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Author Topic: Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi  (Read 9747 times)

August 17, 2008, 11:23:25 am

HughF

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« on: August 17, 2008, 11:23:25 am »
Hi everyone, It's been a few years since I've been active on here but I have been helping a friend get some big power from his 88hp 2.5tdi in a 1999 T4 transporter and the next step is a bigger turbo so I thought I'd ask on here.

We're running 151hp nozzles on volvo 850 tdi (same engine - rated at 138 in the volvo) bodies that have been shimmed to 200 bar. We've got the turbo and inlet manifold from the volvo (turbo is bigger than the 88hp VW one), we are also running a front mounted landrover TD5 intercooler and a 2.5 inch straight through system, including 2.5 inch downpipe.

We had a remap on friday and we're now running 179.2 at the crank :)

I think we're starting to run out of air now, so the next step is to go for a bigger turbo. Should we go for a vnt (I think a GT2559v as the mercedes tuning boys I'm involved with run these and they work well) or a Holset HX30 or E series?

I know the finnish superturbo mercedes boys all use holset turbo's for big power, but looking at the dyno charts, they aren't exactly drivable. Ideally we're looking for 250hp so the turbo needs to flow enough air for that.

One other thing, does anyone know whether we're going to run out of pumping element capacity if we try and push the 250hp mark? We're running the stock pump at the mo and it seems to be able to deliver enough juice but I'm now sure how much extra headroom we have here. I don't have any codes to hand for ID'ing the pump sadly.

Many thanks everyone!

Hugh



Reply #1August 17, 2008, 11:49:39 am

hatemi

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2008, 11:49:39 am »
Hi. Your engine has real potential but there are few things you will need to change to get it realy kick some butt.

A mate has something like 330+hp from his ACV engined Porter so the potential is there. But it wont be that easy to get to that level. Tough 250hp should be in the realistic range to strive for.

First. I'm not sure what size pump head that car has. For 250hp 11mm pump might be enough. That and R520 nozzles.

For turbo I would get Holset HE221 if a wastegated turbo is what your going with, or the AMG 2559v/BMW 2260V/Audi2260VK if going with VNT. You can get a VNT controlling program for ACV engine so it should be possible for your car aswell.

Reply #2August 17, 2008, 11:57:16 am

HughF

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2008, 11:57:16 am »
Hatemi,

Thanks for the info. I've PM'd shadowmaker about using the EGR valve and program to control the VNT (We thought about this late last night - wondering if it would work!). Do you know any more info about it?

Many thanks,

Hugh

Reply #3August 17, 2008, 02:34:01 pm

hatemi

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2008, 02:34:01 pm »
Not that much. Hes the one who can help you the best on that subject.

Reply #4August 17, 2008, 08:25:07 pm

oldskool rich

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2008, 08:25:07 pm »
i wud of thort you might also need a lift pump to keep up with fuel demand if you havent already, my AAZ needed one


f6squared I.D.S.T

Reply #5August 18, 2008, 02:58:50 pm

aidan

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2008, 02:58:50 pm »
I was interested in the same thing a while back, slightly off-topic but shadowmaster mentioned the 88 had a *** gearbox, the 102 had the good one, and thats the one you'l need

Reply #6August 18, 2008, 03:46:19 pm

HughF

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2008, 03:46:19 pm »
we've gone through 2 rebulds of the 88hp gearbox, and that was at stock power! They truly are a pile of poo. We're running the 102hp box in there right now and it works a charm. Well worth the effort to track one down!

I think the owner has decided to go and get a gt2559v so I think we've decided on the turbo front - will let you know how the install goes.

Hugh

Reply #7August 18, 2008, 05:14:44 pm

gigaz2

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2008, 05:14:44 pm »
the injectors are small for 250hp, those are the 216um ones right?
the R520's (260um) are good for more than 250hp on the 2.5.

nice setup overall :D

ps: I'm looking for a transverse mount gearbox for the 2.5 TDI, any chance that volvo 850 one is still available?
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Reply #8August 19, 2008, 08:38:47 am

HughF

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2008, 08:38:47 am »
We have imported 151bhp nozzles which I believe to be from japan (possibly they're Kiki nozzles or denso?) so we'll need to upgrade to .260's - where can we get these from?

I don't think the gearbox is still available, we got the parts from a car on ebay that had snapped a cambelt.

Hugh

Reply #9August 19, 2008, 09:13:24 am

Pat Dolan

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2008, 09:13:24 am »
Hugh:

Sorry to drift OT a bit:

At what power level did your original KKK14 (I think that's what's on the 88HP engine) run out of steam?  We are building a M-TDI 2.5 in T3 Syncro Westy, and want to crank it up a wee bit, but not start replacing hardware (reliability #1 goal).

Pat
lifetime VW enthusiast, racer, fixer, addict, etc.
'03 TDI Variant, MkII Golf Country, Mk1 and II Scirocco (gassers), a Vanagon aircooled, an Audi 2.0 TD waiting to become a Porsche TD (in my M471 924), FLD120/DDEC IV, Ford 7.3/450, Iveco D220 and some 6D14T Mitsus and a few more.

Reply #10August 19, 2008, 11:40:37 am

HughF

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2008, 11:40:37 am »
Pat,

Not too sure to be honest, we just fitted the volvo turbo straight away.

I believe that a lot of the T4 boys are running out of air at around 150hp using the stock turbo, but that might be with the 102bhp turbo, I can't recal... You can view it all on the T4 forum - 'project power' is the thread they have all about it.

Hugh

Reply #11August 22, 2008, 01:36:31 pm

shadowmaker

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Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2008, 01:36:31 pm »
I think my van did 215hp with those 502 nozzles you are currently using. I bet I could do more than 250hp with those at the moment, but that means a lot of mods for your engine and the pump. Go bigger.

You are now using almost the same combination as Volvo 2.5TDI straight from the factory, so 180hp ain't that bad. With better exhaust the best we have dynoed was 192hp, 460Nm.

gt2559v is fine. I used to use one and did about 250hp with it several years ago.

For you to hit 250hp without extreme internal mods you'll need a bigger element (12mm). To ease breathning get a tad steeper cam as that's cheap.

Not all Mercs are equipped here with those stupid, big Holsets. Here's one I'm involved with and it's running gt37v. Fuel is kept down and there's serious turbine slip under 3800rpm.



Hopefully we get a second one dynoed within next few weeks. This one has a bit more fuel feed turned on... :twisted:
2.5TDI 5cyl with 227,7kW and 586,6Nm @ 1,3bar (2??kW @2,0bar)
14,53s 158,88kmh @ 1/4-mile
1980kg with aerodynamics of a barn door
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkSTslJf7Z4

Reply #12January 25, 2017, 01:20:08 am

filmshoot

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Re: Turbo choices for 200hp+ 2.5 tdi
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2017, 01:20:08 am »
Nice numbers what kind of mpg do you get in a t4 with that setup?

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