Author Topic: Another M-tdi question <sorrrry> (Read 17622 times)

scottyroccodiesel · « **on:** January 24, 2008, 10:07:29 am »

well I have been reading up on this like crazy... from the FAQ thread to everything i can find on here , tdiclub, and vortex(not much of anything there especially brain power).
I have a tdi engine and pump, I am planning on getting a 1.6 td pump for the mechanical pump.

I am a college student and my funds are, well lets say limited.... My engine came from my moms wrecked tdi so that cost free

, my first car was a 16v scirocco and I just bought a damn clean one for $200 !!!!! and it has a sunroof!!!!
soo I am pretty electronically declined and have nightmares about swapping over all the tdi electronics. my dad recommended do a mechanical injection pump.

for my dads prject he sent his td pump into giles but there is noooo wayyy I could spend 900 just to have the pump reworked. so I decided I wanted to do a franken pump with the tdi and a td pump. I can get a td pump for 150 and I already have the tdi pump so I thought his would be the cheapest easiest way to go.

so to my main question making the franken pump??..... this is a quote from the FAQ "swapping in the pump head, plunger and camplate from a TDI pump" ok so I want to know is this as easy as it sounds

? would I have to retime the pump???
I would love for someone to give me a step by step on this and maybe some pics if anyone has them?
Is there any mods I can or should do to the pump when I am done?

scottyroccodiesel · « **Reply #1 on:** January 25, 2008, 08:57:20 am »

heres my rocco http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3601326

I know lots of people have looked at this but does no one know the answer? or is everyone just hiding it?

Justin · « **Reply #2 on:** January 25, 2008, 04:01:42 pm »

that is what I originally tried and it ran for a while, but you really need the special tools to check the spacing. Mine after a short while (a day or two of tuning it) wouldnt start and when it did it wouldnt come down below like 1500 rpm.
it basically dropped the shim out and did what I would call a valve float and destroyed the inside of the pump.

I couldnt find anyone to work on a custom pump except for Giles and jacks source over on vwdieselparts. so I had to send it to giles, I know that he costs a lot but a normal Bosch place wont touch it and for performance and value Giles is well spent.

I love mine, I am currently running about 14 lbs of boost, cruise with 6-8 psi and get 41-44 mpg right now in the winter.

good luck
jkeiffer

scottyroccodiesel · « **Reply #3 on:** January 25, 2008, 05:08:36 pm »

so I really cant do this by myself??

this is a set back...

jtanguay · « **Reply #4 on:** January 25, 2008, 06:01:40 pm »

Quote from: "scottyroccodiesel"

so I really cant do this by myself??

this is a set back...

if you don't have any experience working with precision components, then yes, i would say that you won't be able to make it work. (it might run, but it won't run good)

scottyroccodiesel · « **Reply #5 on:** January 25, 2008, 06:06:25 pm »

is there any one otyher than giles that can this kind of work?
I know he is the god of this stuff but theres got to be other people who can do it. Im not looking to squeeze every ounce of power out of it or anything but maybe a few mods for more fueling...

KTMAuto · « **Reply #6 on:** January 25, 2008, 06:37:58 pm »

There is not that much to it. Getting the new pump together with out dropping the four springs, button between the pump and drive. You will have to retime after. The cam plate can go in 180 degrees out. I think that matters. The key way on the pump indexed with the drive tit on the cam plate. If you tear it apart and can''t get it back together, some one posts hear about reseal'in them for cash. Send him the pieces. Once you know the ip all the piece fit one way. Make sure the wheel on the lever assembly end up back in the hole in the fuel collar on the pump. It is tricky but not impossible. I run lots of veggie and what not in a 1 tank system, my poor ip takes it hard. Veggie guys clean the restricted ip return banjo, they always plug.

Tintin · « **Reply #7 on:** January 27, 2008, 12:34:32 pm »

In my book, to spend 900$ for a M-pump it are what that is worth, but for 500-600$ you will find an ECU and a chip tuning.

LWB Samurai Joe · « **Reply #8 on:** January 27, 2008, 12:39:27 pm »

Bugger, there used to be a guy named Peter over in the Czecgh Republic that was selling TDI's with manual pumps. I cant find his information any longer..

RATS!

jimfoo · « **Reply #9 on:** January 27, 2008, 02:02:58 pm »

Quote from: "LWB Samurai Joe"

Bugger, there used to be a guy named Peter over in the Czecgh Republic that was selling TDI's with manual pumps. I cant find his information any longer..

RATS!

I think Deepmud got one of his setups, and it has never really run the way it should. He said when he first got it, his old AAZ(now mine) had better power.
Get Tintin or Giles to make you a pump. You have to pay for quality.

RabbitGTDguy · « **Reply #10 on:** January 27, 2008, 02:22:17 pm »

Quote from: "jimfoo"

Quote from: "LWB Samurai Joe"
Bugger, there used to be a guy named Peter over in the Czecgh Republic that was selling TDI's with manual pumps. I cant find his information any longer..

RATS!

I think Deepmud got one of his setups, and it has never really run the way it should. He said when he first got it, his old AAZ(now mine) had better power.
Get Tintin or Giles to make you a pump. You have to pay for quality.

In agreement with that...

joe

jtanguay · « **Reply #11 on:** January 28, 2008, 07:27:39 am »

Quote from: "LWB Samurai Joe"

Bugger, there used to be a guy named Peter over in the Czecgh Republic that was selling TDI's with manual pumps. I cant find his information any longer..

RATS!

the guy is still making the TDI pumps. Peter seems to be quite busy lately... i bought a pump off a guy who got his from Peter (through that guy over in Czech)

I got Giles to test it for me and tell me if it would be in my best interest to get him to re-do it. he's an honest guy and told me that it was putting out some crazy amount of fuel... black smoke and probably a burnt engine is what i would be looking at with the pump. it didn't come with an LDA so even if there was no boost, the pump would still be dishing out the fuel. highly inefficient! i can't wait till my pump is done

Giles really takes pride in the pumps he builds. that's saying a lot!

Pat Dolan · « **Reply #12 on:** January 30, 2008, 02:53:47 pm »

Scotty:

Nice ride. Will be even nicer with the rattlebox under the bonnet.

My suggestion to you is that you go with Giles, but not for the reason you might think. I would encourage ANYONE to do as much as they can, because that is how we learn. However, it seems like the real problem is that you can't afford to be wrong - so the best solution is to figure out how to raise enough cash to have it done once, and done right.

There will be plenty of time after you graduate and have some kind of regular income to take risks with your time and money - and be better off for it, but it really doesn't sound like that time is now.

Pat

scottyroccodiesel · « **Reply #13 on:** January 30, 2008, 03:15:33 pm »

hahaha thank you very much and you are right I got a long life ahead of me but I am the only one in the family with a gasser and gas is killing me. I want to get this down by the end of summer. Like i said my main hurdles are the IP and all the motor mounts i have to make... my dad amazing at custom fabrication though and I know he will help me get through this.
I think I have found a fiat croma tdid pump for 150 euros, I know shipping will be exspensive but the total wont be over 500 i dont think. I have read that it is bolt on and the minor mods can really get it going. scope has one on his m-tdi.
so if i do that I can sell my tdi pump to some one for a few hundred right?
I will probaly try to get some pics so i can do a true build thread.
I know giles does a great job just all too pricey for me, my dad just got his back from giles for his 356td project and I know that its goin to just rip. he has been doing everything on the car very grassroots so he just thought he should splurge somewhere.

RabbitGTDguy · « **Reply #14 on:** February 01, 2008, 06:44:33 pm »

Prothe,

I know I will probably be the first one to address this here, and maybe its for the Vendors forum, buyer/seller feedback, etc. However, your price for a "mTDI" pump seems a bit "iffy" to me as do the numbers of pumps that you claim to have built.

Now, I will give you the fact that a modified AAZ pump or a 1.6 TD pump will "run" a TDI and may run it fine...but will it put up stock numbers, hp, fueling without further modifications....no.

Those of us that do have "properly setup" mTDI's are well aware of this fact. That fact is.... that you can not just add a TDI hydraulic head and camplate to a 1.6 or 1.9 IDI pump and have it be a fully operational and well thought out mTDI pump. Since you are a vendor, making money, etc. I'm not going to go into further details about what these modifications entail and maybe it is something you already consider (but do not address). I think in the interests of any potential buyers though, that they would want to see some power numbers, customer feedback, etc. regarding your product.
I've been there, done this. My 4bt pump is currently in its "third" revision and I know there are those out there (Giles, Tin-Tin aside) selling what they claim to be mTDI pumps with these "simple" parts swaps and modifications that will run the TDI motor, but not to its full potential. It simply ends up being a IDI pump, maxed for fueling and supplemented with a 10mm (or 12mm head) to help that fact out.

I know I had to be the first...but I'd hate to see someone get burned.

Joe