shop time for a timing belt?

[sethyboy85]

how much time should it take a shop to put a timing belt on a 85 NA 1.6l D?

My guy took 3hrs 1/2 (he really didn't want to put a new head on has only done a few but took his time to do it right)  but he is honest and will most likely only charge me what the "norm" is... so how long is that?

[DVST8R]

With some one to spot the timming mark I can do it in 30 minutes on average . That is on a car without ac, but with powersteering. If you have ac add some time, or if you don't have powersteering subtract some.  That is with proper pump tools and air tools, with nothing breaking or striping :roll:

[fatmobile]

Might as well change the I-shaft seal and o-ring while you are in there. As well as the cam seal and a new idler pully.
 New crank seal and bolt while you are at it, is a good idea but that's a pain.
 Good time for a new injection pump shaft seal too.
 These would add to the time but could save lots of time later.

[chrissev]

how much time should it take a shop to put a timing belt on a 85 NA 1.6l D?

My guy took 3hrs 1/2 (he really didn't want to put a new head on has only done a few but took his time to do it right)  but he is honest and will most likely only charge me what the "norm" is... so how long is that?

1/2 hour is about right for a timing belt.  It's an easy job.  Only thing that occasionally makes it hard is if the engine has poor compression and the crank keeps moving past TDC.  That can be annoying.  It's a quick job.  If you timed them, I'm sure the average VW mechanic could do it in under 20 minutes.  

Did your guy replace your tensioner as well?  No point replacing the belt and not the tensioner.  Waste of time.  Should replace both.

[dieselweasel]

Flat rate book time for a timing belt on that car is at least 2 hrs.

[Master ACiD]

make sure he has the propler tools to time the cam, hold the injection pump sprocket in place, adjust the injection pump, and and tension the cam belt tensioner.

he could probably get by good enough with screwdrivers and stuff for most of the tools but you really need the dial indicator adapter for the injection pump. doing it by eye usually results in retarded timing.

[935racer]

The cam lock is really all that is TOTALLY necessary, and even then you couldliekly do a belt job without one although that is for professionals only. I used to be a mechanic for mercedes benz and we would "hand time" the injection pumps. You can actually time the pump within spec with a little bit of practise fairly easily and you don't need the dial indicator. The only thing is, you need to know when to stop when you are rocking the pump (during hand timing), I watched a fellow mechanic hit the run away on an MB, boy that was loud, luckily he managed to pinch the vaccuum line on the pump for the shutoff solenoid before the engine did its self in. And yeah I know its weird but mb does use a vaccuum line for the on off pump solenoid.

Dvst8r and I could likely do a tbelt together in about 10 minutes... yes we do ALOT of them.

[BlackTieTD]

(side note: hehe, notice how the shops who are supposed to be the 'experts' charge 2 to 3 hours for this job... yet the hardcore guys on this site who are the real experts can do it in 10 to 30 minutes? this type of thing is the very reason i stopped going to shops years ago. i love you guys   )

[Master ACiD]

no offense meant but i am reasoning that you do not understand what "shop time" is.

theres some sort of book that a mechanic can look into to see the pre determined ammount of time it could take to perform some form of work on a car. lets say for instance, that book says a vw timing belt is a 3 hour job.

now this mechanic will charge the customer for 3 hours, even if it only takes him 30 minutes, he still charges 3 hours worth of time. if the mechanic messes somthing up and needs to take longer than 3 hours, lets say the belt tensioner stud snaps off for example, and he spends 5 hours repairing thestud and replacing the timing belt, he still should only charge 3 hours.

if he completes the job in 30 minutes, he is free to move onto another car and make more money on the next customer while still billing the vw customer for those original 3 hours. this is where a mechanic can make some real good money, if they are quick on the job, accurite and dont make mistakes some mechanics can get 3 or 4 customers paying, all at the same time.

[BlackTieTD]

are you responsding to me?

this is the exact reason why i no longer go to any shop. when i worked at the dealership i watched them overcharge for simple jobs all day long... i'd talk to the customers and hear stories like "i can't really afford to spend $1000 on my brakes, i'm just a university student... but they say it needs to be done!" ...and you're pretty much handcuffed in any advice you can give because you are an employee representing the dealership. now that i don't work for VW anymore i try to warn as many people as i can!  :lol:

[dieselweasel]

Dealership techs are trained to repair vehicles to factory spec.  Things they know that could be let go are quoted on anyway.  They also use dealership parts that are more expensive.  Any dealership will be like this, regardless of manufacturer.  I'm not knocking dealerships...you pay top dollar for expert service, in theory anyway.  

When taking shop, or "book" times into consideration, you have to remember that the tech has to go find the car, bring it into the shop, diagnose it, often wait several minutes for parts, perform the repair, then complete some sort of service report.  The vehicle then often has to be washed and parked.  The actual repair may only take half an hour but there are other tasks the tech has to do.  
The higher customer pay times also help make up for poorly paying jobs, such as many warranty jobs and oil changes.  I spoke to one guy who worked at a Chrysler dealership where an lof paid .2 of an hour.  That's 12 minutes to perform the job from start to finish.  

I agree that if you can fix your car yourself you'll save a lot of coin.  I've saved hundreds, maybe thousands performing repairs myself.

[zyewdall]

Dealership techs are trained to repair vehicles to factory spec.  Things they know that could be let go are quoted on anyway.  

I've found that as you drive older and older vehicals, you have to find different mechanics than the dealers because they do try to bring everything to "new" condition.  I took my older subaru to a shop (not even the dealer) that specialized in subarus, and they told me to it wasn't worth fixing for $1,500.  I had to take it to a little shop (that also had lots of experience with subarus, especially old ones), and he got it running again for $350.  Certainly not in brand new condition, but I didn't expect that in a car that old.  I just wanted another 8 months from it.

[chrissev]

Flat rate book time for a timing belt on that car is at least 2 hrs.

took me about 1/2 hour when I last did it.  It was the final thing I did after I replaced the injection pump.  Very easy to do.  I can't imagine what would take 2hrs, unless the mechanic is resetting the pump timing, which only takes another ten minutes or so.

[chrissev]

are you responsding to me?

this is the exact reason why i no longer go to any shop. when i worked at the dealership i watched them overcharge for simple jobs all day long... i'd talk to the customers and hear stories like "i can't really afford to spend $1000 on my brakes, i'm just a university student... but they say it needs to be done!" ...and you're pretty much handcuffed in any advice you can give because you are an employee representing the dealership. now that i don't work for VW anymore i try to warn as many people as i can!  :lol:

So true.  worst I ever got scammed by a VW dealer was when the front shocks went on my fox.  It was january and I had no indoor area to work on the car so I had to get it done at the dealer.  They noticed that the ball joints were also bad and wanted to replace them also so I said OK as long as you're in there, just do it.  They charged me to remove and reinstall the front end TWICE!  Once for the shock replacement, once for the balljoints.  I know that they didn't put the shocks in, reassemble everything, then take everything apart again and do the balljoints.  But they said those were the book rates for those two jobs.  I was so pissed I never went back there again.