Twin plenum design questions? - Now finished 1Y based manifold

[regcheeseman]

Remember the manifold I chopped up 12 months ago?


well it got dragged off the back burner, cut open and filled with various detergents and put on the wok burner!


That shifted all the clag out of the runners so I could get the bits welded on

Duel plenum inlet to balance boost across the cylinders.

[R.O.R-2.0]

care if i copy the manifold for personal use?

[regcheeseman]

Sir, It would indeed be an honour.

 

[R.O.R-2.0]

THANK YOU!

im going to build one today.. i got plenty of gasser intakes..

im thinking the gasser manifold will probably work better right?

because i saw how dave cross built his, and he just used a stock 1.6TD manifold, but just the bottom half.. and then did just like what you did..

anyway, im gonna build me one!

[Powered by Spearco]

Well, lets see it..... .

[rolo]

is the slot parallel or tapered? hard to tell from pic with my eyes

[Bugsy_malone 666]

Ok I was looking through this lot and thought I may be able to build one (not from 100% alloy, as the plenums would be thick steel) and I was wondering what are the real advantages of this design? at what point will an engine need one?

Looking at the design and Audi's inlets surely there wont be that much imrpovement, as on the audi it tapers down at one end??

[regcheeseman]

what are the real advantages of this design?

Take a look at the standard TD manifold. You couldn't design worse if you tried.

is the slot parallel or tapered?

Parallel - area equal to the intercooler pipe's bore area

I don't know what's up with the images....they were there?

[Bugsy_malone 666]

what are the real advantages of this design?

Take a look at the standard TD manifold. You couldn't design worse if you tried.

is the slot parallel or tapered?

Parallel - area equal to the intercooler pipe's bore area

I don't know what's up with the images....they were there?

Well I know what your saying, but vw must have had some design idea.

However I started having a look accross the tinternet and found some nice twin plenum designs arbeit not all for 8v application:











what does seem a common theme amoung alot of the manifolds for racing/high performance use is that they have a large inlet one end and the plenum, be one or two, seems to be tapered so the far end of the manifold is smallest.

[R.O.R-2.0]

bottom manifold looks to be just a plain ol' SRI single plenum..

[Bugsy_malone 666]

bottom manifold looks to be just a plain ol' SRI single plenum..

It is a single plenum, but you can see the reduce size effect going on to even the pressure out even across a single plenum to even the pressure out.

[keaton]

i played with this awhile ago.  (kind hard to see).

rev1 no fins




Rev2 with fins(kind hard to see)






rev3 with fins (kind hard to see) and correct on center distentions

[Bugsy_malone 666]

Keaton I like the design of that!

Just a point though even though I am not an expert, would it not be better to have the end 25% of each end of the fin rows pointing outwards slightly? Or maybe the middle 50% straight and then the outer 25% of fines are all at slightly different angles, increasing as you near the end to truely direct flow to each port?

Is this something you could test? what software did you use?

Libbybapa, sorry if I had already covered ground covered by your post, even though I have scrolled through I obviously havent been paying attention!

I think for the most part I have been trying to understand the point of the manifold, followed by the gains achieved, I have a 1600NA that I was planning on bunging a Turbo on to create an 'ecoturbodiesel' which I have heard exists(apparently a turbo on whats effectively an NA engine) and because there is some time involved before I sort the engine out I thought it may be possible to build a manifold to increase effiecency further in the drive to build an MPG engine.

I think its probably better to copy an existing design from motorsport than guess! I can also understand how rather than a tapered inlet runner having a tapered slot may achieve the same idea. In some respects I also wonder if it would be as productive as to make a reverse of an exhaust header, where all pipes run together facing the incoming air rather than being 90deg to it.

[regcheeseman]

I have a 1600NA that I was planning on bunging a Turbo on to create an 'ecoturbodiesel' which I have heard exists(apparently a turbo on whats effectively an NA engine)

Your from the UK and this desire baffles me, the 1.6 ecoturbo as produced by VW was rubbish, as was it's 1.9 counterpart - there was nothing eco about it, you just had to drive it harder and thus use more fuel.

I've just fitted a 1.6 eco turbo in a caddy - thankfully I've now found a LDA pump for it

Why not go TDI if you want economy?


AS for the design of my manifold and the whole taper/no taper issue, I'd rather take a tried and tested design as used on a VW road car, than something designed for motorsport which has completely different requirements to mine.
Maybe I could have tapered the designs but I'm constrained by the reality of actually making the thing with hand tools alone and only basic material supplies.
As nice as the computer based hypothesising may look, I've had a Golf blocking my garage for 3 years now and would like to drive it !

[Bugsy_malone 666]

I have a 1600NA that I was planning on bunging a Turbo on to create an 'ecoturbodiesel' which I have heard exists(apparently a turbo on whats effectively an NA engine)

Your from the UK and this desire baffles me, the 1.6 ecoturbo as produced by VW was rubbish, as was it's 1.9 counterpart - there was nothing eco about it, you just had to drive it harder and thus use more fuel.

I've just fitted a 1.6 eco turbo in a caddy - thankfully I've now found a LDA pump for it

Why not go TDI if you want economy?


AS for the design of my manifold and the whole taper/no taper issue, I'd rather take a tried and tested design as used on a VW road car, than something designed for motorsport which has completely different requirements to mine.
Maybe I could have tapered the designs but I'm constrained by the reality of actually making the thing with hand tools alone and only basic material supplies.
As nice as the computer based hypothesising may look, I've had a Golf blocking my garage for 3 years now and would like to drive it !

well I want to find an LDA pump top, I have a good pump on my 1600NA and the engines alright (was in a caddy, a t25, then my bay van for a bit) now its spare and I want to have something that I can run on veg oil! I have a turbo kicking about which is a garret GT15 of a 1.7 astra van and from what I have read, you can just bung a turbo on and adjust the fueling as long as you dont go crazy, my fabrication is limited to grinder welder and steel fabrication. I was considering using the small White CO2 welding gas bottles to build the plenum from if there was an advantage.

Its more a case of not spending more than a gasket kit on my engine and building something thats efficient, doesnt have to be fast as such! I would say 1600TD would be fine for local driving and long distance cruising if running on veg. 1900TD would drop straight in my mk3, but then I'd have to go buy bits I dont already have