what is M-TDI?

[NintendoKD]

I am just an adventurer from the IDI side of the forum.  A bit curious about the TDI side, and since I am familiar with mechanical injection the next most logical step is to take a look at M-TDI right?  How is it different from TDI, and IDI? is there anywhere I can find more reading material.  Boring here in Afghanistan, need something to keep my mind sharp.

thanks,

Kevin

[theman53]

http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=6427.0

[R.O.R-2.0]

its basically the offspring of a TDI and IDI engine..

its the best of both worlds (kinda)

the simplicity of the IDI, with the toughness of the TDI..

[8v-of-fury]

Easier to just swap in the wiring and ECU. Generally cheaper too.. and in the end you have more power, more efficiency, and more tuning ability.

[blackdogvan]

Easier to just swap in the wiring and ECU. Generally cheaper too.. and in the end you have more power, more efficiency, and more tuning ability.

If you say so...

[8v-of-fury]

Well really, let's think of both setups.
Ultimately the ONLY reason you'd go M-TDI was to keep the cable throttle. And completely take away from what is good about the TDI.. The computer that monitors everything and adjusts accordingly in real time. There isn't really anything to gain by going mechanical.. (Unless I'm wrong). Your gonna have to do fab work to get the trans/shifter in anyway, what's a few more brackets and wires??

[Syncroincity]

Well really, let's think of both setups.
Ultimately the ONLY reason you'd go M-TDI was to keep the cable throttle. And completely take away from what is good about the TDI.. The computer that monitors everything and adjusts accordingly in real time. There isn't really anything to gain by going mechanical.. (Unless I'm wrong). Your gonna have to do fab work to get the trans/shifter in anyway, what's a few more brackets and wires??

Depends on what vehicle it's going into. Similar VW car, absolutely, you keep everything electronic. Older vehicle, ie Vanagon, Suzuki, Toyota truck, etc etc. the electronics turn into a huge pain in the a$$, not to mention being a hinderance to wet off-roading where the engine may be partially or totally submerged briefly.

[8v-of-fury]

It only takes 5 or so wires to run all the TDI wiring along side your stock wiring. Simplistic as it gets lol

[maxfax]

Fewer things to fail..   While we're at it, take that pesky turbo off of there!  

I'll totally agree withe the advantages of electronic engine management.. But after years of retrofitting EFI into classic cars, and dealing with the crap they keep throwing out there now.. I'm thrilled to perform the black arts of carb tuning...

[8v-of-fury]

Fewer things to fail..   While we're at it, take that pesky turbo off of there! 

I'll totally agree withe the advantages of electronic engine management.. But after years of retrofitting EFI into classic cars, and dealing with the crap they keep throwing out there now.. I'm thrilled to perform the black arts of carb tuning...

Simplistic as swapping in a complete FI system as it gets.

Carb knowledge evades me lol

[maxfax]

Simplistic as swapping in a complete FI system as it gets.

Pretty much..  Probably the most involved part of the swap is mounting the go pedal.. Other than that, plug and pray err play...


Although at some point in time when TDI's are plentiful like 1.6's are now (sort of) the M-TDI getup would be great for using one in some variety of industrial use..  Power units, or one heck of a lawnmower..

Carb knowledge evades me lol

I think that's why they appeal to me moreso than EFI now days...  Black art and Quadrajet FTW!!!

[blackdogvan]

There is no data out there that says the mtdi gets different mileage than etdi. I'm averaging 32mpg in my vanagon (pp520 nozzles, 11mm pump, 18psi) & on the van side of things all the tdi reports, e & m are in the same range. Some higher, some lower but mot one type at the top of bottom. (fyi gasser vans are 14-20mpg average)

Tune? Screwdriver or laptop, same tweaks.

M doesn't compensate for temp, if you can tell me what a huge difference this would make then we'd learn something. E protects your turbo at altitude from overspeed too I believe.

BTW Jeremy there are hotrod mtdi's getting better mpg than your posted average. Check out some of Hey & Tintin's posts.

I agree if you are swapping a tdi into a car that had one factory its pretty easy but in van/sami etc conversions the harness mods cost can approach the cost of a mtdi pump (actually Andrew has one for sale for less than a tdi vanagon harness)

[8v-of-fury]

I guess we have agreed on one point though it fully depends on the swap vehicle, and the circumstances at hand. Full donor car available, the swap in to most would be fairly straight forward.

What are the costs to convert a pump to M? During the conversion are there any pump modifications done? Or will it still be a stock pump?

At the end of the day, they cost about the same it seems.. It really only depends on what your putting it in.

My mileage in my sig was achieved with a 1.6 N/A with over 550k miles on it haven't gotten the tdi in yet, but I expect higher numbers for sure.

[R.O.R-2.0]

Fewer things to fail..   While we're at it, take that pesky turbo off of there!  

I'll totally agree withe the advantages of electronic engine management.. But after years of retrofitting EFI into classic cars, and dealing with the crap they keep throwing out there now.. I'm thrilled to perform the black arts of carb tuning...

kinda like a breathe of fresh air when you get to work on a vehicle with points and a carburator!

[maxfax]

kinda like a breathe of fresh air when you get to work on a vehicle with points and a carburator!

Well, I'll pass on breaker points whenever I can...  Some of the older import carbs with 10,000 vac lines I can pass on too... 

Jeremy you hit the nail on the head there..  Pends on the swap..  No sense in converting your 98 Jetta to MTDI, but when swapping a TDI to your lawnmower (I'm digging that idea BTW) MTDI would be ideal...