5 speed to 4 speed swap?

[8v-of-fury]

Whats involved. Just the different lever between the car mounted shifter and the trans mounted shifter? Or does it even matter?

Would it not still have R 1 2 3 4 all in the same spots as the 5 speed? The only reason I ask is because I have a good idea in mind for it

[CRSMP5]

you can go 5 to 4 with no linkage changes..

[R.O.R-2.0]

the shift pattern is wider on a 4 speed.. thats why you cant find 5th gear when you use a 4spd linkage..

you are supposed to use 4 speed specific parts, but 5 spd parts may work..

you better have a 4A 4 spd, if you are taking a 5 spd out and swapping a 4 spd..

[8v-of-fury]

Yes Sir I Do.

GP would be even better.. only slightly though.

While were on the topic.. what year transmissions are the best out of all the 020's? No matter on year.

I know the pre-85 I think are the most robust.. and the post-85 are less robust but have a better something or other.. Mainly, what I am looking for is the transmissions of the 020's that AREN'T one wheel peelers when the drivers wheel slips a bit.

[R.O.R-2.0]

Yes Sir I Do.

GP would be even better.. only slightly though.

While were on the topic.. what year transmissions are the best out of all the 020's? No matter on year.

I know the pre-85 I think are the most robust.. and the post-85 are less robust but have a better something or other.. Mainly, what I am looking for is the transmissions of the 020's that AREN'T one wheel peelers when the drivers wheel slips a bit.

all 020's are 1 tire fryers..

and the 4 speeds are the toughest.

and 3.89/3.94 gears are soo close to the same its not funny. they use the same speedo drive gear.

idk tho dude, your gonna need more power to make that trans work right, unless you already have decent power.

i stand by what i said, driving a 4spd is like driving a wide ratio 5spd with a blown up 4th gear..

so, if 4th isnt low enough, and you have to shift down, you shift to 3rd, and go for 4500rpms all the way up the hill..

[CRSMP5]

pre 85 are non junket ones... LOL.. the parts that fail on them are easy.. 5th gear set.. and only if run low on oil..

i had 1 4 speed one... and in under a mo it had a 5 speed.. the 4th gear sucked like he says...

[R.O.R-2.0]

i would keep your 5 box in there buddy..

especially since you probably wont gain anything..

everything i have, that had a 4 box in it, now has a 5 box in it..

IMHO.. theres no such thing as a 4 spd that compares to a 5 spd..

the wide ratio trannies, the 1-3 split is pretty nice actually, but the jump from 3rd to 4th is HUGE. like i said, its like theres a gear missing..

[theman53]

I had an 84 rabbit n/a with the 4 speed. Don't know which one it had, I am assuming the 4A. The gear that sucked for me wasn't 3rd to 4th it was 2nd to 3rd. Third to fourth is about the same as most 5 speeds 4 to 5, but the second gear is the one that you had to scream and if you were on a hill especially with the n/a power I had, after you shift to 3rd you might end up shifting into 2nd again. I remember clearly after doing the gov mod on it doing 70 in 3rd gear. It didn't seem like it needed something in between 2nd and 3rd, as that would have been too much, it just needed the 5 speed. On the highway that 3rd and 4th gear were the best gear I have had in a VW.

[R.O.R-2.0]

I had an 84 rabbit n/a with the 4 speed. Don't know which one it had, I am assuming the 4A. The gear that sucked for me wasn't 3rd to 4th it was 2nd to 3rd. Third to fourth is about the same as most 5 speeds 4 to 5, but the second gear is the one that you had to scream and if you were on a hill especially with the n/a power I had, after you shift to 3rd you might end up shifting into 2nd again. I remember clearly after doing the gov mod on it doing 70 in 3rd gear. It didn't seem like it needed something in between 2nd and 3rd, as that would have been too much, it just needed the 5 speed. On the highway that 3rd and 4th gear were the best gear I have had in a VW.

it didnt have a 4A then.. not a chance.

those things had a WIDE jump to 4th gear. like i said, its like driving a 5 spd car with a blown up 4th gear.

[theman53]

3.94 3.45 1.75 1.06 0.70

Jump from 3rd at 1.06 to 4th at .70 is only .36. It wasn't real good, but as long as you didn't short shift it up a hill you were at least ok. You had to get up to 55/60 then shift into 4th you couldn't pull 4th from 45mph and accelerate.
The jump from 2nd to 3rd is 1.75 to 1.06 which is .69. That killed on the hills around here.

In no way am I saying it is a good option, but I didn't think the tall gears were the issue it was the middle.

[R.O.R-2.0]

3.94 3.45 1.75 1.06 0.70

Jump from 3rd at 1.06 to 4th at .70 is only .36. It wasn't real good, but as long as you didn't short shift it up a hill you were at least ok. You had to get up to 55/60 then shift into 4th you couldn't pull 4th from 45mph and accelerate.
The jump from 2nd to 3rd is 1.75 to 1.06 which is .69. That killed on the hills around here.

In no way am I saying it is a good option, but I didn't think the tall gears were the issue it was the middle.

for me, the lower gears were tits. i loved the 1-2-3 spacing of the 4A trans, just not the 4th gear jump. this trans had one of the HIGHEST second gears of any VW trans..

[DieselBalz]

I am curious as to why you are wanting to do this? I have swapped my AVX for an ASF specifically for better interstate cruising, and honestly, I feel it could still pull way past 80, but I tach out around there. So I am always interested in these types of threads.

What gain were ya lookin for? Or are ya just millin the idea around?

[8v-of-fury]

all 020's are 1 tire fryers..

and the 4 speeds are the toughest.

and 3.89/3.94 gears are soo close to the same its not funny. they use the same speedo drive gear.

idk tho dude, your gonna need more power to make that trans work right, unless you already have decent power.

i stand by what i said, driving a 4spd is like driving a wide ratio 5spd with a blown up 4th gear..

so, if 4th isnt low enough, and you have to shift down, you shift to 3rd, and go for 4500rpms all the way up the hill..

More Power.. Yess YESSS!. muhahaha.

Its only a 1000 rpm jump between third and fourth gear.. What are you guys on about? I could shift from third to fourth at 3000 and wind up in 4th right around 2000.. Right back at the peak of the torque. 

[8v-of-fury]

1200 rpm jump between 2nd and 3rd though :O How did non turbo 1.6's ever handle this transmission?

Also back to the 1 tire fryer thing.. I swear there is slightly more force keeping both wheels spinning in the later transmissions??

[theman53]

Yeah I think broke's site says something like the later trans had the 20% peliquin style kit in them. The earlier ones would rattle and only have around 2% preload or something like that.
Just today not trying to, I verified that my 80% kit still works at least sometimes. I tried to get up to the barn at the farm and when I let the clutch out it didn't move. When I backed up to get a run at it there were 2 peel marks in the mud.

And I think that is what trouble I had with mine. 1,200 isn't much, but if you are headed up a steep grade accelerating and shift into 3rd there were many times about 8 seconds later I would be shifting back into 2nd and flooring it. On the highway though I didn't try to accelerate in 4th unless I was at 65mph or so. Otherwise 3rd did pretty good up there to about 70. That was all the engine really wanted.