Author Topic: Vanagon progress  (Read 57075 times)

April 01, 2008, 11:43:08 pm

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« on: April 01, 2008, 11:43:08 pm »
I'm starting this thread as an information dump for the upgrades that I'm currently making to my van. I gotta get some of this out of my head before it all fizzles away...

I guess the first post can be the "baseline" and background.

The general specs are:
'82 diesel Westy
Quantum-spec TD engine, VW rebuild with about 40k on it.
Quantum K24 turbo
NA Vanagon injector pump
Air-cooled tranny
New stock size tires
Inaccurate speedometer
Mileage currently 27-28mpg (was consistently 30mpg before a new IP)
Cool running at all times, even climbing the 9% grade out of Death Valley, mid-afternoon in July with air temps near 130

The van has always run wonderfully with no real issues. Always started right up, even below freezing. It's just forever been gutless and a reliable reason to be late for anything.

Beginning boost maxed out around 6.5psi, climbing a pretty moderate hill here at about 4000' elevation. Little to no smoke.

What started this whole process was my quest to correct the turbo oil return line that I pinched nearly complely flat about two years ago while playing in some rocks. My super scientific "blow test" revealed that with a little pressure, it would flow OK but the teflon liner was visibly pinched shut inside. With a public outcry for help, it was pointed out that my turbo was considered "large" for the application and I might see improved driveability with the smaller K14.

What I began with:


Chris


'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #1April 01, 2008, 11:59:23 pm

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2008, 11:59:23 pm »
Phase one was to correct the oil return problem.

Power upgrade = 0
Peace of mind upgrade = 999

You can see from the previous picture that in addition to the pinched return line, the drain goes down then back up into the pan at about 35 degrees. My fix was to cap off the old AN-8 male fitting and add a 1/2" NPT bung that enters the pan horizontally, canted slightly toward the turbo drain. Threaded into this is a AN-8 fitting with braided hose running up to the turbo drain.





No installed pics yet since the K14 is not in and the plumbing is temporarily run to the old, bad return fitting.

While I was in the pan, I found a crispy blob glued to an inside corner. I picked it out and tossed it aside, noticing later that it was a poor attempt at fixing a crack. Properly repaired:


Also pertinent to the oil return is the fitting at the turbo. I found a M16 to AN-8 adapter that fit perfectly, but I did have to shorten it a bit. These are designed to seal to a tapered seat but the turbo uses crush washers instead. I ended up grinding off the length of the existing taper and quickly running a countersink inside to aid in oil drainage. Even with the turbo clocked to 45 degrees, there dosen't appear to be anywhere for oil to pool inside. There's a M12 to AN-4 oil supply fitting there to show what the original female taper looked like on the metric side:


'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #2April 02, 2008, 12:13:28 am

Vincent Waldon

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ****

  • 3255
    • My collection of HOWTOs
Vanagon progress
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2008, 12:13:28 am »
Keep em coming... I loves me a build thread by a craftsman machinist, with welding and tapping and fabbing and everything !!
Vince

Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
2001 silver TDI Jetta Malone Stage 1.5 , 2001 blue TDI Jetta SBIII 216s Malone Stage 3, 1970 Bay Window bus

Gone but not forgotten: 1969/1971 Beetles, 1969/1974 Westies, 1979 Rabbit, 1986 TD Jetta, 1992 gas Jetta, 1994 TD Jetta

Reply #3April 02, 2008, 12:24:41 am

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2008, 12:24:41 am »
Phase 3 - Increasing the smoke/LDA install

I did this on Sunday and finally took it for a spin today.

Boost pressure - 8psi, up the same hill, nearly maxed out in 3rd gear with lots of smoke.

This was pretty straightforward. Good thing for this site, otherwise I would not have known about the NA pump stop pin. Even the old "turbo" pump that was on the van (van pump body with LDA cover) still had the stop pin in place so I guess it really wasn't doing much more than what the regular NA pump was capable of. Getting the stop pin out of the way was the hardest part. My plan of grinding a C-clamp foot to fit down between the pin and gov. plunger didn't work out, even with copious amounts of heat. I ended up yanking the pump and tapping the pin out with a drift punch, with no heat. It coulda been done with the pump installed but by then I'd got enough dust and whatnot in the pump to warrant a quick flush anyhow. I'm getting rather proficient at R&Ring injector pumps these days.

One thing I did was tap the pin almost far enough to clear the lever, added a drop of permatex sleeve retainer, then tapped it a bit further to help keep the pin secure.

Nothing new here:


As I said - boost topped out around 8 psi with plenty of smoke. I think I'm limited now by a lousy wastegate, possibly the scrawny 1-3/4" exhaust. I was climbing that same hill at maybe 55 mph in 3rd, getting near the top of the "safe" rpm range - I think boost should have been closer to 10psi at this point, as I keep reading that the stock limit is somewhere around .7 bar.

There was a definite improvement in power! Struggling up in 2nd became sailing up in 3rd. I do need to play with the pump some to bring the smoke down a bit but I want to get the boost up a bit more first. Hopefully the new exhaust and turbo will fix that.

Also worth noting - based on my preliminary eyeballometer measurement, it looks like the aneroid pin (#27) allows the highest fueling with the dimple set 180 degrees from the pump sprocket. This was verified by my butt dyno, compared to the stock "notch" position and the suggested "180 from notch". Pin profile does not change as it's rotated, just the offset from center changes.

Anyhow, I was so happy I had to install a new sticker:


Some other pictures, just for fun -

Cheapy ebay gauge pod, trimmed for a tight fit to the van dash, over the ashtray, while keeping the gauges generally level. Banana does double duty as a variable height Jo block for those highly accurate angle setups:


Performance exhaust kit:


The exhaust hangers should be here tomorrow and I have preliminary girlfriend permission to work on the van again on Thursday. Hopefully there'll be a progress report that night.

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #4April 02, 2008, 12:29:51 am

burn_your_money

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ****

  • 9005
  • Personal Text
    Bright, On
Vanagon progress
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2008, 12:29:51 am »
Very exciting. I remember reading when yo first discovered the issues with the drain line. Nice progress
Tyler

Reply #5April 02, 2008, 12:34:31 am

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2008, 12:34:31 am »
Quote from: "Vincent Waldon"
Keep em coming... I loves me a build thread by a craftsman machinist, with welding and tapping and fabbing and everything !!


I wish I could express the frustrations of being a machinist and welder, reduced to welding halfway out the backdoor of my rental because the dryer cord is so short, in fear of burning down the yard; having to drive 225 miles to visit my TIG machine; not having a machine shop within 60 miles when I'm accustomed to working in one; not even able to find a freakin' bead blasting cabinet in town!!!!

I guess I learned my lesson on wanting to live in a small town! But I can't handle the jungle again either. Can we start a fund to buy our own town with all the amenities necessary to be a happy gearhead, without the standard frustrations of life in the big city? A fab shop on every corner with a good parts store in between would be a start...

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #6April 02, 2008, 12:37:29 am

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2008, 12:37:29 am »
Don't get me started on the all-weather workspace, paved in pea-gravel and dead grass...
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #7April 02, 2008, 12:44:42 am

burn_your_money

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ****

  • 9005
  • Personal Text
    Bright, On
Vanagon progress
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2008, 12:44:42 am »
Quote from: "Luckypabst"
Can we start a fund to buy our own town with all the amenities necessary to be a happy gearhead, without the standard frustrations of life in the big city?


I'll move in :D
Tyler

Reply #8April 02, 2008, 12:58:09 am

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2008, 12:58:09 am »
Yea, straight out the back for now. If it proves to be too much I'll kink it around to the passenger side through a muffler of some sort. Those mandrel bends are cheap at ATP!!

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #9April 02, 2008, 02:23:05 am

Vanagoner

  • Junior

  • Offline
  • **

  • 219
Vanagon progress
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2008, 02:23:05 am »
Great work! Thanks for the pics and info.  You inspire.
Sage
'82  Vanagon Westy, the mighty N/A

Reply #10April 02, 2008, 09:16:37 am

myke_w

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 1099
Vanagon progress
« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2008, 09:16:37 am »
Good choice on the k14, it's night and day, I've built this exactly platform from scratch and I can say it's way better.

Also, for those on the hunt for drain line parts in the future, the fittings are technically called "DIN" which stands for Deutsch Industrial Norm, the parts houses wont have a freaking clue what it is if you don't know this.  Also there's a great site http://www.discounthydraulichose.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=din&Search.x=0&Search.y=0

that can hook you up with pretty much any din fitting you need.

One more thing, if you haven't purchased tires yet, Hankook makes a great appropriately rated bus tire. It's called the RA08. Any warehouse tire can order them for you. FYI Hankook is an OE supplier for VW and Mercedes truck in europe.
Contact me for hard to find for idi and tdi parts


Reply #11April 02, 2008, 10:02:16 am

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2008, 10:02:16 am »
Quote from: "myke_w"


One more thing, if you haven't purchased tires yet, Hankook makes a great appropriately rated bus tire. It's called the RA08. Any warehouse tire can order them for you. FYI Hankook is an OE supplier for VW and Mercedes truck in europe.


That's what I slapped on just before Christmas, based on the rave reviews across the 'net. I'm very happy with them, not much change over the Jupiters they replaced, only more tread. Price was right, they're rated correct and are held in high regards - good enough for me.

The Bilsteins I just put on made a marked improvement in control, especially puttering around off road. Little improvement in severe washboard though - not much you can do about that, however...

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #12April 02, 2008, 09:18:42 pm

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2008, 09:18:42 pm »
OOOO I have some good news today! The girlfriend called ahead and approved a little wrenching time this afternoon.

But before the good news -
Brown Santa brought some fun stuff from TurboCity - I had them clean and balance the turbine and clean the compressor housing. But geez man, now I feel like I need to take this to the next level and fully restore the van to keep up with the work they did on the comp. housing:


Leading up to the good news:


I was kinda rushed, it'll be cleaned when I drop the exhaust to swap turbos:


Already, I've shinned the pipe here. It'll get shortened before too long:


So the good news - $80 in 2-1/4" stainless exhaust bits nets 4psi increase in boost for a grand total of 12psi with smoke to spare. It sounds pretty good, not obnoxiously loud so I'll leave it as is for a while.

I guess the wastegate is working well. After hovering at 12psi briefly, it dumps to about 7psi, then quickly builds back to 12.

Still burning oil though - I hope I fried the seal ring in the turbo with the kinked return hose and not something else. No burned oil on decel, just under hard boost.

Tomorrow I might spend some time adding tension to the LDA spring to bring the smoke down some. I wish the EGT was hooked up, but not til I can drop the exhaust manifold.

Over on "scientific test hill" where I was gritting teeth and sweating balls to hold 25-30mph I was cruising and grinning happily along closer to 50.

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #13April 02, 2008, 10:52:42 pm

Luckypabst

  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ***

  • 502
Vanagon progress
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2008, 10:52:42 pm »
That's kinda the afterthought I was having - being the BOV instead of wastegate. I do plan to plug the BOV but I don't really want more boost than what I'm getting now for fear of headgasket issues.

Chris
'82 TD Westy
'81 NA Caddy

Reply #14April 03, 2008, 12:38:52 am

burn_your_money

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran

  • Offline
  • ****

  • 9005
  • Personal Text
    Bright, On
Vanagon progress
« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2008, 12:38:52 am »
Quote from: "Luckypabst"


Over on "scientific test hill" where I was gritting teeth and sweating balls to hold 25-30mph I was cruising and grinning happily along closer to 50.


That is a very nice improvement. Makes it all worth while eh?
Tyler