One last diesel timing question....

[Driggs]

... So in putting the new pump on, I had taken the timing belt off before..


The engine is at TDC, and the camshaft is locked in place in its proper position.

Now everything in the bentley talks about setting the injection pump to its proper position with all the belts on.. this is where im lost, kinda, because I dont have the belts on..

So this is where my injection pump is now.. Am I right?
I used the proper dial indicator, and put it in far enough so I have complete coverage of the rotation.. I found the lowest point from turning the injection pump (with no belts on, just pump itself).. I set that as zero, and I placed the oem pulley lock tool in place.. I then loosened up the 4 bolts and rotated the injection pump towards then engine until my dial indicator read 96.. i then locked all the bolts down, and verified I was still at 96..

Thats the proper procedure? Am I even close at all?

I just dont know how to set the timing on that IDI pump without a belt..

Thanks!

[shwak23]

Why don't you have the timing belt on? Why would you need to set the timing without the belt on? You question makes no sense. Why are you referring to "belts". There is only one timing belt. The other belts are irrelevant to the timing process.
Put crank at TDC. Put cam at TDC. Put pump pulley so it lines up with the mark on the bracket.
Once you have your belt all installed and tightened. Then you time it using your timing gauge.

Google "vince waldon". His website has timing instructions that you should follow. Sounds like you are either over thinking this or trying to take shortcuts.

Sent from Outer Space!

[bajacalal]

You need to set the pump timing with the belt on, that's what you're trying to achieve, the correct relationship between the crank position and the injection pump position at TDC.

This is impossible with the belt off because very small amounts of movement, will affect the timing of the pump, it's not like a lot of gas engines where you can just set the cam and crank "close enough" and throw the belt on. The tolerances are way tighter than that, the amount of slack in the belt will affect the timing of the pump. When you tighten the belt you need to make sure the crank stays in the exact TDC position and that the cam remains at TDC (this is why the cam pulley is removable and adjustable). The very last thing you do is set the injection pump timing, after the belt is tensioned properly and the motor has been turned over a few times (by hand) to equalize any slack in the belt.

Edit: Are you also talking about an AUDI engine with the pump in the back, and the small belt which drives it? That's the only thing I can think of that uses "belts" instead of 1 belt. I think you still need to have everything at exact TDC, with belts installed to adjust the pump.

[Driggs]

Ok.. i think i understand what you guys are saying..

I for whatever reason was thinking that the pump itself had a "tdc" setting of sorts..


And bajac, this is the 1.6 cr audi.. same as the vw, but mounted vertically vs vw horizontally..

Ill slap the belt on, ensure tightness, ensure crank and cam are still at tdc, work the belt by hand then do the pump timing via the bentley..

Thanks!

I havent worked on a diesel before, just 5 cylinders my whole life.. I wanted to get some clarification before I did anything, for fear of banging a piston into a valve

[ORCoaster]

Driggs,  Two out of three doesn't make for a timed engine!!!!

You say:  The engine is at TDC, and the camshaft is locked in place in its proper position.

Both good unless you haven't loosened the cam pulley from the shaft.  That has to be loose. 

What is missing here is the pin in the IP.  The one that keeps it lined up at the proper position in reference to the TDC and Cam.  Review the Walden wonderfulness on the sticky and I think you will be set.  An 11 mm pin or 3/4 inch bolt generally gets it in the right spot and allows you to get the belt on in the right place and pull the tensioner in properly so that the TDC setting is unaffected.

WARNING WARNING Will Roberston!!!  Turn the engine over by hand before trying to start it.  If you can't get it to roll completely over a couple of times and check TDC on the Crank then something is rotten in Denmark.  If this is the first time on a VW don't damage it by jumping in the drivers seat and hitting the key.  1,000 posts here of the damage and carnage that will result.

Good luck and check it twice.  Naughty not nice may be waiting for you.  DAS

[damac]

The pump has a lockout pin to set the relationship of the timing belt.  I always find when the crank side of belt is fit, that with pump pin in, I have to rotate the pulley forward a notch so that as it tries to rotate backwords it will stay tight on the belt.  If you let it go to where it wants you will see the pump pulley can be off a tooth.

Also if you have never done the job before hopefully your pulley has a little diamond type indent marking that should point straight up.

For whatever reason I have come across multiple pullies over the years.  Some without a mark and also have 2 opposing holes the lock pin could go in, so totally possible to set pump 180 out if you just yanked the parts off and didn't pay attention.

Also remember to remove pump lock pin before setting the tensioner.

And simple tip to keep crank from walking is feed belt onto cam pulley last with it removed from snout.  Then you can roll it into place easy to get it started and it will seat as you finger tighten bolt before tensioning.

[Driggs]

Thanks everyone.. Did everything by the book.. I completely understand everything now.

Cam sprocket was loose. Set everything per the bentley.. Once the belt was on, everything made sense.

I just wasnt sure  about the pump at first, and now Im a-ok.

Startup will happen tomorrow!

Thanks everyone