Author Topic: IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)  (Read 6059 times)

Reply #15December 04, 2008, 07:58:07 pm

yoopercharged

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2008, 07:58:07 pm »
Hi Giles

I used the 9mm Chinese  :x  rotor from Prothe.  What Liner are you referring to?
Andy
'86 Jetta 1.6 TD
'83 Mercedes 300SD
'87 Landcruiser
'71 Super Beetle
'95 Hyundai Golf Cart

Reply #16December 05, 2008, 05:57:45 am

Giles@PerformanceDiesel

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Head and Rotor?
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2008, 05:57:45 am »
Quote from: "yoopercharged"
Hi Giles

I used the 9mm Chinese  :x  rotor from Prothe.  What Liner are you referring to?


I hope that you didn't mismatch your head and rotors?
why would you pull your Bosch 9mm and install a chinese 9mm?

these pieces are matched together you cannot swap them.

the Liner is the transfer pump outer ring
it has 3 holes in it
the middle hole faces the governor cover and the other two holes
have different spacing to the inner surface.
looking from the drive end of the pump the hole with the larger
distance from the inner liner surface is on the right side of the drive
shaft.
Giles

Reply #17December 05, 2008, 05:18:01 pm

yoopercharged

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2008, 05:18:01 pm »
The head, rotor and control collar were replaced as a unit.  I used them because I did not know they were Chinese.  (Any where to get good parts?)  I replaced them because I wanted to do the job right the first time.  (It's a fault of mine; I tried anyways).  I assembled the liner per Andrew Libby's post. http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6694.  I have been unable to get diesel to pump through the pump.  I pump it through with a mity vac pump on the output port.  I haven't seen any fuel in the return to tank line yet, if that is any help.
Andy
'86 Jetta 1.6 TD
'83 Mercedes 300SD
'87 Landcruiser
'71 Super Beetle
'95 Hyundai Golf Cart

Reply #18December 05, 2008, 11:56:09 pm

Quantum TD

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2008, 11:56:09 pm »
I just redid a pump the other day. I tried to simply reseal it. Everything went fine until I had to replace the green o-ring on the distribution head. I did it carefully, but even so, the cam-rollers slipped out of place. After I finished the whole reseal, I tried to spin the pump over by hand (with the sprocket on there), and it wouldn't turn over. I ended up pulling the whole thing apart to reveal that in fact, the rollers had slipped out of place.

I reaseembled following the images on vwdieselparts.com forum. They're good to a point. It turns out, I put the control collar on backwards, and had indexed the cam-plate 180 out in relation to the input shaft (double whammy). In the end, I gave up for a week, and then returned to it with fresh eyes. Here are some observations on that fiasco.

With the cam plate 180 degrees out from the input shaft, and the control collar on backwards:

1) The pump would pump just fine. Although I didn't have a clear line on the return hose, I could see fuel being sucked thru the intake hose

2) There was practically no juice coming out of the delivery valves. It almost seemed like the pump kept building pressure, but was blowing it out of the lower seals and thru the return hose (I ended up replacing the lower seals out of fear afterwards). NO start

3) So, the vanes were working fine, but the fuel was not being delivered properly. The cam plate being out probably did not affect anything so long as I knew it was out, all I had to do was set the IP sprocket 180 degrees out (easy to do on a Rabbit, not so easy on later models).

While I'm no expert, by any stretch, I'd heed the advice of Giles, Zukgod, and Libbybapa. Take it apart again, clean everything, make sure the springs are in their correct place, make sure the came-plate is indexed properly, and make sure the control collar is facing the right way. As shiity as the Chinese parts are, I highly doubt that they'd prevent your car/pump from working. Their failure is longevity. While I have no personal experience in the matter, I've heard enough sucess stories (short term) using them to suspect that they work, although the quality is a bit inferior.

I did a bench test (a heavy-duty electric drill coupled to the 19mm nut on the injection pump, after the sprocket had been installed). Fill the pump, put a leader to a CLEAN bottle of diesel fuel, and feed the return lines back to the same bottle. Spin the pump over with the drill, and you should see spritzes of fuel coming out of the delivery valves (you might have to hang a piece of paper in front of the valves to see it). In order to get the fuel flowing, you may need to actuate the governor a bit. If everything 's in order, you should see fuel coming out.

The only thing I can think of is:
1) Vanes are stuck. They're not pumping enough volume/creating enough pressure. Was the car running before on this pump?
2) Too complicated for my feeble mind: refer to higher powers like Giles etc.

Reply #19December 10, 2008, 03:30:26 am

yoopercharged

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #19 on: December 10, 2008, 03:30:26 am »
Giles,

The pump is off right now and I plan on going through it tonight.  Would you recommend going back to the 1.6 cam plate and the dist head and rotor?  I replaced the feed pump as well.  The cam plate looks to be oriented properly.     THANKS
Andy
'86 Jetta 1.6 TD
'83 Mercedes 300SD
'87 Landcruiser
'71 Super Beetle
'95 Hyundai Golf Cart

Reply #20December 10, 2008, 07:12:27 am

zukgod1

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #20 on: December 10, 2008, 07:12:27 am »
I like Giles idea of reinstalling the 1.6 cam.

The 1.9 cam requires different return springs. If you are using the original 1.6 springs it will be damn hard to get it to run at all, don't ask how I know.

I have the Bosch part# at home for the springs needed in conjunction with the 1.9 cam.

I'll bet Giles would sell you a set though.
dan

99 Golf TDI (now CNG powered) , 82 TD Caddy

Reply #21December 15, 2008, 07:45:32 pm

yoopercharged

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IDI Rebuild No Start (help please)
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2008, 07:45:32 pm »
Interesting info about the 1.9 cam.  It's too bad Prothe doesn't tell you that info when he sells you a cam.  I'm still waiting on a couple gov/throttle arm shaft bushings that I ordered from him a month ago.  Someone forgot to send them, I guess.  They also forgot to send the glow plugs when I ordered the IP parts.  Not too impressed with that place.  Any one used those VSP glow plugs he sells?  I have four on my counter that I am afraid to use.  Anyways, I took the pump apart and found that everything was as it should have been inside.  I reinstalled the 1.6 camplate and the original head and rotor.  It runs now.  Woo hoo!!  Any good place to get QUALITY IP parts from in the future?
Andy
'86 Jetta 1.6 TD
'83 Mercedes 300SD
'87 Landcruiser
'71 Super Beetle
'95 Hyundai Golf Cart