81 Rabbit Reserection Glow Plugs?

[fastguy69]

Hello all.  New to the site but have owned my Rabbit since I was 15.  God its been 13 years now.  The car has been settin for at least 11 years.  It wasn't running very well when I parked it.  I was thinking here lately that I would try to find another one running on the cheap and fix it up.  However after seeing some of the prices these little boogers are going for, I'm seriously considering bring it up form It's resting place rebuilding it!

A few questions I have are:  Does any one offer a complete rebuild kit including bearings, gaskets, rings, and possibly pistons for one low price?  If so where could I find it?

What is the best book to use for a rebuild how to for an amature mechcanic like myself?  I may not have all the tools for this job but I can get em.

One more thing:  how easy and expensive would it be to rebuild my NA to handle a turbo?  If adding a turbo,  could I still turn this car in to a greaser if I wanted?

Thanks for reading the long post.  Thanks in advance for all the helpful info I'm sure you guys will give me!  Who better to ask!

Renaming this post to hopefully get more insight

[Krazy]

http://www.volkswaparts.com/

http://www.vwdieselparts.com/

[burn_your_money]

myke_w on the forums has the rebuild kits

the bentley is the manual of choice

turbo motors can run WVO

[fastguy69]

Thanks for the info.  I'm going to check out the car today and asses the damage.  If it seems like too much I may post it on here for parts.

[Clankin-Rabbit]

Welcome, glad to hear your bringing your Rabbit back to it's good life!

I too just found an 81' in need of some TLC and have been putting it back together and driving it a little to school and back.  

Not to steer you away from any other mail-order parts place, but I've had really good luck with http://www.discountvdubparts.com.  I've ordered from them 3 times in the past 2 months and they've had really fast shipping and have been really nice about everything.  They also have free shipping with orders over $50.  Just my .02

Post pics when you get it done...have fun!

-Evan

[fastguy69]

Okay,  I pulled the engine today and after removing the head this is what I found....the exhaust valves have hammered the tops of all four pistons.  They left indentions deep enough to easily detect with your finger and very visable however they do not look harmed in any other way.  The valves themselves do not look bad but I have yet to pull them from the heads.  

I'm assuming that the engine jumped time, enough for the valves to tap the pistons...the timing belt looked fine and tight even after sitting for so long.  
What would have caused it to do this?  Does any one think I might get by with just a head job and possibly new valves?  I would really like to get this running on the cheap because I'm actively seeking a turbo engine for a swap.  Either way this car is getting a veggie kit.  

Any Opinions will be greatly appreciated.  If they load, here are some pics of the situation












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[fastguy69]

bump

[burn_your_money]

do the lifters still slide freely in their bores?

[fastguy69]

Everything Still moves free.  The Valves look like they seat perfectly.  I just can't figure out how it jumped time.  BTW, I could use a used set of tools to time it with when I slap it back together if any one has some cheap.

[Quantum TD]

At first I thought it may have jumped time before you bought it. At which point, someone may have fixed the valves and put on a new belt. In which case the valves would be ok.

But now looking at the photos, those valves recently have been hammering away on the pistons for some time. See how clean the spots on the pistons and the bottom of the valves are? I'd say it either jumped a tooth, or was mis-timed from the beginning (i.e. when the last belt was put on). Either way, it was off, and it could explain why your car did not run right.

Another (slim) possibility is that the valve shims were too thick, but I doubt that was the case.

Either way, you should get that head reworked. Minimally, I'd say all new exhaust valves. If you want to put on a turbo, might as well go ahead and upgrade to the sodium fillled valves (068 109 611D). You'll also want to replace all the valve guides and seals, and get the seats cut.

As far as the pistons, they should be OK, assuming the rods have not bent. Normally, in order to check for that is to measure the piston protrusion from the top of the block. But since all 4 of your pistons have hit the valves, that test won't be very illustrative. You may have to pull the rods to check them. Generally speaking though, the rods are pretty stout. I've never personally had a problem, or heard of a rod going through the case becasue of a piston once hitting the valves. Usually, the rods blow due to low oil pressure.

[boxer246]

You're gonna have to pull all the valves to do a proper assessment of what, if any damage to the head has occurred.  It is not unheard of for a motor such as yours which has evidence of valve/piston interference for the top end to be fine.  The solid lifter head (which it appears is what you have) have pretty strong lifters.  But, nonetheless, when you remove the lifters and valves, inspect them closely.  The lifters will get spider-web type cracking radiating from the middle out (after you remove the valve shim, of course) if they are stressed past their limit.

The valves need to be checked for trueness, and there are lots of ways of doing that.  The valve stems should be inspected.  You should also look and see if the cam looks damaged, which is rare on the solid lifter motor, but can happen.  

But, also, I second what the previous posters said about replacing  guides, seals and exhaust valves.  For the older motors, that stuff is pretty cheap.

As far as the bottom end goes, I dont know if you want to pull the pistons or not, but now would be a good time to measure the bores and look at the condition of the rings.  But, if you are just trying to get the motor running for the short term and for cheap, you might not care to do some of this stuff.  Opening up these old motors is almost ALWAYS like opening up the proverbial can of worms.  Where do you stop?

I bet someone timed the motor wrong, instead of it actually "jumping a tooth".

[fastguy69]

After thorough inspection of the Valves, head and pistons, I could not find any major damage to anything.  I ordered the timing belt and tool kit from prothe among other items that I will talk about later.  While replacing the timing belt I noticed alot of play with the crank pully.  After further inspection I found that the key was really wollered out and a huge gouge in the crank and the sprocket.  The play in the belt sprocket allowed just enough slack to let the valves come in contact with the pistons but not enough to do any damage as far as I could see.  It looked like they just tapped the tops of the pistons.

At first I thought I was going to need my crank reworked to fit a new key but I used a very small dremel bit and enlarged the notch on both the crank and the sprocket to fit some square key stock being careful to make sure the sprocket lined up just as it had before.  Worked like a charm.

After getting the belt ready to go back on, I used some of prothe's replacement headbolts.  Upon applying the final torque to the #8 head bolt, the bolt head broke off.  I sent the whole set back to him along with a clutch disk that was for a gasser and am awaiting a refund.  So I wound up reusing the old bolts that are the 10mm hex head bolts which should be reuseable if I've researched the forum correctly.  No probs so far.

Before putting the engine back in I replaced some wires that the mice had chewed up while it was sitting.  Apparently That wasn't enough because after trying to start it with the key,  I got nothing.  Lights in the cluster but no crank.  No glow plugs either.  I'm thinking the relay is bad.  Either that or some chewed wires under the dash.  If I can't find a diagram some where I'm going to have to buy a bently.....Gonna take a min. to get here though.  

So I vacumed the fuel to the pump then Jumped the starter while jumping the glow plugs from the battery and it fired immediatly although it sputtered a little and evetually died.  I've started it several times since but not had it running for longer than a minute.  I try to give it throttle but it doesn't help.  I'm assuming that my hoses to the injectors might be dryrotted and are having some sort of effect on this.  Gonna order some more hose and replace them.  After sitting for at least 11 years the injection pump doesnt seem to be leaking but it might be part of the problem too.  I can't complain too much...at least she runs!   I'm saving rebuilding the pump as a last resort if she don't line out before too long.  If anybodys got some more suggestions I would appreciate it.

[Vanagoner]

It is important to not only have fuel at the pump, but to have the steel injector lines full as well.  loosen the line nuts at the injectors 1 turn and crank it over with the pump "throttle" opened up to maximize fuel going into the lines.  You'll see it leak out on top of the injectors when they're full, then tighten them back down.
You also might want to clean and lube the pump and injectors by putting in a new fuel filter filled with "sea foam" or "marvel mystery oil".

[jtanguay]

be careful with timing kits from sources other than oem.  some of these tensioner knock offs go south and can throw the timing belt.  not sure about belt quality etc.

[jimfoo]

Another possibility for valve contact is if the cam sprocket slips on the camshaft. The belt could still be tight in this scenario.