another AAZ start trouble

[kidkoala]

Alright, here we go.

I've got an 97 AAZ Golf. The TB was done a few weeks ago at a reputable german auto shop.

I now have a rough start. Takes quite some cranking in order to get it going (w/ the cold start lever pulled). Even before it turns over,  I get a ton of white smoke.
It runs rough for a few seconds, then it clears up.
Once its warm - it will start with no issues (no smoke, no rough idle, etc..).

I had the glowplugs done last year (I know they can go quickly).
Everything else seems to run great.

I've done a bunch of reading about the crankshaft pulley 'wobble' - but when I check out my pulleys while the engine is running, I don't see a wobble, everything looks great.

I've got an appointment to take my car back to the same shop that did the TB, but before I go in there, I want to get as much info as possible. The guy that runs the shop asked that I print everything off that I can find and bring it in to use as another resource (I talked to him about the possibility of it being the pulley wobble problem).

I don't have the tools nor the knowledge to rip apart my crankshaft; so I'm kind of stuck taking it to a shop.

Anyone have any thoughts?  I don't want to be oblivious to the potential crankshaft problem - but from my readings, it seems like it might just be the glowplugs.

the car in question:

[burn_your_money]

I'd be inclined to think that your timing is a bit too retarded. See if the shop will set it at 1.00mm.
Bad GPs/relay are also suspect but if it worked before the T-belt and nothing else changed that's a bit less likely.

[Op-Ivy]

I second the retarded timing. It would make a lot of sense if your timing belt was replaced. Any other work done on the car since then?

[kidkoala]

no work done since the TB was done.

would the retarded timing be affected by cold weather?

cause i don't remember having a tough start when the TB was first done (about 3 weeks ago now) - but now the weather has dipped a bit, and i'm having troubles starting.

thanks for the input folks!!!

[g-spec]

Did you have the crank pulley inspected/replaced?? I would check that aswell....its a common problem on these motors.
good luck

[Doug]

My money is on a faulty glow plug especially since it runs okay after a bit of warm up time.

[burn_your_money]

If you have a multimeter you can do a quick check to see if the GPs are getting power. If you're lucky you have a friend with an infrared thermometer and you can shoot each GP to see if it is working

[kidkoala]

I do have a multimeter.

What should they be reading?

[burn_your_money]

Just check to see if they are getting 12V when the GP light comes on or when you are cranking. I'm not 100% sure if that will work with the MK3s but I know it does with the Mk2s and MK1s. On the MK2s you can unplug the coolant sensor and it will automatically trick the GP relay into thinking the engine is ice cold so it will leave the GPs on for about 30 seconds (I think). It will give you some more time to do your testing.
Do you have a Bentley for your car?

[kidkoala]

I do have a Bentley - but I have to find it.

I'd really rather not have to take the bus bar off - any way I can test them w/out pulling that off.
I suppose I could check the relay and fuse

[rubadubdub]

The way i checked mine was:

Remove temp sender to glow plugs so they stay on longer. (side of head next to temp guage on my car)
click glow plugs on
test for 12v with multimeter between bus bar and battery negative and
between each glowplug body and battery negative.

If you get 0v at bus bar somethings wrong upstream of this:

Check fuse (strip type 50A in its own little box on back of firewall)
Switch glowplugs on and listen for the relay clicking when they turn off/on. If you cant hear it it may be faulty.

Be careful when making the contact with the busbar/glow plug as while not paying enough attention i touched mine on the side of the multimeter metal pin rather than at the end and presumably it made a double contact or short circuited it somehow as i had sparks and blew the glowplug fuse. Very annoying if you dont have a spare.

Interestingly i still got 12V after the GP light went out on the dash. Not sure if this is normal or my relay is faulty.

[burn_your_money]

Interestingly i still got 12V after the GP light went out on the dash. Not sure if this is normal or my relay is faulty.

I'm pretty sure that is normal. The yellow light is not an indicator of when the glow plugs are actually on but rather how long you should wait before cranking.

[jtanguay]

Interestingly i still got 12V after the GP light went out on the dash. Not sure if this is normal or my relay is faulty.

I'm pretty sure that is normal. The yellow light is not an indicator of when the glow plugs are actually on but rather how long you should wait before cranking.

yea don't the 1.9's leave the GP's on even after the car has been started?  say 1-2 minutes for emissions???

[kidkoala]

I think I'm getting 0 at the busbar - but wasn't sure if my multimeter was dead, gotta dig up a new battery for it

[burn_your_money]

put the multimeter directly on the battery. If you aren't getting a reading around 12v then you know its no good