IDI Rebuild No Start (help please) - page 1 - IDI Engine - VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.

• IDI Rebuild No Start (help please) by yoopercharged on 07 Nov, 2008 16:35
• I'm having no start issues with my injection pump (86 VW Jetta 1.6 TD) .  I resealed it (Viton kit)  and installed new feed pump, rotor, and cam plate (1.9 TD) from Prothe. When cranking, I am only getting fuel out of the bottom two rotor output ports.  I have double checked that the accelerator lever is actuating the fuel metering control rod plunger.  The metering rod is turning with the main shaft.  The cam plate pin is in line with the keyways on the main shaft.  I have pulled the spring and plunger off the cut off solenoid to eliminate that source.  I have turned the volume screw and all I can do is vary the output of the bottom 2 from a straight stream to big drips.  Any idea of what could be wrong?   :cry:
  
  ps I will be out of town until Mon Nov 17th.
• #1 by jtanguay on 07 Nov, 2008 18:25
• have you filled the pump with diesel/oil to prime it??? if not it will take forever...
• #2 by yoopercharged on 09 Nov, 2008 20:14
• Absolutely.  I primed it via a mity vac pump on the outlet port (fuel return).  When I opened the top to double check everything it had plenty of fuel in it.  It seems odd that I only get fuel coming out of the bottom two rotor outlet ports (to the injector lines).  I'm quite sure that the outlet ports are assembled correctly but I will double check those next Mon the 17th when I return.  The rotor was a Chinese one from Prothe.  I've never heard of a bad Chinese part, but it could happen.  Other than that I'm pretty stumped.
• #3 by arb on 11 Nov, 2008 06:42
• I have an electric primer pump before my filter. I noticed it was great about filling the clear supply lines, filter, and IP, and return lines, but would not fill the high pressure lines. I had to do it the old school way and crack the line nuts at the injectors and crank the engine until they were spouting fuel. The #2 & #3 were first.  I have not yet cranked until #1 & #4 are primed.
  
  So, are you sure your vac pump is simply only priming the IP and the return lines? Its so easy to crack the injector line nuts and see.
• #4 by zukgod1 on 11 Nov, 2008 07:03
• Did you put the control collar on the correct direction? Little hole faces the front of the pump/ away from the pump head.
  It wont build pressure if this is on backwards I don't believe.
  
  If that's on correctly then I would just crack the lines and crank crank crank.
  
  Turn the max fuel screw in a long ways, like WAY past where you think it should be then crank it over. Once fuel starts to come out the lines even just a little back the max fuel screw out so it doesn't run away when it starts.
  
  I'm rereading your post and you mention fuel is only coming out the bottom 2 ports, this tells me maybe you don't have the lines on?  if you don't have your lines on the car you need to while bleeding. It wont prime with out the hard lines on the car.
• #5 by yoopercharged on 11 Nov, 2008 14:29
• I originally primed via the vac pump with the injector lines installed and tightened on both ends.  I cracked the injector lines at the injectors to see if any fuel was coming out and I only saw that two were wet.  I then removed the lines from the IP to see what was happening there.  Only the bottom two would pump out any fuel.  I'm pretty sure that I put the control collar in the right direction, but it is possible.
• #6 by zukgod1 on 11 Nov, 2008 15:29
• Well you can pull the top off on the car and look in there to see if it's correct. If not you already know what needs to be done  
  
  At least you can eliminate the collar.
• #7 by yoopercharged on 25 Nov, 2008 16:25
• I've found a problem and fixed it.  I goofed up and put two shims on each of the upper outlet ports on the rotor.  Now I get fuel out of all 4 ports.  I hooked up the injector lines and cracked them open at the injectors.  Getting fuel at each injector union.  Still no start.  I tried to pull start it tonight and still no go.  I did not see or smell raw fuel out of the exhaust.  I could not tell when I was pull starting, if there was diesel coming out the exhaust.  (it was dark out).  Any ideas?  I plan on checking the timing again.  Other than that, I'm running out of ideas.
• #8 by burn_your_money on 25 Nov, 2008 18:41
• Where did you get the extra 2 shims from?
• #9 by yoopercharged on 25 Nov, 2008 18:58
• Shims-r-us of course.  I got them from another injection pump because I thought I had lost them while cleaning.
• #10 by zukgod1 on 25 Nov, 2008 19:44
• You lined the dot on the cam up with the keyway in the pump shaft?
  You made sure that little 2mm shim was in between the rotor and cam?
  You are sure the control collar is on correctly?
• #11 by yoopercharged on 26 Nov, 2008 12:55
• Quote from: "zukgod1"

  You lined the dot on the cam up with the keyway in the pump shaft?  YES
  You made sure that little 2mm shim was in between the rotor and cam? YES
  You are sure the control collar is on correctly?

  would I still get fuel out if this was on incorrectly.  I haven't removed the IP to go into it again.  Pete at emiata mentioned removing the throttle arm to make sure the gov shaft was in the correct location.
• #12 by zukgod1 on 26 Nov, 2008 13:01
• The throttle arm could be part of it but if that was the case you could hold it wide open and get fuel unless it off like a half a turn.
  
  Yes it you left out the 2mm shim, didn't line up the dot on the cam or put the control collar on incorrectly it would still pump fuel, just not enough or at the correct time.
  
  I think you can check the collar and the cam position by just taking the top off the pump which you can do on the car.
  You cant get to the shim without removing the pump head to see if it's there damit anyway.
  
  As easy as it is to remove the top I would just do it to verify that collar is correct. Otherwise your just gonna be scratching your head wondering.
• #13 by yoopercharged on 04 Dec, 2008 16:51
• I know the shim is there because I forgot it but realized it was out before I got too far along the rebuild.  The hole in the control collar is facing the front (drive sprocket) of the pump.  No luck with the cam position.  I'm unable to tell, but I remember well double checking that the pin is lined up with the key way in the shaft.  I've been doing a lot of head scratching.  This is making me bonkers.  The gov/throttle shaft is leaking a little.  I've had one ordered from prothe, but his stuff seems to take a while to get here.
• #14 by Giles@PerformanceDiesel on 04 Dec, 2008 19:31
• Hi Andy
  
  let me ask a question first
  
  which rotor did you use? 9,10,11 or 12 mm i assume you're talking
  about he "Head & Rotor" right?
  
  if you use the 1.9L cam plate then you need to take the higher lift
  of that camplate into the equation of rotor position in the head.
  this means the 2mm button might need changing to a different
  thickness.
  
  hope this helps.
  
  try putting the 1.6L cam plate back in.
  Did you assemble the Liner the correct way? the 3 holes in the
  correct orientation?
  Giles