VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
General Information => General => Topic started by: Enslaved_Pickle on December 12, 2013, 05:45:27 am
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So, I thought I would be ready for winter this year, but I guess not.
Specs- 1.9 aaz freshly rebuilt pump, 250,000k "ish" on the motor, timed to .97mm
I bout,
-new winter tires
-new bosch duraterms
-new rad
-new thermostat
-new heatercore
-new oem battery
-made custom glow plug bus bar
-only use fully synthetic Castrol edge in the motor and redline mt-90 in trans
But this morning I went to start the car (in Windsor Ontario) and it was 12F or -11 and 85% humidity, and had some problems for the first time. The car started pretty well up until this point, and it had only sat for a day. I cycled the glow plugs 3 times like I usually do in the winter and it started right up like it usually does, but then after a minute or so (about the time the afterglow stops I'm assuming) the car shook and died. It did this 2 more times before it decided to stay running, on the last crank I almost killed the battery, I know a lot of you live in colder climates then me so your input would be appreciated :)
My questions for the gurus
1.) should I be expecting this behavior at these temps without a block heater? Or should I be checking compression and doing rings?
2.) I like the stock glow plug relay, but should I be installing a push button bypass to keep them glowing if need be?
3.) I'm also entertaining the idea of installing a diesel powered cab heater since I'm usually back home after dropping off the wife and the car is still cold, even with cardboard blocking half the rad. Anyone done this? Does it keep the interior "toasty"??
Pics for clicks :) In the process of painting white
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff89/Ryan14182/Mark%203%20Vw/image_zps843e1e4b.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Ryan14182/media/Mark%203%20Vw/image_zps843e1e4b.jpg.html)
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A block heater should not be needed until subzero, unless low compression. I'd check compression first... Always good to know anyway.
A block heater is also nice for ready cabin heat, but a good heater core can deliver comfortable cabin temps in 10min of surface street operation.
You might block the entire grille, instead of part of the radiator, it will block all ram-flow but still allow the fan to draw sufficient air through the radiator when needed.
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Its odd i have no problem getting heat in my mtdi in just a few minutes.
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did it smoke once when it started???
i think if it is actually starting then compression or glow plugs isn't the issue, i think i'd be checking for air in the fuel lines or a poor connection to the fuel stop solenoid.
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it could be the fuel gelling I don't at what temp diesel gells but that might be part of it
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That should not happen to diesel sold in canada or anything north of the mason dixon for that matter.
only time i ever had an issue with gelling is when i bought an eco diesel in south carolina and it had been sitting since the summer between gelled fuel, cold temps in wv and an old fuel filter life was hard for that drive home..
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^ yup... BDTD.
<10oF this morning... started my '86 1st try (I still need to put in winter oil). I have recent compression readings somewhere... this motor got a HG last winter.
It could be a bubble of air near the tank, making its way to the IP in a minute or two. Do these have water-separators?
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Not really any smoke,
I forgot about the possibility of air, the though didn't cross my mind since i rebuilt and checked everything last january when i built the car,
-tank is clean
- lines are free of cracks and pinholes
- new fuel filter "has 30,000k on it now"
But i left the check valves in :/ I pressure checked them under water before i reinstalled them but i do get the occasional bubble in the pump inlet line.
So to the people that have deleted the check valves do you have any trouble with the car running if you're climbing a mountain or after you parked on a hill?
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unless your tank is near empty you should have no issues. I have no check valves on my mtdi passat or my mk2 eco.
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A few air bubbles in the IN line every now and again seem to be fairly normal.
I run a 12v electric pump, that is 12v keyed hot.. so if I ever have loss of prime for whatever reason, it is a non-issue and I am not stranded because of it.
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Sounds like it ran with the fuel that was in the pump and lines, then stalled because the fuel filter is frozen. At 30,000 kms your fuel filter is due to be changed. Any small amount of water will freeze the element with that much mileage.
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After reading this botton to top I have to agree with The Caveman, too much time on the fuel filter and with the drop in temps your out of fuel at the filter after start up. Pull the filter off and change it. Drain it into a glass jar after it warms up to 35 or so and see if there is water in there. It doesn't take much when conditions get like you describe.
Why don' t you have heat? Plugged system somewhere? Bad valve? I would also entirely block the radiator. Had to do it all the time on the Jeep. Still got plenty of air from underneath when moving.
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The cold air entering the engine compartment can make the engine run colder, but the cold air going through the radiator has no effect unless the thermostat is not working. In other words, placing a piece of cardboard behind the radiator will raise coolant temps the same as a piece of cardboard in front of the radiator. The temperature of the coolant in the radiator does not affect the temperature of the coolant in the engine or heater circuit until the thermostat is not functioning properly or is fully open which never happens in cold weather.
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It almost stalled again today so i'll be replacing the fuel filter next chance i get. And it does have heat, it just takes about 23 minutes or more to heat up (according to gauge) and even when it does its not very hot, when it snows or rains all the windows fog up, and the passengers are never warm, ....deleted ac when i got the car however.......
Last winter (running 2.0 gas) the heat was hot enough to remove fog off all windows, the only thing i can think of is the aftermarket thermostat (carquest..not oem) opens too soon and stays open
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Or the foam on the blend door has failed, which is super duper uber common. Had any little foam chunks blowing out of your vents lately?
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Regarding in-cab heat, I recently acquired the electric heater core from a 2006 tdi jetta to retrofit into my 2007 GTI.
That's the revision E electric core. It's maybe 12mm thick and has it's own control circuitry. All i have to do is hookup power and ground, tie it into the convenience canbus, and use vag-com to tell the computer that it exists, and voila - instant heat.
the rev. E element is semi-rare and usually costs a ton of money. The rev. F and G are 'dumb' heating elements. Just 1000 watts worth of ceramic heating elements with fins and a couple power lugs.
These are small enough that they could probably be sandwiched into a modified heater core on just about any vehicle.
The problem is that you would need (really, NEED) a method of control. Probably pulse wave modulation on an array of big mosfets, thermometer near the heater box output, another right in the fins to detect over-heat condition, and duty cycles from 5% to 100% with, say, a minimum 5 second on or off cycle.
I'm considering it. PWM isn't supposed to be hard with an arduino.
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I redid the blend doors when i did the heater core. And i've never been a fan of electrically generated heat, too inefficient in my opinion " remember i'm striving for 60+mpg real world driving", was thinking about running the cab heater off a 1 gallon container of diesel, but i'd have to find one for about $300 in order to actually go through with it, i can't bring myself to spend $1200 + on a heater
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I redid the blend doors when i did the heater core. And i've never been a fan of electrically generated heat, too inefficient in my opinion " remember i'm striving for 60+mpg real world driving", was thinking about running the cab heater off a 1 gallon container of diesel, but i'd have to find one for about $300 in order to actually go through with it, i can't bring myself to spend $1200 + on a heater
I hear what you're saying - but the modern ceramic PTC heating element isn't near as inefficient as a metal filament.
shame of it is, i can't seem to find numbers that describe just how much more efficient they are vs. say nichrome.
You could probably get a 1K0963235F or G from a 2008+ VW TDI plus a $12 digital thermostat - http://www.ebay.com/itm/200948859490 - plus a high current solenoid - http://www.ebay.com/itm/161000994310 and be good to go for less than $150.
set the thermostat for 24c and as soon as the water heater core is putting out heat you won't be using the electric at all.
My mk5 GTI now has the Rev.E CANbus controlled PTC heater core and the results are astounding - after 2 minutes all the windows are clear and after 15 minutes i have to take off my coat - but it does have the big alternator and i crammed the biggest AGM battery that will fit into the battery box.
The F and G revision cores are dumb (no on-board control) but could be controlled with simple off-the-shelf circuits.
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Well folks i think i found the problem, "fuel check valves"
On friday i stomped on it in 5th on the highway to avoid a merging driver and a few minutes later the car started lunging forward. My first thought was air in the lines, i limped off the highway and it stalled shortly after leaving me stranded in the parkinglot of a paint store. I popped the hood and as i had thought the lines were full of air bubbles. I checked the filter for leaks and couldn't see any, so i popped the trunk, opened the fuel pump access hole and found one of the check valves in a few pieces. Luckily i had my tool box and spare fuel tube with me "been waiting for this day for awhile". I took out the check valves and replaced them with tube and it started right up after i got the air out. The engine seems to purr now too, i don't think it liked those valves at all, i'm curious to see if theres a mileage increase. My butt dyno senses more power as well :D
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Thought i would post this question in here rather than start a new thread. I've been dealing with serp belt squeak since i rebuilt the car. I have replaced the belt 2 with smaller sizes, replaced the belt tensioner and last night i replaced the crank pulley and IT STILL SQUEAKS!! :( the only thing i can think of is that the belt tensioner which is "carquest" not oem, has too much tension? Or they have given me the wrong belt twice. The belt is rubbing on the top of the waterpump pulley
I even bought a belt 1/4" shorter than what they recommended and after a week or two is started squeaking again, any ideas?
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When you say you replaced the tensioner...
Did you replace the TENSIONER or the TENSIONER PULLEY?
Too much tension would definitely not be an issue, too little would cause squeaking.
Ah, I might know the issue... You're a fellow Canuck. Here's a bet that your car doesn't have AC? Actually yup, I see that in your thread... So you have a serp belt without an AC compressor any more?
It sounds like you've got the wrong collection of pulleys on there. If you delete the AC compressor then you need to change the WP pulley to the non-AC style. That one gets driven by the serpentine belt instead of the v-belt. That leaves only the PS pump being driven by the v-belt, so you need a shorter v-belt too.
If you go that route, here's what you need:
http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/tdi-water-pump-pully_topic61385.html
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I deleted the ac from the "car" when i got it, the aaz came without ac, waterpump pulley is stock, everything is serp belt, i have no v-belt since i deleted ps.
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OK - if the belt is too long and rubbing on they WP pulley under the tensioner then you still need a shorter belt. The parts stores seem to really suck at belt size lookups for the Canada-specific engines so I'm not surprised you've had issues. Our ACC-engined Jetta took about 3 tries to get the right size belt and it has exactly the same pulley layout as you are dealing with.
I believe I got a Gates K060408HD for my car with the same setup.
I haven't put it on yet so I can't say for sure that it is the right size but I got the size info from my research before. You can get the 'regular' version of the belt without the HD suffix for a tiny bit less money. The HD version is their fleet service version which is supposed to last longer. It's a green belt rather than black.
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I have the k060408 on my car right now, it stopped the squeak for about 2 months and then it was back :(
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That really sounds fishy...
I just put my Gates on today, came out like this:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1545649_10152144122466427_99016480_n.jpg)
With that much wrap on the alt pulley it'd take a LOT to make it slip...
Hey do you have a clutched alternator pulley on yours?
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Thats my exact setup " minus the clutched alternator pulley". I just put a new k060408 on yesterday and its already squeaking :( i'm beginning to thinks its either the tensioner pulley or alternator???
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The arm on the tensioner pulley was the culprit on my MKIV
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That could be it too, in the picture above, his water pump pulley has alot of room between it and the belt, mine has about 5mm. I thought maybe the tensioner spring was too strong? Heres some images hopefully they help, the second one shows the tensioner and just how close it is to being at its end, shouldn't it rest in the middle somewhere? Especially with a new belt?
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff89/Ryan14182/image_zps853d0291.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Ryan14182/media/image_zps853d0291.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff89/Ryan14182/image_zps403615c9.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Ryan14182/media/image_zps403615c9.jpg.html)
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Automotive belts aren't really "stretchy" so an overly strong spring wouldn't be an issue. Plus I'd find that extremely unlikely as a cause either way.
The tensioner arms do definitely wear out. If you don't have a clutched alternator pulley your belt is probably jumping around a fair amount too which also wears away the tensioner arm big time.
I greased up the tensioner arm on mine big time before installing it. Don't know if that was necessary or whatever but I didn't think it would hurt.
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The bushings in the tensioner wear out. Once they do the arm of the tensioner grinds on the inside of the bracket where it sits and you will need a new tensioner arm. IDparts has the peices to rebuild your tensioner.
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What's winter? It was 80 today.
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I took the tensioner arm out today and inspected it and the bushing. They are both fine, no play and no grinded down arm. I re-greased the crap out of it and made sure the pulley spun freely. Threw it all back together and started the car,..... It still squeaks :( its slightly quieter but still there. Any other ideas?
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My tensioner looked fine and the pulley spun freely. I replaced it and the noise stopped immediately. If it got quieter after greasing I would still guess that is your issue, you probably just need new.
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Soooo, the squeaking has gotten much worse, it appears that the crank pulley is wobbling more than it was when i bout the car.
I have removed the factory crank bolt and inspected the keyway and there was no signs of wear. I bought a new crank bolt, covered it in red locktite and torqued it correctly. I have also marked a line across the bolt and the sprocket so i would know if it started to loosen.
So now i've replaced
- crank pulley
- crank sprocket bolt
- tensioner and pulley
- 3 different serp belts
the bolt has not moved at all, i'm ready to throw my rusty 1.6na in just to stop the squeaking :( Any ideas?
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did you get a new tensioner, or did you only grease it and reinstall it?
Again, mine looked fine and felt fine, but when I put the new one on all the noise went away.
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Did you get your parts online? I called the dealer today and they can't get the bushings or the tensioner arm :(
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http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=29_90&products_id=629
Yes, I did, but mine is MKIV. I don't know if the tensioners are the same, but I do know mine stopped immediately after replacing. I even talked about it to my mechanic friend and he thought it was so bad that the bearing or clutched pulley was going out of the alt and I should start saving for that. But when I replaced the arm and the entire deal the noise went away completely.
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Here is the link to the parts you need for the vw A3 serpentine setup
http://www.idparts.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=29_90&filter_sess_make=Volkswagen&filter_sess_year=1996&filter_sess_vehicle=15
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That doesn't have the new arm and all the bushings that I could see. That is why I didn't post that for him. I think the problem is in the pivot of the arm when under all that tension.
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I see both an arm and the bushings on that link, even the seals for the arm?
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My bad, I missed that arm before ...2x
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Alright, i'm officially done, if the next thing i do doesn't get the squeak to stop i'm parting out the car.
I changed the tensioner, the tensioner arm and both bushings yesterday with new oem vw parts and it still squeaks!!!! :(
Anyone want an aaz?
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Have you tried using a mechanics stethoscope to narrow down the source of the squeak?
Sent from my HTC One XL using Tapatalk
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maybe its the alternator? Or the harmonic balancer?
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Already swapped alternators and harmonic balancer is new
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checked your jupiter rings?
how long since you changed your blinker fluid?
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So i've replaced the alternator pulley now with a clutched tdi pulley.... *** still squeaks, thinking about trading it for a 1.6na, anyone interested?
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Sure... I have a very good running 89 with a resealed ECO IP. Starts every time, pulls like a tractor. PM me if you are interested.
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mark your crank pulley and see if it is spinning correctly. VC guy just had this issue
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I'm going to attempt to take the wobble out of the crank pulley this week or next, my plan is to remove the harmonic balancer and run the engine while carefully filing the sprocket until its true, a friend of mine said he bout sprockets from several sources and they all weren't true. Also, i'm currently neck deep in an 020, never rebuilt a tranny before but it can't be harder than an injection pump right? ;)
Plans are,
arp bolt kit, New seals, Hopefully new bearings if nothing else is fubared.
I did in my second 020 this week, stock aaz timed to .96 with ko3, no mods apparently likes to eat them lol
Anyone have a che 020 kicking around?