Franken-TD for an '84 Coupe: Like i need another hole in my build thread

[Dakotakid]

To me, the Chicago reference on the piston would indicate that they are, made in Argentina, Topline brand. And, if they are fitted with Topline rings, I (personally) would certainly STOP....regroup.....order a good set of pistons and rings NOW.

I had an engine with Topline components (and this was a totally mild n/a application) and was NOT at all impressed. Actually, I was a bit pis-sed-off that I had been so haphazard in "selecting" them for the build. The rings never did seat and I was relieved the day a pre-cup took out the engine and I started over with something else.

Topline manages to sell a lot of stuff through "engine kits" offered by machinists. It is a lot like buying surgery equipment at Walmart. Just my opinion based on a very negative experience. If you are turbo'ing this.....wow.....good luck. Put a rabbit's foot on the rear-view mirror.   

[TimpanogosSlim]

well, the trick is, the block has been bored to match the measurements of the pistons.

I could see getting different rings, but i don't have a lot of money to burn on this anymore.

[TimpanogosSlim]

Yes, pistons and rings are Topline.

Is there any consensus that the Topline rings aren't going to work? Would Grant rings work better, or would i have to spring for something that costs real money?

in other news, the head is not quite done.

The guy who is building the head says that one of the exhaust valves was bent, so he ordered in another. Also that the face required a light resurfacing.

none of the valves looked bent to me, but these guys spin all valves to be certain, even new ones.

[vanbcguy]

in other news, the head is not quite done.

The guy who is building the head says that one of the exhaust valves was bent, so he ordered in another. Also that the face required a light resurfacing.

none of the valves looked bent to me, but these guys spin all valves to be certain, even new ones.

Since with these engines the valves stick out straight, the stems tend to 'collapse' slightly when they get impacted, unlike lots of other engines where they will actually "bend".  It's good that your machinist is strict with this - an impacted valve often decides to drop its head a few thousand miles down the road, which generally destroys the piston, head and possibly the block.

[TimpanogosSlim]

well, it looks like goetze rings are $13 per piston at autohausaz. i guess i consider this a lesson learned. i should have showed up with the pistons and rings i wanted instead of letting the shop source them.

i read about some of the bad experiences with the topline rings, and chrome rings in general.

bah. if i, eh, had a job at the moment, i would spring for total seal.

[Dakotakid]

Goetze are, indeed, extremely wise. You will not regret it (if installed, broken in properly).

[TimpanogosSlim]

fwiw i hear good things about topline rings in engines that are not vw diesels.

but all i see here are sad tales.

If i had the dough i'd go for the total seal rings, but right now I'm thinking that if some day i get a hotter turbo than the ahu-spec k03 I'll re-ring with total seal at that juncture.

The machine shop i am working with is an olds / pontiac / buick specialist by way of being enthusiasts for those badges. I'm working with them because i have a good friend who works there and he'd never understand if i went somewhere else.

When i went by yesterday to pick his brain about distributor setup on my other money pit ('77 fiat spider) he was madly reassembling one of the two hotrodded olds 455 engines that Mondello Performance had brought out from california to have tested on their engine dyno, which ran like crap and made various strange noises.

If i rebuild another engine i'll get all my own parts. It was my fault for not jumping on it after they did the rough bore on the cylinders and knew which size to order. Can't expect the oldsmobile experts to buy the right vw parts. 

[TimpanogosSlim]

Fwiw, the other money pit - the original money pit - turned over and ran last night for the first time since 1998. Unbelievably good feeling to hear the old girl run again.


. :Sent by pneumatic tubes

[Dakotakid]

If it is handy and you run out of stuff to do, publish a couple photos of those pistons. Maybe a side/top combo shot and an under-side shot. Perhaps, they are better looking these days.

[TimpanogosSlim]

ha, run out of stuff to do.

the pistons looked ok to me but i may find the time for a photo shoot.

regarding paint, after agonizing for 2 days while the primer cured, i decided to see how bad it was.

Masking tape couldn't pull the primer off the block, so i went ahead and sprayed it green. Time will tell whether this was a foolish idea.



Here is a before shot -- after 3x hot tanking, but, a water based hot tank:



After dremel wire wheels:

[Gizmoman]

Carry on sir

[TimpanogosSlim]

topline piston photo shoot:





Aside from the markings on the top, lack of valve impressions, piston slap, and carbon - they look just like the nurals i took out to my untrained eye.

I have much higher resolution if anyone feels the need, plus shots of the group of four.

the thing that looks like a bit of fluff in the side shot is a bit of fluff.

Edit: Just submitted the order for goetze rings along with the other stuff i was getting from autohausaz. I had been holding off on ordering from them because i wanted to order the head gasket at the same time, but *** happens.

[TimpanogosSlim]

Not much accomplished today.

The bosch shop i dropped my injectors off at hasn't called. i'll give 'em a ring next week. They seemed BUSY and the guy in charge knows and respects zukgod1. so I think they are probably just a bit behind. I told 'em i'm not in a hurry so they may be taking higher dollar work, which is ok.

Predictably, the machine shop called and asked why it is their vendors keep sending them valves with 7mm stems. I explained (again) that this is probably because the head is later model than the car, and that they should look for valves for a 1992 jetta 1.9D or TD, engine code AAZ. Hopefully that gets them on track. I can get a few different brands of AAZ-code valves through rockauto so, hopefully they just weren't communicating. or didn't remember that i told them the head is from a much later engine.

Stopped by the auto-body/paint store for more of their good etching primer (forget the brand, has a maple leaf on the label, is NOT cheap, goes on way smoother than rustoleum) and realized that the House of Hose is right next door. My k03 came w/o oil fittings so i ordered some on ebay. Didn't realize that the return was 5/8" and bought a 3/8" weld bung and 45 degree street elbow for the oil pan. Picked up a length of 5/8" high temperature hydraulic hose and a 3/8 mpt to 5/8 barb fitting for way cheap. love these guys and don't know why i ever buy hose or fittings anywhere else.

Finished painting the engine and transmission mounts, painted the, ah, throttle bracket or what passes for one in a diesel, and a couple more pulleys.

Determined that the oil pump i took out of the engine is from a 1.5D. Read the procedure for checking the mk2 (hydro head) oil pump i got from BYM and then couldn't find my feeler gauges. bah.

Getting anxious to build the engine. It's just sitting on top of a plastic bucket right now while the paint finishes curing.

I know it's cart-before-the-horse but i mounted the oil filter flange and the breather fitting. Tried to get a better idea of how i'm going to route the turbo oil feed but until i mount the vacuum pump i won't have a clear idea.

Reinz gasket kit came with a plastic dingus that goes between the breather fitting and the block. Has a rubber seal on the block side. Good idea? I guess i paid for it, and if it doesn't hurt . . .

Does anyone have strong opinions about the use of copper spray-a-gasket on paper gaskets? The oil filter flange was glued onto the block with something so tenacious that there's still traces of it on there. But slathering it with RTV seems gauche.

The water pump housing, otoh, is going to get a good application of RTV behind the o-ring. the casting is just so rough.

Installed the thermostat in the water pump housing. I might take it back out and slather the o-ring with plumber's silicone grease.

Tomorrow I may just go ahead and put it on the stand, then install the main bearings and crankshaft, maybe the seals. And then throw the engine bag back over it and fidget like a child who has been told to sit in a corner. Or just work on one of the other two money pits.

AutohausAZ hasn't shipped my rings yet. And after going through the box of hardware i realize that i should have ordered some more stuff. three or four axle flange bolts have damaged heads for example. There's a lot of other hardware i feel like replacing and i might end up making a list and heading over to one of the local fastener shops, though i'm tempted to buy black oxide 12.9 hardware from mcmaster in bulk. I just can't justify the price when i know that double-d bolt will have most the normal-ish hardware and i'll probably spend less than $10.

[TimpanogosSlim]

Well, i painted the valve cover.

Or rather, i filed down some of the worse features of the top of the valve cover, wet sanded for an hour or so with 400 grit, polished the gasket surfaces (since they'd been media blasted), masked off the gasket surfaces, polished and masked the VW badge, laid on 4 layers of automotive-grade primer (it's thin), waited 2 hours, and laid on 5 or 6 layers of john deere blitz black.

Here's hoping it turns out pretty.

I've toyed with the idea of painting the relief of the badge and stripes in blue, but it would probably clash with the green.

[theman53]

I wanted to paint the relief in my valve cover too, but never did. Good luck if you do.