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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: R.O.R-2.0 on December 12, 2010, 01:57:33 pm
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someone is telling me they have a 11mm turbo block? i thought all turbo engines had 12mm head bolts..
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they did
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they did make an 11mm TD?
or they did all come with 12mm?
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The turbo motor was an addition in 84 wasn't it?? Therefor making the engines in 83.. 12mm mech blocks.. When was the first year iof factory TD?
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Yup 83 being first year for factory TD would make it a 12mm mechanical engine.
"North America/Japan:
I4 petrol engines
1.6L 76 hp (57 kW) (MY 1980)
1.7L 74 hp (55 kW) (MY 1981-1984)
I4 diesel engines
1.6L 52 hp (39 kW) (1982-1984)
1.6L 68 hp (51 kW) (1983-1984)"
Sources from Wiki-pedia ;)
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guy said he has a 82 rabbit with a turbo motor, and said it has piston cooling jets, and 11mm bolts. he said he is positive it has 11mm bolts..
i dont know of VW ever producing a 11mm turbo engine.
my audi 5k TD prolly has 11mm bolts, but its a 5 cyl.. and totally different.
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I wonder what the code is on the block.. Maybe someone machined and drilled for the cooling jets.. Although that would even be a pain on an 11mm block.. They didn't have the flat spots machined over the oil passage where the jets go..
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Hmm, well seeing as how Vw never offered the TD in the USA for the 1982 model year.. and even if they did the 82 model year (depending on a late model of that year) would have 12mm stuff.
I can only find TD's being offered post-83. Therefore if it is in an 82.. its gotta be a custom job, or a later engine.. Even Europe didn't have the td in 82.
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a little more digging prevails that a 1982 TD existed! However it was sold in a Volkswagen Santana;
(http://www.autoevolution.com/images/models/VOLKSWAGEN_Santana-1982_main.jpg)
However this car was only sold in Brazil, Nicaragua, China and some European countries. Not North America...
I cant find anything on an 11mm TD tho..
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i have never heard of an 11mm td, and even if there was a 1982 td it still would have been a 12mm engine since 1981 was when they switched to 12mm, santana is the same thing as a quantum
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There were some 11mm engines in early '82.. I've only seen them in Westmoreland built Caddys with a build date before 12/81..
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As stated... if really an 11mm bolt block, it's NOT a factory turbo block. In building status in my shop is a NOS factory 11mm "fitted-block", but with with piston cooling squirters added. It's being built as an intercooled 1600TD, but definitely not OG, and much modded (for survival). Nice to trust people, but some folks don't know, except what they're told, while others make up 'convenient' stories to cover unknowns, odd builds, miscellaneous mix 'n match accumulations, and total hack jobs that they want to sell. Not accusing, just saying... !
BTW the diesel Rabbits assembled in Westmoreland County, PA, unlike the gassers, did not source their engines in the U.S. Those engines were shipped in fully-assembled from Germany. Later VW did trust the Mexicans with diesel engine assembly, but never the Yanks. If any early Westmoreland '82 Rabbits actually were fitted with 11mm head bolts(?), those few engines were from leftover '81 stocks, somehow still sitting there, not new TDs. '82-'88 Quantums (Passat Mk 2) were built in Germany, as were the '74-'81 Dashers (Passat Mk1) before them.
J.R.
SoCal
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If any early Westmoreland '82 Rabbits actually were fitted with 11mm head bolts(?), those few engines were from leftover '81 stocks, somehow still sitting there, not new TDs. '82-'88 Quantums (Passat Mk 2) were built in Germany, as were the '74-'81 Dashers (Passat Mk1) before them.
That's sort of what I suspected.. Double checking, the build date on both Caddy's is 7/81 not 11 as I was thinking.. That'd be about as early as one could get for an '82 model..
In building status in my shop is a NOS factory 11mm "fitted-block", but with with piston cooling squirters added.
I'm kinda curious now, any particular reason for adapting this block other than it being a new one?
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a little more digging prevails that a 1982 TD existed! However it was sold in a Volkswagen Santana;
(http://www.autoevolution.com/images/models/VOLKSWAGEN_Santana-1982_main.jpg)
However this car was only sold in Brazil, Nicaragua, China and some European countries. Not North America...
I cant find anything on an 11mm TD tho..
that looks like an audi 4000 or VW quantum damn near..
and like i said..
my Audi 5000.. its a 82 or early 83, cant remember for sure..
pretty sure it got 11mm bolts unless someone knows something i dont..
and pieces i pulled off a MF engine, had date stamps of 4/82 on them..
sure there is the possibility of 11mm TD engines, but not 4 bangers in 82.
block is supposed to be a CY code.. and the owner is POSITIVE the block has 11mm holes.
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http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5119094-Damaged-thread-in-block%97helicoil&p=68958312&posted=1#post68958312 (http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5119094-Damaged-thread-in-block%97helicoil&p=68958312&posted=1#post68958312)
this would be the reasoning for a question..
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I'm on a stupid iPhone so it'll take me forever to check right now, but I think there was both an 11mm cy and 12mm cy.. Could be wrong about that, but IIRC there was one block code that had both size bolts pending on the year... Maybe it was the cr...
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I'm on a stupid iPhone so it'll take me forever to check right now, but I think there was both an 11mm cy and 12mm cy.. Could be wrong about that, but IIRC there was one block code that had both size bolts pending on the year... Maybe it was the cr...
no, you ARE definitely on the RIGHT TRACK.. there was more than one code that shared 11mm and 12mm bolts..
CY being one of them.. i will go look in my manual real quick..
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don't know about north america vw productions but in Europe we have had the (CY bloc) turbo diesel as early as march 1982 ... a mk1 turbo diesel NOT a mk2 transplant (as of 1984 for us);
it's a mechanical head (as opposed to hydraulic). so the question is: are there any 12mm mechanical head engines? if not then the CY should be 11mm ?
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don't know about north america vw productions but in Europe we have had the (CY bloc) turbo diesel as early as march 1982 ... a mk1 turbo diesel NOT a mk2 transplant (as of 1984 for us);
it's a mechanical head (as opposed to hydraulic). so the question is: are there any 12mm mechanical head engines? if not then the CY should be 11mm ?
my MF engine is DEFINITELY 12mm bolts, and is definitely mechanical headed..
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consulted my book, and it says that CY was used until '83
but it also says that CR was not used in 84, and my 84 rabbit should have had a CR in it factory, atleast thats what the sticker on the trunk floor says.. should have had a CR engine/GL trans combo, not a CS/4A combo.
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In North America, the 4-cylinder gassers got hydraulic cam followers in '85, while the 1.6 TD and n.a diesels, by then all fitted with 12mm stretch-to-yield head bolts, kept using mechanical followers until mid-1986.
OTOH once the vehicle is in use for a couple of years, stuff can get moved around a lot on high volume production engines, kinda like trying to i.d. origin of all the individual parts on an unknown rebuilt SBC.
Bought a supposedly all stock '80 Dasher diesel from original owner's family in '92, but oops... when swapping it out for a Quantum 5-speed, I found that this Dasher's tranny actually turned out to be from a 1973 Audi Fox ("AUDI 80" outside N. Amer)! Why? Somebody knows, but the PO stated it had never had trans problems, much less been changed (umm... with his knowledge)! '73 Audi trans has 0.96 4th gear; '80 Dasher trans has 0.88 4th gear; the Audi trans raised the Dasher's cruising RPM by over 9%! IMO Sometimes greasy hands hide sticky fingers.
J.R.
SoCal
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J.R., not to get sideways in this thread, but you are forgetting Sciroccos and Cabriolets that had solid lifter up to '87. Just thought I would put that out there.
OT, perhaps there is an audi 4k engine with a TD and 11mm block? I checked ETOS as it I dont have ETKA here and it yielded nothing in the 145 SG category..
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J.R., not to get sideways in this thread, but you are forgetting Sciroccos and Cabriolets that had solid lifter up to '87. Just thought I would put that out there.
OT, perhaps there is an audi 4k engine with a TD and 11mm block? I checked ETOS as it I dont have ETKA here and it yielded nothing in the 145 SG category..
my audi is an 82 or 83, and has a TD, but is a 5000.. and im pretty sure its probably 11mm bolts..
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J.R., not to get sideways in this thread, but you are forgetting Sciroccos and Cabriolets that had solid lifter up to '87. Just thought I would put that out there.
OT, perhaps there is an audi 4k engine with a TD and 11mm block? I checked ETOS as it I dont have ETKA here and it yielded nothing in the 145 SG category..
my audi is an 82 or 83, and has a TD, but is a 5000.. and im pretty sure its probably 11mm bolts..
The only ETKA I have (late 1997 issue) shows the 1981 Audi 5000 diesels as having 11mm or 12mm headbolts, but all '82 & '83 diesel engines having the 12mm; looks like they switched in about the same time frame as did the 4-bangers.
OTOH the same ETKA shows Scirocco getting hydraulic followers in 1984 (!), and the Cabrios as having both from '84 until 1988. Maybe someone at VW had a chuckle, but that seems a little rough on the dealership parts guy!
J.R.
SoCal
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wow, i guess my 5 banger is a 12mm turbo block then. SWEET!