Injector Pump Timing Help

[tunedbandit]

Hi guys

Ive owned my VW T4 1.9TD ABL 2001 "Bosch Pump" for a few years now & its never been brill at starting first thing
EG: Needs the cold start lever pulling or use the throttle as she running lumpy for the first 10 seconds say
she gives off blue unburnt diesel smoke too on start up which leads me to thinking the IP timing is out,she as the slotted IP pulley,,iam in need of some advice on how to time her up

also iam running a twin tank wvo/svo so once she is warmed up she is flicked on to svo/wvo & ive been told a diesel will run better if its slightly advanced
EG: when using veg oil,,how true that is i dont know.
thanks for any help

PS once she is up & running she is clean in fact her last MOT the guy said she is clean as a whistle scoring 0.3 on the sniff test

[the caveman]

Do you have idea what the timing is at now? If not i would go through all the timing adjustments, including crank/cam to make sure it's to spec. Once the weather is warm, you shouldn't need to pull the timing advance or throttle to get it running. How about glow plugs? And yes, when running on WVO, it would help to have a bit more advance. The fact that it runs nice and clean once warm leads me to think it's glow plugs.

[tunedbandit]

i would say its a bit retarded due to the sort of unburnt diesel smoke on the first start up,its not mad amount but its not clean its just there & the van wont run smoothly straight off first 10 seconds its slightly gulping if that makes sense,,glow plugs were done 4/5 months since all 4,,iam going check all the timing marks once there in there correct positions & go from there,,,if the crank/cam line up cock on iam guessing i wont be able to put the drill bit through the IP,,then i"ll know the IP is out

[745 turbogreasel]

I have got better top speed on WVO, and attribute it to the pump advancing more with the thicker fuel.

[tunedbandit]

same here mate she flies i just wanted the pump timing checked for good measure

ive aligned all the timing marks today
 
EG:turn the crank till the fly wheel lines up

No:1 cylinder cam lobes are pointing up = TDC

slot in the cam shaft "Gear Box Side" Is horizontal to the cam cover surface

& the drill bit will fit in the timing slot on the IP pulley so that would tell me the
valve/crank/IP are timed up safely but probs could do with the IP fine tuning

[Mark(The Miser)UK]

i would say its a bit retarded due to the sort of unburnt diesel smoke on the first start up,its not mad amount but its not clean its just there & the van wont run smoothly straight off first 10 seconds its slightly gulping if that makes sense,,glow plugs were done 4/5 months since all 4,,iam going check all the timing marks once there in there correct positions & go from there,,,if the crank/cam line up cock on iam guessing i wont be able to put the drill bit through the IP,,then i"ll know the IP is out

A completely wrong assumption, I'm afraid.
You could in theory be running with completly correct/optimal timing and have the pump on it's side or, should it be physically possible upside down
Also, pump could appear perfectly aligned and  be dynamically wrong.  

You need to know the actual timing measurement to compare it with 'standard', the ball park setting of injector pressures [incase they are unusually low or high 'bars' compared with standard], and even then, timing by ear may be the final fiddle-factor you need

[tunedbandit]

i would say its a bit retarded due to the sort of unburnt diesel smoke on the first start up,its not mad amount but its not clean its just there & the van wont run smoothly straight off first 10 seconds its slightly gulping if that makes sense,,glow plugs were done 4/5 months since all 4,,iam going check all the timing marks once there in there correct positions & go from there,,,if the crank/cam line up cock on iam guessing i wont be able to put the drill bit through the IP,,then i"ll know the IP is out

A completely wrong assumption, I'm afraid.
You could in theory be running with completly correct/optimal timing and have the pump on it's side or, should it be physically possible upside down
Also, pump could appear perfectly aligned and  be dynamically wrong.  

You need to know the actual timing measurement to compare it with 'standard', the ball park setting of injector pressures [incase they are unusually low or high 'bars' compared with standard], and even then, timing by ear may be the final fiddle-factor you need

so its a DTI gauge then to get it cock on,,if so thats what iam wanting help regarding who's done there's how easy/any thing i need to know

[Mark(The Miser)UK]

Having said what I've said;... I could be wrong, as this set up is quite modern
I'm not sure of the ABL timing method.... I'll see if anything turns up.


Past research shows VEG oil has less power, but for Bosch type pumps gave better lubricity and less pumping leakages due to the higher viscosity, and fairly similar overall economy.
Lucas pumps [RIP] however didn't like it and died on occasion apparently...

[Vincent Waldon]

He's got the AAZ slotted pulley, so no need for a dial indicator if 0.90mm works ok... drill bit in the slot is the factory way to time it.

[tunedbandit]

He's got the AAZ slotted pulley, so no need for a dial indicator if 0.90mm works ok... drill bit in the slot is the factory way to time it.

there is the bolt in the rear of the pump for the dti gauge,,so maybe it needs fine tuning even though its all timed up manually so to speak,iam find the information very hard to came by for this dti timing of my pump,,ive put the shout out on lots of forums but know ones come forward with definite answers  

[Vincent Waldon]

Well there won't be any "definitive" answers about what the best timing is for your setup.. 'cause it's *your* setup!!   

You can time the pump to the factory setting of 0.90mm by using the hole in the front of the pulley... or get a dial indicator and time the pump conventionally thru the access port in the back... experimenting as you go to see what works best for your setup.  1.00 - 1.05 mm are the settings folks seem to head towards from a performance perspective... for straight diesel.

[tunedbandit]

Well there won't be any "definitive" answers about what the best timing is for your setup.. 'cause it's *your* setup!!  

You can time the pump to the factory setting of 0.90mm by using the hole in the front of the pulley... or get a dial indicator and time the pump conventionally thru the access port in the back... experimenting as you go to see what works best for your setup.  1.00 - 1.05 mm are the settings folks seem to head towards from a performance perspective... for straight diesel.

cheers Vincent ive just been reading about the IP timing found via google,,great read mate
yeah its one of those things ive got to get in there & tinker,,its not just the starting thats the problem not that it is a great problem there's also a point where it as a noticeable flat spot as your going through the gear,,thanks for your help