Is it possible to make a 1.6L IDI into a TDI ?

[VW]

OK, I am sure I will be bashed for this but I didn't find any topics about this question. It is Probably not even possible but Could one use say an 85 1.6L IDI TD bottom end and the top end of a 97 1Z 1.9L TDI to make a 1.6L TDI? Of couse I am also saying one could or would need all the other parts from both engines to make this work such as the Wiring Harness, Computer, IP, Brackets, Pulleys etc etc...

I am asking this because I know the 1.9L TDI can actually get better mileage than a 1.6L IDI TD. So it makes me wonder if one can get 45-50mpg with a 1.9L TDI, what could one get from a 1.6L TDI?

(The goal is what a Computer Calibrated 1.6l TDI could achieve vs it being just a mechanically Controlled IDI engine)

I know there are much easier ways to gain mileage etc etc... What I am asking is about the possibility of this idea being able to work not an actual cost effectiveness of such an idea.

I don't need those responses saying why waste your time etc etc... I just wanted to know if it could be done and if not, what are the reason(s) of why not? Such as the Computer can not be made to run the 1.6L correctly, bolt patterns are incorrect, clearances etc etc...

Thanks in advance.

[jtanguay]

it can be done, but there might need some fab work.  the whole TDI head will be required, and should just bolt right on.  TDI pistons are required, and the 1.4L TDI 3 banger pistons will work (same bore, stroke).  not sure if the pins will work though, and that is where some fab work might come in.

i've never thought about running a computer in this type of setup, as it would need a special tune otherwise it would be injecting too much fuel IMO.  a mech TDI pump would be the way to go.  ETKA is listing the pistons for more than $100 each though, so its not very cheap.  apparently Prothe bought a bunch on the cheap, but doesn't have them listed on his site (he's looking into the same conversion).  worn engines will require sleeving though to bring the compression back up.

i like the idea of a 1.6L TDI, but i'm in love with the torque from my 1.9TDI.  i also think the better fuel economy of the 1.9L engine is the extra displacement, and the low rpm's required.  high rpm's just eat fuel.

[Turbinepowered]

I'm considering going this route for the Fox engine. She'll be donating the refreshed 1.5 to the Dasher, and I've been hunting a hydraulic 1.6 block for the intention of going frankengine with a 1.9 head and metal headgasket... wouldn't be that hard to source a set of pistons from Europe, resleeve the 1.6 bottom end, and go from there.

1.6 TDI in a lightweight Fox 5-speed, 3.89 final drive and .60 fifth gear would be a nice highway cruiser. Keep the electronics for VNT control and the coasting in gear fuel cutoff. Would be sweeeet.

[Turbinepowered]

If you can source oversize 1.2TDI pistons then you could simply bore and not need to sleeve the block.

I think I still have the info for an individual from TDIClub that could source oversized 1.2 pistons for ~$120 apiece. Be worth the investment, I'd think.

$480 for pistons, $200 for a completely cleaned, bored and honed hydraulic block, rebuild a TDI head, get the crank sprocket conversion done on a 1.6 crankshaft for extra awesomeness, headstuds, main studs and fresh bearings and seals all around. $1500 or so for the engine, maybe $2000?

[Turbinepowered]

Sounds good to me.  Remember, if starting with a 1.6TD you're still going to need to source the injectors, lines, glow plugs and mTDI pump.

Use a standard electronic TDI pump if possible, get a chip tune to take care of the decrease in displacement. I'll need to get one anyway to ditch the immobilizer, right?

[VW]

You Guys Rock!! You totally get the idea and No Flaming.. I love this forum..

 I guess you are right, I am a little gun shy about asking ideas. I guess I am just so used to those A-holes on other forums that just love to bash someone for thinking outside the box.

I like where this is going so far too. Lots of good stuff. I am learning quite a bit . Thank you.

I didn't believe this was the first time it was ever thought of but had no idea there had been this much already discovered. Very cool:)

I too love my Jetta TDI but also hold a lot of love for all VW Diesels especially the 1.6TD. Simple as dirt and last forever but if one could be tuned to be much more efficient with TDI parts.... it might be worth doing?? 60-65mpg would be ultra sweet:)

Thanks again everyone

[jtanguay]

don't forget if staying with the electronics, you need to drill the block for the crank position sensor (maybe even build the area up with some welds and machine it down... lots of work) thats just another reason why its easier to go mTDI.

oversize 1.2 pistons would be highly ideal!  for a refreshed 1.6 its usually $3000-4000.  so diy, save, and get a much better engine.  best way would be to buy a complete 1Z/AHU head with the valve cover, injectors, and if possible, the injector lines.  shouldn't be more than $500, unless its in pristine condition.

[Turbinepowered]

don't forget if staying with the electronics, you need to drill the block for the crank position sensor (maybe even build the area up with some welds and machine it down... lots of work) thats just another reason why its easier to go mTDI.

oversize 1.2 pistons would be highly ideal!  for a refreshed 1.6 its usually $3000-4000.  so diy, save, and get a much better engine.  best way would be to buy a complete 1Z/AHU head with the valve cover, injectors, and if possible, the injector lines.  shouldn't be more than $500, unless its in pristine condition.

I honestly don't mind having to delve into the 1.6 block to mod it for accepting TDI electronics; the Fox is going to become my mileage monster anyway, and there are lots of neat things that would be very, very difficult to do with straight mechanical drive. Such as the no-fuel on overrun, and the throttle independent VNT control.