Author Topic: Help needed- head job going on (Read 5932 times)

Trimster · « **on:** October 19, 2007, 06:37:32 pm »

I'm pulling the head this weekend. In frame rings, bearings, head gasket job. Any tips on keeping things easy to go back together? Marking fuel pump somehow to keep it in time? or is timing of that fairly easy? I'll take any tips and techniques.

1.6 NA engine.

TIA

bob

jtanguay · « **Reply #1 on:** October 19, 2007, 09:51:12 pm »

that would give you a rough estimate of where it was before. chances of you getting it back to where it should be is very very very unlikely. better to just time it with the dial indicator. are you sure that it is even on time as it is?

Trimster · « **Reply #2 on:** October 19, 2007, 10:05:22 pm »

The engine is still together and ran fine (accept for the head gasket and oil consumption). So right now, all is well. I have a Bentley manual on the way so I guess that will explain how to retime it. I'll most likely set the engine to TDC then mark the fuel pump pulley position.

However, just looking for tips and help on the pull the head, ring, bearings, etc. process.

Bob

jtanguay · « **Reply #3 on:** October 19, 2007, 10:15:18 pm »

well remember to remove the head bolts in sequence as per the manual. this will ensure that you don't accidently warp the head.

as for pulling pistons/bearings/etc. mark everything! keep all pieces together. that should be in the manual though.

do some searching for the 3 piece thrust bearings. the integrated bearing has been shown to do some horrible damage to the crank, and render it scrap metal :shock:

the best bearings you can get are probably the goetz rings. myke_w sells them on here for a very reasonable price, and also the bearings.

are you going to send the head to get checked out (leak test, warpage) ? it would be a good idea, and also to get the surface cleaned up to help the head gasket seal really good. maybe even do a valve job?

Doug · « **Reply #4 on:** October 20, 2007, 02:22:25 pm »

If you haven't started yet........

You don't need to remove the pump. Just keep it more or less in the same position as when you would time the machine as in the locking bolt or socket in the hole. Have a friend help you to lower the head assembly onto the cylinder block. It is heavy sloping back making for a really awkward lift. Remove the hood. It is simple and gets it right out of the way.

Trimster · « **Reply #5 on:** October 20, 2007, 04:39:48 pm »

Got it. Have most of the smaller stuff off the head. Intake and exhaust are next. Water drained. Injectors 1 and 4 had carbon on the faces. 2 & 3 are clean as a whistle. I think I know where the head gasket problem is now.

More wenching .... er... wrenching tonight.

bob

Trimster · « **Reply #6 on:** October 21, 2007, 07:55:28 pm »

Head bolts are star wrench style. Anyone know what size this is? Looks like 12 point but did not count. Need to get the tool tomorrow.

bob

Vincent Waldon · « **Reply #7 on:** October 21, 2007, 08:18:53 pm »

Quote from: "Trimster"

Head bolts are star wrench style. Anyone know what size this is? Looks like 12 point but did not count. Need to get the tool tomorrow.

bob

They are called "triple square" and you need either 11mm or 12mm depending on the head.... 12mm being the most common.

Same configuration, BTW, as the CV bolts... which are 6mm triple-square. I bought a set.....

Vince

Trimster · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2007, 08:58:43 pm »

I've got one of those. Just did the CV's. Never thought to check. On it....

jtanguay · « **Reply #9 on:** October 21, 2007, 10:05:19 pm »

i've always been worried about dropping crap into the cylinders.. what is the best way to keep crud out other than power washing the motor beforehand? (especially where the head meets the block)

and what is the best way to clean the crud out without worrying about little bits getting in between the pistons and the cyl's?

Doug · « **Reply #10 on:** October 22, 2007, 04:07:07 am »

I use a shop vac after wiping the cylinder several times with an oiled rag. It gets virtually everything that you see. Anything left in there is expelled in the combustion process.

somolovitch3 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 22, 2007, 04:22:20 am »

Removing Crud............

1. Car wash...High pressure soap followed by high pressure rinse. (I
always thought that waxing was a bit much!) :roll:

2. Large Nylon bristle brush with a good solvent (And a lot of elbow
greese!) :twisted:

3. If you have accsess to the Water Heater drain valve, hook up your
garden hose with sprayer. I use spray-on oven cleaner to cut thrugh
crud (and the paint) on the engine. Once the really big stuff is gone
I use Awesome Orange cleaner followed by more hot water. Let
the stuff set for a while to cut thrugh what remains, using brush and
sprayer to get to it all. Makes a bit of a mess if engine is really
cruddy! :shock:

Trimster · « **Reply #12 on:** November 03, 2007, 03:37:07 pm »

Ok...yeee ha... head is off. Here's the tail of the tape:
- NO scoring on cyl. walls. In fact, the cross hatching is still visible. So this engine was either rebuilt not to long ago OR the rings did not seat well. There is little or no ridge... what ridge there is is carbon buildup. No signs of a broken ring but I don't have the pistons out yet.

- The head gasket is fine. I had hoped to see a blow-by point. Nope. All is well.

- Head is a different story. Cyl 1 & 4 have white particles on them. From water I think. There are crystal deposits on the valve tops as well. Cyl. 2 & 3 are carboned, velvet black. The big issue is the cracks between the valves. Cyl. 2,3,4 all have cracks between the intake and exhaust valve seats.
Here's a shot of #2 piston. Seems burned/dark on one side (forward side) and the skirt is scuffed. However the cyl. wall is NOT scuffed. It is clear that this engine was rebuilt. All the rods and caps are marked/numbered.

So off to the head shop for a rebuild. I imagine that the cracks can be TIG welded and the seats redone. this could be the source of the water system pressureization if the cracks go into the water jacket. We will know soon.

I have not Mic'd the cyl. to see their size. I'll do that as soon as I get the ridges smoothed properly.

So... what does everyone think about the likely outcome of welding the head cracks? Remember, the pull down was to correct overheating and water system extreme pressurization and burning lots of oil.

TIA

bob

Trimster · « **Reply #13 on:** November 16, 2007, 02:42:43 pm »

Nice, pretty head setting in the garage now. Here's what was up:
-Warped .015 so milled the head.
- Intake valves replaced. One had the stem end broken off. A second was wearing badly.
- new glow plug
- valve stem seals
- Cam shaft seal
- New head bolts.
- new (used) cam. The end flange was missing a chunk so they guy had an extra good cam laying around... no charge.
- valves regaped.
---- so the credit card got hit some $428.00

Now it goes back together. I'm going to have the shop that did the above work, do the retiming of the engine and fuel pump.

somolovitch3 · « **Reply #14 on:** November 19, 2007, 06:03:25 am »

Hey, Bob..

Who are you using to do the machine work?

Looks like my head should wander over and be pampered.
:roll:

Robert

Author Topic: Help needed- head job going on (Read 5932 times)

Doug

Doug