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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: Jetmugg on March 09, 2015, 12:50:24 pm
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It was like Christmas morning, except in the afternoon.
Brand new Holset HE200WG was delivered to my door.
Support Alcaid - he is THE MAN when it comes to turbochargers!
(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/he200WG_zpskltwbpul.jpg)
Steve.
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ssnnicee
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That is so great!!!
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What are you putting it on?
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Beauty!
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That's going on my 1.5L "Franken" engine, which will be fed by a Dieselmeken pump.
I'm looking for 200HP from my 1.5.
Steve.
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(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/3E467B3C-5C63-4256-9A88-313AE474FC73_zpsjx1rmrbu.jpg)
This pump. The Swedish candy is already gone.
Steve.
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MMMMM-MMMMM good.
Your gonna love it
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MMMMM-MMMMM good.
Your gonna love it
x2 8)
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These turbos are starting to become really popular! Mine pulled good at 15psi with a broken piston and block haha they spool nice and sound awesome
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Mine pulled good at 15psi with a broken piston and block haha they spool nice and sound awesome
You really gave me a laugh with that one. Sucky about the engine tho 3:
The candy on the left I swear I've had it. Was it a soft gummy strawberry cream bottle type? If not the search continues :(
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(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/he200WG_zpskltwbpul.jpg)
Hello beautiful 8)
I am ordering from Alcaid as soon as I establish my paypal hopefully next week, can you tell how long did you wait for delivery?
Also what exhaust manifold are you running, where did you get it?
Real nice timing with this thread hyping me up again can't wait ;D
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This is the manifold I'm using now. It's a generic eBay thing - I think several vendors offer the same thing. This one is a T3 flange, which I use in combination with a T3-T25 adapter.
(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/TurboManifold_zpsd77b6ccc.jpg)
(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/DSC_1547_zpsffad4566.jpg)
(http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/DSC_1552_zpsbaf2bcd1.jpg)
The last photo above is with a Garrett GT2056 attached.
Steve.
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They make the same manifold with the t25 flange instead, that is what is on my car.
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Jetmugg, does this Holset use a T25 size turbine inlet, or is it something else? If something else, can you please post the exact center to center bolt spacing for inlet into turbine? I assume it's rectangular, not triangular? Curious if this turbo will work on my 2.0 TD application. Thanks.
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Turbo looks nice! I'm planning on eventually getting one for my AAZ.
Sorry to thread jack but what is that t25 exhaust manifold from? The only ones I can find on ebay are for 1.8t and 2.0t gassers?
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/VW-Corrado-Jetta-2-0L-8V-1-8L-G60-PG-Turbo-T25-Exhaust-Manifold-Turbo-Manifold-/351311898873?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_205&hash=item51cbd228f9
similar to what I have
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With the turbo that far from the head you should triangulate it or you'll very likely break exhaust studs.
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With the turbo that far from the head you should triangulate it or you'll very likely break exhaust studs.
Good Call. With the new turbo, I'll add some support from below.
Steve.
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Lucas - thanks for the link. When I bought my exhaust manifold, I foolishly ordered the T3 flange model. The T25 cast manifolds are not as common.
Now that I'm re-fitting things I have the opportunity to buy a T25 manifold and give it a try. I might just do that.
I'm planning on running at The Ohio Mile on the weekend of June 6-7th.
Steve
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Jetmugg, does this Holset use a T25 size turbine inlet, or is it something else? If something else, can you please post the exact center to center bolt spacing for inlet into turbine? I assume it's rectangular, not triangular? Curious if this turbo will work on my 2.0 TD application. Thanks.
As far as I can see, it's a standard T25 inlet, not the triangular setup.
I would defer to Alcaid's recommendations about sizing for a 2.0TD, but I suspect this would be a good match for a "hopped up" 2.0 TD.
It would probably too much for my 1.5 in a street application, but should be spot-on for racing.
Steve.
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The Holset has a T25 inlet
I am using the same turbo on my mk4 1.9TDI, it should work just fine on a 2.0TD
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Jetmugg, does this Holset use a T25 size turbine inlet, or is it something else? If something else, can you please post the exact center to center bolt spacing for inlet into turbine? I assume it's rectangular, not triangular? Curious if this turbo will work on my 2.0 TD application. Thanks.
As far as I can see, it's a standard T25 inlet, not the triangular setup.
I would defer to Alcaid's recommendations about sizing for a 2.0TD, but I suspect this would be a good match for a "hopped up" 2.0 TD.
It would probably too much for my 1.5 in a street application, but should be spot-on for racing.
Steve.
The Holset has a T25 inlet
I am using the same turbo on my mk4 1.9TDI, it should work just fine on a 2.0TD
Thanks guys for verifying that for me.
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i had noticed 1 thing on your original post on this motor when you were 1st building it. your 1st video shows you starting it up (about page10, post #150 or so). if that was your first start up you did 1 thing wrong. your 1st start after a build/rebuild you need to breakin the cam. you do this like this. cold 1st start: let idle for at least 5secs, this lets the engine get its 1st oil pressure thru it, rev easily to 2000rpm, back to idle, shut down, check/top off oil, restart, easily rev to 2000rpm, Stay there for at minimum 20 minutes. this makes sure you have enough oil @cam lobes so it can start to break in. as the cam lobes are splash fed, so idleing can starve cam while it makes a wear pattern.
the other thing; the man had repeatedly urged you to get mileage on it, most of the important break in is done at 55mph and below, at mild throttle settings, mid speeds, more miles would be better, as engine gets more mileage on it, increase speeds some. after about 1000miles you are pretty well broke in, you can now increase throttle and speeds, -i find you can loosen an engine during this and you will notice its looser.
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I agree all of with the posts as far as getting miles on it. My van (rebuilt AAZ) got a second life on the way home from it's first 1500 mile trip.
As for cam break-in - no expert but here but, it sounds very logical.
It's probably tough finding someplace to put 1000 miles on it I'm guessing.
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IMHO rings seat fairly quick or not at all, but the rest of the bearings and such need to settle.
IMHO it is retarded to only run it to 55mph for break in. You need to utilize the entire RPM range, but slowly. Not mash the pedal to the floor, but roll into in when fully warmed and running well. I also don't roll it and continue to climb the rpm, I get into it and let off and so on until I reach a full pedal scenario. That way you don't over heat the rings and lose the temper. I have a 2 mile long hill that it takes me a bit to get to, so all is warmed up well and I get to full pedal and RPM somewhere before the 20 mile mark. I will also turn around and use that hill to decelerate and use the engine to try and hold it at a certain rpm, so the rings work on the negative pressure too. On all the gas engines I rebuilt if I didn't do this they used oil if you went above the rpm you broke it in with, ex: say 55mph = 2,400 rpm if it was broken in there and I ran it above that for a long period of time I would use oil. I haven't done any of the diesels like that and I don't really use any oil at all.
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one of the things, im definitely not saying anything like im driving at 2400rpm, in 5th yes for a while, ive never had and oil consumption problems, then again in hi gear im not going over 60 or so. ive also found early in a break in going over 55mph will start to cook your rings, a small amount at first, later when you have seated the rings, yes bring the revs up, although in these old cars its hard to run above 65 and maintain the car on a budget, like me my trans maxes out at 55, so no probs for me. as to when you add revs and load after the rings seat, give them a bit, and keep seating them at different speeds. and decel revs too.
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There are as many schools of thought about breaking in an engine as there are "what's the best oil" thoughts. I used a Joe Gibb's break in lube for the initial start-up, all the way through the first dyno session. After that, I switched to Mobil 1 diesel-spec oil, which is provided by one of my local sponsors.
I don't like to let an engine stay at a steady RPM during the break-in period. I think it's better to vary the RPM's during this period.
After start-up, I did vary the RPM's up and down for the first 10-15 mins or so, then drove the truck around the neighborhood just as a "shake down".
My school of thought has always been along the lines of "Break it in like you are going to use it". For a street car, highway cruiser, engine that is going to see a lot of miles, then being mellow with the engine makes sense.
This is a race engine. I ran it on the chassis dyno at Ranken Technical Institute in St Louis shortly after the initial shake-down. At that point, we warmed it up, got it on the dyno, and did a bunch of pulls from 2,500 up and over 5,500 rpm's. We were over 120 mph on the dyno, with a simulated load applied through the dyno software.
The engine may have "loosened up" some since then, but there's no way I'm going to get 1,000 miles on the vehicle. It does not have any working exterior lights, the windows are bolted in place, and the interior is nothing but steel tubing and sheet metal.
After setting records at Ohio and Bonneville, I'm satisfied that the engine is working well, and is ready for the next dose of power, in the form of a larger displacement Dieselmeken pump, and a bigger turbo.
We will be running at Ohio in June to see if we can bump the 1.5 record there.
Steve.
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I don't like to let an engine stay at a steady RPM during the break-in period. I think it's better to vary the RPM's during this period.
if your idleing (no load,not in gear) your not really doing too much, loosening tight parts at first, when you get it in gear most things happen from then, but the first 20 min are particularly important to the cam, i ve seen in some shop manuals -do not drive for the first 20 mins-, the revs being at 2000rpm for 20 mins allows the cam enough oil to begin to break in, reving it up from low rpms add to the fact the cam lobes may not have enough oil, after the 20 min @2000rpm yes start to vary the load/revs. the 2000 rpms is both a safe speed for cam, and you have enough oil at cam lobes while they develop their first wear pattern
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I have never seen a rational justification for operating a VW diesel under 2000 RPM ever. The cam wear breakin thing IMO is a carryover from v8 gassers which are prone to cam wear.
The only things I've seen kill a VW cam is being left outside and high RPM valve collision.
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The cam break-in procedure that air-cooled is promoting is specifically recommended for air-cooled engines which are very much prone to cam wear which I believe is due to the fact that each cam lobe drives two of the lifters/valves on the horizontally opposed air-cooled engines. The OHC diesels do not suffer from the same cam wear issues.
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a horizontally opposed engine's cam does have double duty, unless its ohc, usually porche 6cyl, but having 4 or more vw a/cmotors i never found evidence of excess cam wear, some motors were stock and were daily drivers, mild like 55-60mph, i had/have at least 1 with a fairly wild cam, could rev up to 7grand regularly, no cam wear. if you feel its not a problem for you thats up to you, i figured it would be good advice as a cam does have to break in and i feel in more than one of the shop manuals i had seen a caption in the head/valve train section, aprox wording; after certain head/cam work 'do not drive for the first 20 minutes' that would indicate the cam needs to 'start; to break in, 2000rpm is best for this, hi idle. if you low idle during this time or put in gear and drive it is adverse to the cam breaking in.
within 5 mins of this YES put a load on her, i like low-mid rpms @2/3throttle at first
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The last cam I installed came with specific instructions to vary the speed for the first 20 min...presumably to not have the lifter slam back down on the same spot each time.
http://www.cranecams.com/uploads/breakin/548e.pdf
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Good information all around, guys.
I have the valve cover off, but haven't specifically looked at the condition on the top of the lifters or the appearance of the cam lobes. I'll try to remember to take a look tonight.
When this engine went together, I used the TechTonics "coated" hydraulic tappets. If I remember correctly, these lifters are also lighter than the factory hydro units.
Steve.
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745, notice for that cam its 1500rpm and above easily rev up and down bet 1500-3000, similar. i find above 2000 at this early stage(1ststage), unless your cam mfg recommends; 2000 is normal , both enough oil there, and not enough speed/rpm to bother anything, & for your 1st start your doing some work on internals, not as much as when you put a load on it, but its a good 1st workout, then i change oil/filter and go to the next step, 100miles low/mid speeds lots of load. dont forget decel revs, like the man has quoted, he finds a good hill and up with a lot of load, down -off throttle decel, or reverse load.
when a motor isnt in gear 3000rpm is A lot, above and you can ask for trouble.