Author Topic: Cold weather HARD/No start 1.6TD (Read 8063 times)

xtrigger · « **on:** November 26, 2007, 12:48:34 am »

Hello, I have not posted much just mostly read around here etc...

Im mostly on the Vortex scene but for the Diesel help I was better off here

My issue...

Its a 1990 Jetta 1.6 TD

the engine is thie

1.6 n/a bottem end from an 87 Golf
1.6 n/a cylinder head from 87-89 Golf I believe
Turbo equipement from 1990 Jetta TD

The original motor had 420 000kms was bad...on the way home it got to around 10psi on highway of oil pressure...got it home and it just shat it self...oil everywere

SO i had a block swapped it over with the head (was still good)
ETC....put timing belt on rong (TDC was way off long story) broke cam

Swaped a newer head on with gasket the works...lined all up fine

Car starts runs fine...smokes a little blue or white...pump timing...i just moved it a bit (dont have the tool)

WELL...

I want to start in the morning (snowing here in Ontario)
just cranks and cranks till battey dies...then i come in my other car and boost it till it starts (crank alot) WHile it cranks it blows puffs of black smoke...

Glow plugs must be fine because they looked alright and seem to help if I left it go there the glow cycle twice...

SO i replaced starter with a more beefy one (much bigger then the original) Charged battery (rated 650cca)

same issue wont start till I crank till abt dies and keep gpoin...

Is it my timein on the pump?
No leaks on pump...
Good clean fuel (filter is good too)
Started seems alright...
GLOW plugs? INJECTORS?
no air in system

Also

Im goin to get an oil pan heater from CT and maybe (if they have) and coolant heater too
Engine doesnt have a block heater
(will two 650cca batterys work? total of 1300cca)

here it is from vortex

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3540182

shegel · « **Reply #1 on:** November 26, 2007, 01:13:31 am »

my car wont start unless i have the heater plugged in when its frosty outside.....im thinkin you just dont have enough heat to start it....though i could be wrong.

xtrigger · « **Reply #2 on:** November 26, 2007, 01:27:57 am »

i was thinkin the same..

shegel · « **Reply #3 on:** November 26, 2007, 01:37:53 am »

since the block heater died on my car i replaced it with an expansion plug....all i use to heat the car is a magnetic heater that attaches to the pan....it was only like 25 bucks too.

Vincent Waldon · « **Reply #4 on:** November 26, 2007, 02:17:53 am »

My friend, if you re-read your Vortex thread you will see that many people have suggested and suggested and suggested that you invest in both the service manual and the gear required to set the timing accurately... until you perform this critical step you are probably going to continue to go around in circles. Shattering your camshaft and bending your valves is an example of one of those circles ! :shock:

Diesels are simple engines with simple needs... the right amount of fuel at the right moment accompanied by adequate heat of compression. "The right moment" means a proper job of setting the timing.

jtanguay · « **Reply #5 on:** November 26, 2007, 07:55:01 am »

650cca isn't enough. i'd say at LEAST 800cca and 1000cca for a tired engine.

you also need to run a big fat ground straight to the starter and possibly a new 12v wire straight to it and solder it in good (it will last forever this way... no corrosion from the large amounts of juice you send it)

that will help with getting the engine spinning fast enough to fire, but as previously stated, if the timing is off, that will be your biggest problem.

i've set my pump to adjust my idle to around 1100 when cold start is pulled out. without this, the car bucks like craaaazy! sounds like it is running off 1 and a 1/2 injector(s) :lol: with it pulled out though, it bucks a wee bit (leaking injector return lines- THEY ARE PRACTICALLY NEW TOO!! :evil:) but then smooths out pretty quick.

i would almost bet that you have a fuel leak somewhere... i installed a small facet fuel pump (solid state) on my car and it really seems to help bleed any air out after sitting for a while in my driveway.

i also have the luxury of plugging in at work. i'm pretty lucky! holy crap that camshaft broke pretty good!!! :shock:

anyways good luck with gettin it fixed. maybe someone close by to you could hook you up?

xtrigger · « **Reply #6 on:** November 26, 2007, 09:08:29 am »

Amazing replys...

I need to find the manual locally, and the timing gauge...

the engine it self has around 211 000kms on it now...but all new things...

ill have to check some more things then,

i think you guys are right- maybe my timing is far off...becasue when I pull my cold start nothing is noticable in RPM and ez to start...

Ill put 2nd battery on it too and I guess ill run all NEW thicker power lines

also i no i have no leaks because its bone dry under the hood and I have driven it for around 100kms..;.once it runs it runs nicely...also clear lines dont show any air bubbles.

HOLD ON...i remembered somethin...

THE INJETION PUMP isnt a TD one! its the n.a becasue the TD was leaking...

Would that make the problem?

xtrigger · « **Reply #7 on:** November 26, 2007, 11:36:45 pm »

I put both battery in the car and cranked for a while with engine spinning enough to build oil pressure...

all i saw was puffs of black smoke and white...

Cant get it to start at all anymore...i donno what I did...But i need it running..

I need to get the tool for timing then i guess but were locally here in London, Ont

saurkraut · « **Reply #8 on:** November 27, 2007, 09:45:20 am »

What weight oil do you have in the pan?

15W40 is the kiss of death for cold starts

xtrigger · « **Reply #9 on:** November 27, 2007, 11:13:05 am »

Thats what I put...dammit

So whats recommended?

10w30? diesel or gasoline oil?

thx for all help...

saurkraut · « **Reply #10 on:** November 27, 2007, 01:15:35 pm »

10W30 diesel oil will be a heck of alot better.

There is 5W40 synthetic diesel oil thats a step up here in the States.

In Canada, there is 0W40 synthetic diesel oil witch is even better.

Drain the 15W40 asap, put one of the three above in and fire for effect.

jtanguay · « **Reply #11 on:** November 27, 2007, 01:53:31 pm »

Quote from: "saurkraut"

10W30 diesel oil will be a heck of alot better.

There is 5W40 synthetic diesel oil thats a step up here in the States.

In Canada, there is 0W40 synthetic diesel oil witch is even better.

Drain the 15W40 asap, put one of the three above in and fire for effect.

totally forgot about oil weight... my old jetta was fine to start in the summer but come winter time it was a real pain. switched to rotella T sb 0w40 and she started so much better! go with a synthetic oil!

i wouldn't go with 10w30. if you were stranded and its all you had then go for it, but you really want something with the 40 weight for these old motors.

the n/a pump will just make your diesel run like an ECO. (no fuel enrichment) the only thing it will hurt is your power.

xtrigger · « **Reply #12 on:** November 28, 2007, 12:10:57 am »

perfect guys...ill go grab some 0w40 synthic...i hope not too much...(lol ill keep the old stuff only ran on it for 100km why drain and dump it)

and ill check my glow plugs wiring too...

westcoaster · « **Reply #13 on:** November 28, 2007, 10:39:45 am »

One last starting tip...

On my tired engine with the timing slightly out I found flooring the fuel while cranking seamed to be what got it started.....

xtrigger · « **Reply #14 on:** November 28, 2007, 10:24:22 pm »

GOT IT RUNNING...

checked the pwr to the Glow plugs...got voltage no problem...

pulled a glow plug to just see...NOT WORKIN only 1 from all 4 worked..

so i replaced....I had to remove IP anyways so I just re-sealed the TD one I have and instaleld that in place too...

Took half the oil out (15w40) and put in 0w30 synthic...for the other half...

Now timming is decent...and STARTS right up...even cold not even a problem...

thx guys for help....