Author Topic: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build - Now with video!  (Read 86518 times)

Reply #105September 25, 2011, 09:25:19 am

MJF

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #105 on: September 25, 2011, 09:25:19 am »
Or change newer transmission with both patterns.
'74 VW Scirocco TD
'86 Audi 80q 1,9TDic
'01 Audi A6q 2,5TDI

Reply #106September 25, 2011, 09:26:27 am

R.O.R-2.0

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #106 on: September 25, 2011, 09:26:27 am »
yea, that would work GREAT, but i dont think there are NEARLY as many of those trannies around..
92 Jetta GLI - Black, 1.6D w/ GT2056V turbo..
86 GTI - 4 Door, Med Twilight Gray, Tow Machine..
86 Audi Coupe GT - Tornado Red, All Stock.. WRECKED.
89 Toyota 4Runner - Dark Grey Metallic, LIFTED!

Turbo: exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster.

Reply #107September 26, 2011, 05:21:46 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #107 on: September 26, 2011, 05:21:46 pm »
Quote
Or change newer transmission with both patterns.
I think MJF is talking about changing to the 01A and 01E transmissions that can accomodate both 4 and 5 cylinder engines.  There's lots of these trannys around (80/90/A4/S4, etc.), but they're not a bolt in replacement for the 016 transmission in the 4KQ.  Still, there's a lot of guys that have converted 016 cars to 01E, so I know it can be done.
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #108September 26, 2011, 08:13:27 pm

MJF

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #108 on: September 26, 2011, 08:13:27 pm »
Thats right. I have 01E from urS4 waiting to fitting in my 80. Now it has 4 cyl 016, but I've undestanded that those does not exist at states.
'74 VW Scirocco TD
'86 Audi 80q 1,9TDic
'01 Audi A6q 2,5TDI

Reply #109September 26, 2011, 08:25:58 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #109 on: September 26, 2011, 08:25:58 pm »
Quote
Now it has 4 cyl 016, but I've undestanded that those does not exist at states.
Didn't you guys get those 4-cyl 016 trannys in 2-door Audi 80s with quattro or something?  I've heard of a 016 that can accomodate the 4-cyl bolt pattern, but never actually seen one.
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #110September 26, 2011, 08:44:14 pm

MJF

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #110 on: September 26, 2011, 08:44:14 pm »
It's stock 80 quattro 4 door transmission with 4,55 gearing. Originally 90hp 1,8 carb engine.
'74 VW Scirocco TD
'86 Audi 80q 1,9TDic
'01 Audi A6q 2,5TDI

Reply #111September 26, 2011, 08:48:32 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #111 on: September 26, 2011, 08:48:32 pm »
That's cool.  I've never heard of transmission with 4.55 gearing in these cars.  But with a 90HP carb'd engine, I can see why it would need one.
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #112October 18, 2011, 05:49:53 pm

turboquattro

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #112 on: October 18, 2011, 05:49:53 pm »
What you need is a nice 01E from a Euro TDI.
I have one in stock right now... 4.11 gears too.
It would be around 2000 rpm at 60mph.  ;D

Cheers
Martin Pajak

newbielink:http://www.quattro.ca [nonactive]

1982 Audi Ur-quattro, SQ project
1983 Audi 80 quattro, Euro 2-Tür
1984 Audi Ur-quattro, 20vt with 6-speed
1993 Audi 90 CS quattro, 2.5 TDI with 6-speed

Reply #113October 18, 2011, 07:22:47 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #113 on: October 18, 2011, 07:22:47 pm »
Hey Martin, thanks for the offer.  Now that my release bearing is starting to fail, and the gear chatter is driving me crazy, I'm planning on a tranny swap in the next month or so.

I've really thought hard about swapping in a 01E, but all told, it would be close to $6000 for the swap which would include rebuilt tranny, dual mass flywheel, clutch, PP, 01E-specific aluminum brackets (extremely rare for the type 44 cars), rubber mounts, S4 shifter box, axles, bearings, propeller shaft, slave cylinder, hydraulic line, shipping, etc.

For ease of installation, and to keep the price down, I think I'm going to have Scott at Advanced Automotion build a diesel-friendly 01A for me though.  I can get a 0.641 5th gear that will give me ~28 MPH/1000 RPM while keeping the 4.11 gears.  That's compared to the ~21 MPH/1000 RPM I'm at right now.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 11:21:47 pm by rabbid79 »
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #114October 18, 2011, 11:27:50 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #114 on: October 18, 2011, 11:27:50 pm »
BTW, have any of you guys seen this Audi-turned-snowplow - A.K.A. the "Plaudi"? http://www.motorgeek.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=43016&hilit=plaudi

I think it would be cool to build one, but with some 5-cyl turbo diesel love. ;)
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #115January 02, 2012, 08:22:48 pm

rabbid79

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #115 on: January 02, 2012, 08:22:48 pm »
Time for a major update:

One year and 8000 miles since I finished the motor swap, and not a single issue, until about 4 months ago when I started hearing what I thought was a noisy release bearing.  When I pushed in the clutch pedal, it would make some kind of grinding noise.  I monitored it, and the noise was steadily getting louder day by day.  To postpone the inevitable, I tried limping it along by speed shifting, and not keeping the clutch pressed it at intersections, etc.  (The reason I do this is because I can't stand the gear chatter when it idles in neutral.)

So after about 2 months of this, I was heading out one morning, got to the bottom of the street, and BAM, it sounded like all hell was breaking loose inside the bellhousing.  I turned around and parked it in a strategic spot in the garage with lots of room to work around the car, knowing that it wasn't coming out until the transmission had been replaced.  I have always said that if it ever came to pulling out the transmission, I would upgrade to one with better ratios along the way.

A few days later, I started digging in to it.  It took 2 days to actually get the transmission removed.  It's a pretty labor-intensive process, especially when you don't have a lift.  Anyway, I discovered that it wasn't the release bearing or pilot bearing that was making noise, but a strap which had broken on the pressure plate.  It proceeded to flop around inside the bell housing and left some pretty nice grooves, and lots of "sparkles".

After a lot of back and forth on which transmission to use, I ultimately went with a 01A from a '89 90 Quattro.  It has the same 4.11:1 final drive and 1st and 2nd gears as my old one, but roughly 10% higher 3rd, 4th, and 5th.  Still not great, but a step in the right direction.  Also, in an attempt to put an end to the noisy gear chatter, I purchased a dual-mass flywheel from a '93 Audi S4 application.  Interestingly, it uses a solid disc.  Since I never abused the old clutch, I suspect that the high compression of the diesel engine is what ultimately lead to the pressure plate failure.  The DM flywheel should hopefully help to dampen things out, and save the new PP from a similar fate.

In preparing the new transmission, I had to swap on the 108 mm axle flanges from the original box, since the "new" box had 100 mm flanges.  I also replaced the input shaft seal, the 3 output shaft seals, and various o-rings here and there.  The original rubber transmission mounts had also started cracking, so I ordered new ones.  I’m also doing the slave and master cylinders "while I’m in there".

This work to the tranny required the purchase of many new application-specific tools.  I have gathered quite a large assortment now, and have decided to start a little side business renting them out.

Hopefully I'll be driving it again by next weekend.

Offending pressure plate.


Original box completely covered in grime.  Still, it was amazingly clean on the inside.  I chopped off the input shaft to use as a pressure plate alignment tool, instead of using those cheap plastic tools that are usually included with a clutch kit.  Before I scrap it, I also stole a couple more parts off of it like the axle flanges, senders, torsen diff., front diff., and front diff cover.


Parts and new tools:


"New” box cleaned up, filled up with fresh Motul, seals replaced, and ready to go:


New flywheel installed and inner CV cups cleaned up:
« Last Edit: January 02, 2012, 09:13:23 pm by rabbid79 »
'15 WRX
Parts for 2.0 TD build - Now looking for suitable car to put it in.

Reply #116January 06, 2012, 12:24:58 am

Toby

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #116 on: January 06, 2012, 12:24:58 am »
it takes a TINY shot of ether to make it run.. some say i probably destroyed it from ether, but usually, wouldnt your head gasket let go before you bent a rod, or blew a pre-chamber out, or cracked main caps? dunno why it would happen soo easy on a TD5..

Not really. I have seen dozens of ether wasted diesels w/o head gasket issues.

The idea of 2.0TD 4TQ or 4000 is intriguing, however. 

Reply #117January 06, 2012, 02:09:33 pm

R.O.R-2.0

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #117 on: January 06, 2012, 02:09:33 pm »
it takes a TINY shot of ether to make it run.. some say i probably destroyed it from ether, but usually, wouldnt your head gasket let go before you bent a rod, or blew a pre-chamber out, or cracked main caps? dunno why it would happen soo easy on a TD5..

Not really. I have seen dozens of ether wasted diesels w/o head gasket issues.

The idea of 2.0TD 4TQ or 4000 is intriguing, however. 

dude, weve been over this too many times.. its fine.. i dont even care anymore. i paid almost nothing for the car, and if i killed it, big deal.. its my car..

the engine needs a FULL REBUILD anyways, so its not like it even matters. ill let you know how bad i killed it once i pull it apart..

im leaning towards it being fine tho.. it never DIRECTLY ingested ether.. just a shot on the air filter..

but if its dead, so be it.. learning experience..
92 Jetta GLI - Black, 1.6D w/ GT2056V turbo..
86 GTI - 4 Door, Med Twilight Gray, Tow Machine..
86 Audi Coupe GT - Tornado Red, All Stock.. WRECKED.
89 Toyota 4Runner - Dark Grey Metallic, LIFTED!

Turbo: exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster.

Reply #118January 07, 2012, 01:49:29 pm

Toby

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #118 on: January 07, 2012, 01:49:29 pm »
Oh, I doubt that you ruined it with such a small shot of ether. It does not take much to kill one though, if the stars are all aligned correctly. On the good side most "ether" these days is mostly some kind of light oil like WD40. They call it "upper cylinder lubricant". Even JDs own stuff for cold (<40*F) starting its old tractors is only 80% anymore. Beware of that old can sitting on the shelf, though.

I would like to find a 5G TD block myself. I have a complete very low miles (5000) motor with rusted bores. The virtually new .50mm over pistons would make an old TD motor into a new one.

Reply #119January 08, 2012, 09:29:15 am

R.O.R-2.0

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Re: Audi Quattro Turbo Diesel Build
« Reply #119 on: January 08, 2012, 09:29:15 am »
im gonna drop my TD5 in a 1st gen toyota 4runner.. eventually.
92 Jetta GLI - Black, 1.6D w/ GT2056V turbo..
86 GTI - 4 Door, Med Twilight Gray, Tow Machine..
86 Audi Coupe GT - Tornado Red, All Stock.. WRECKED.
89 Toyota 4Runner - Dark Grey Metallic, LIFTED!

Turbo: exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster.