IP that hold the injector lines may also need to be loosened but not always. 

Once the timing number is where you want it then loosen the nuts on the back of the pump and release the tension on the system there.  Now tighten them back up.  All loose at once then tighten, it won't do much good to loosen and then re-tighten individually.

Ok, That should get you to the proper time.  Go to the link and see if it makes sense now or perhaps this makes sense now that you looked. 

It aint about moving a distributor at all.  Very different and something to be proud to do once you master it. 
Now Own 1981 Caddy as the NEW DISTRACTION to all that is around me.  Project Away!

Reply #7February 18, 2015, 08:19:27 am

Soldier

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2015, 08:19:27 am »
Thanks guys I will be working on it today and let you know hopefully Ill make everyone proud.

Reply #8March 03, 2015, 01:58:12 pm

JessaBug

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2015, 01:58:12 pm »
I had the IP rebuilt by Hans

This could end up also causing issues. Surprised no one mentioned it yet.
Mine - BMP 20thAE GTI
His - '01 Jetta TDI
Our project: '84 Jetta TD

Reply #9March 07, 2015, 06:17:22 pm

air-cooled or diesel

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Re: MK1 Help!!!
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2015, 06:17:22 pm »
one thing id add is when you have tdc @crank and you have correct measurement at ip dial gauge turn over again and recheck tdc camtdc and ip measurement again.
if you do dial guage wrong, preload and stuff, you ll get a different reading everytime.

 

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