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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: funkaholik on November 26, 2010, 02:26:38 pm

Title: Head studs question
Post by: funkaholik on November 26, 2010, 02:26:38 pm
So... The FAQ says that the ARP head stud part # is 251-4701. 

ARP says that part # is for a Ford Cosworth Sierra/Escort with a 2.0L DOHC engine.

Just checking that these are in fact the correct studs for a 1.6 TD before I order them.

Help?   ???
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: pyro7890 on November 26, 2010, 03:25:22 pm
ARP # 204-4701 those are correct
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: gnavs on November 26, 2010, 03:42:26 pm
seconded, that's what I got.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: Syncroincity on November 26, 2010, 04:27:19 pm
Correct. Motion passed. :D Works fine, last long time...
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RustyCaddy on November 26, 2010, 05:07:25 pm
i think it goes like this:

251-4701 for 12 mm heads
204-4701 for 11 mm heads
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RadoTD on November 26, 2010, 07:31:19 pm
Get 204-4706! http://arpdiesel.com/pages/newproducts.shtml

220,000psi... 30,000psi more than the cosworth head studs! ;D
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RustyCaddy on November 26, 2010, 08:45:31 pm
Get 204-4706! http://arpdiesel.com/pages/newproducts.shtml

220,000psi... 30,000psi more than the cosworth head studs! ;D

Nice...thanks.

Don't see engine code MF in their list but with ME listed probably would work in MF too?
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RadoTD on November 26, 2010, 09:59:55 pm
Nice...thanks.

Don't see engine code MF in their list but with ME listed probably would work in MF too?

Someone else will have to confirm that for you, as I don't know. I would expect them to work in all 12mm blocks, but I don't know much about the different 1.6 engines
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: rabbitman on November 26, 2010, 10:40:42 pm
All of the 12mm diesel blocks use the same studs/bolts.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: belchfire on November 27, 2010, 07:22:50 pm
Two questions: 1) Where is the best place to get them from?  2) What's the  torque specs?
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: mystery3 on November 27, 2010, 08:18:07 pm
Headbolts.com is pretty reasonable price-wise, don't know where they ship from or anything of their customer service yet. Torque seems to be up for debate.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: theman53 on November 28, 2010, 09:33:53 am
I got mine cheapest at summit racing. Jegs will price match summit and others. Summit is just closest for me, but they will ship about anywhere.
I used a metal hg and torqued it to 100ft/lbs. I did it in about 6 steps though. First I covered the HG in aviation permatex stuff, put the head and everything on, and hand tightened all the nuts. Then I torqued in sequence at 30ft/lbs then 45ft/lbs then 60ft/lbs. I then stopped, filled it with coolant, and plugged in the block heater for 12 hours. It got to 170 degrees at that time. I unplugged it and let it cool a day and did plugged it in again for another 12 hours or so. Then I let it cool and finished torquing the head on 70ft/lbs then 85 ft/lbs and finally 100ft/lbs.
ADHD??? maybe, but they didn't have that diagnosis when I was little so I was just a bad kid that needed a beating. BUT with over 4,000 miles and regularly 17lbs boost with the old ocasional 25psi boost*now much better limited to the 17* no leaks or concerns.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on November 28, 2010, 09:37:23 am
I got mine cheapest at summit racing. Jegs will price match summit and others. Summit is just closest for me, but they will ship about anywhere.
I used a metal hg and torqued it to 100ft/lbs. I did it in about 6 steps though. First I covered the HG in aviation permatex stuff, put the head and everything on, and hand tightened all the nuts. Then I torqued in sequence at 30ft/lbs then 45ft/lbs then 60ft/lbs. I then stopped, filled it with coolant, and plugged in the block heater for 12 hours. It got to 170 degrees at that time. I unplugged it and let it cool a day and did plugged it in again for another 12 hours or so. Then I let it cool and finished torquing the head on 70ft/lbs then 85 ft/lbs and finally 100ft/lbs.
ADHD??? maybe, but they didn't have that diagnosis when I was little so I was just a bad kid that needed a beating. BUT with over 4,000 miles and regularly 17lbs boost with the old ocasional 25psi boost*now much better limited to the 17* no leaks or concerns.

well, i would hope you dont have leaks. i run about the same boost as you, generally 15-17 psi, with blasts up into the mid 20s, and im running stock bolts and stock gasket.. so why arent you making more boost? and using more fuel? make that thing blow some coals!
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: theman53 on November 28, 2010, 09:53:07 am
I will hit 1,200F before I get to do anything fun. I can get to 1,200 with every gear and every shift before the engine is done twisting. I don't have it intercooled and I am hoping that makes it into a different car. I made 30 psi at short bursts before I had the wastegate set correctly. The car really isn't all that I wanted it to be, but it is reliable so far. I don't blow any smoke with those temps either...Giles pump.
Like I said I hope the intercooler makes a night and day difference in EGT. As of now it really is only a little better than my old GTI. When I had the pump set to where Giles had it is was unreal. I could only get on it for about .5 second before it went to 1,200F though. I realize I could do more than 1,200F but this is my daily and I don't want to mess with the engine for another 200,000 or so. That said I think if I didn't let off with the Giles setting I could wrap the EGT gauge needle over to my oil pressure gauge in about 3 seconds.

To OP, see my other post for your info:D
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on November 28, 2010, 10:08:40 am
I will hit 1,200F before I get to do anything fun. I can get to 1,200 with every gear and every shift before the engine is done twisting. I don't have it intercooled and I am hoping that makes it into a different car. I made 30 psi at short bursts before I had the wastegate set correctly. The car really isn't all that I wanted it to be, but it is reliable so far. I don't blow any smoke with those temps either...Giles pump.
Like I said I hope the intercooler makes a night and day difference in EGT. As of now it really is only a little better than my old GTI. When I had the pump set to where Giles had it is was unreal. I could only get on it for about .5 second before it went to 1,200F though. I realize I could do more than 1,200F but this is my daily and I don't want to mess with the engine for another 200,000 or so. That said I think if I didn't let off with the Giles setting I could wrap the EGT gauge needle over to my oil pressure gauge in about 3 seconds.

To OP, see my other post for your info:D

my Diesel is quite a bit quicker/faster/more powerful than my 85 GTI.. and the GTI has a 268* cam, intake, K&N, dual manifold and downpipe w/ cat removed, and a better exhaust system. its alot better than stock form, but my diesel still skools it.. and i know i dont hit 1200* in my engine.. no smoke at all, and my pump is turned down quite a bit. turned down enough that it usually wont put out more than 15 psi worth of fuel..
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: zukgod1 on November 29, 2010, 09:46:59 am
On my old mk2 I could hit 1200 no problem, but....
I had tons of fuel. I build pumps as well that one would about droun the engine if I wasn't careful. Used injector tips off a CASE backhoe.
Was also running a huge front mount and a hybrid kkk24/26, full 3" turbo back.

Anyway, I ran the ARP's in the first post with a MLS gasket and hit 40psi several times, oftin ran it at 30psi sustained. I detuned that engine quite a bit when I sold it so it would be easier to drive. It's still on the road blowing smoke today...

He actually has it for sale I think.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: R.O.R-2.0 on November 29, 2010, 09:57:57 am
isnt the 24/26 an agreed upon performance restriction? the hot side being too restrictive for the massive K26 cold scroll?
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: zukgod1 on November 29, 2010, 10:01:41 am
Not that I'm aware of.

Have the 24 hot side machined as I did and your set. 

Drive pressure was about 1.1:1 and less most of the time. So 25psi on the cold side and 30psi on the hot side.

The problem is (at least at my elevation) it takes to damn long to spool for normal driving. I swapped on a 24 when I sold it again so it was easier to drive.
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RadoTD on November 29, 2010, 07:13:53 pm
Did you ever run that engine on a dyno or drag strip? How quick would it be, say compared to a good running stock VR?  ;)
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: zukgod1 on November 29, 2010, 09:04:54 pm
Even a mildly tuned vr would be seen in the rear view mirror, never tracked it but I did run out up against a couple 318's and several hondas. the only car that ever really challenged me was a really built WRX. We ran out of road and bothh of us have the other thumbs up...
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RabbitJockey on November 29, 2010, 09:29:13 pm
On my old mk2 I could hit 1200 no problem, but....
I had tons of fuel. I build pumps as well that one would about droun the engine if I wasn't careful. Used injector tips off a CASE backhoe.
Was also running a huge front mount and a hybrid kkk24/26, full 3" turbo back.

Anyway, I ran the ARP's in the first post with a MLS gasket and hit 40psi several times, oftin ran it at 30psi sustained. I detuned that engine quite a bit when I sold it so it would be easier to drive. It's still on the road blowing smoke today...

He actually has it for sale I think.


was it a coupe in york pa?
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: RadoTD on November 29, 2010, 09:36:32 pm
Even a mildly tuned vr would be seen in the rear view mirror, never tracked it but I did run out up against a couple 318's and several hondas. the only car that ever really challenged me was a really built WRX. We ran out of road and bothh of us have the other thumbs up...

That's sweet :) Can't wait to get mine running! haha
Title: Re: Head studs question
Post by: zukgod1 on November 30, 2010, 07:03:39 am
Quote

was it a coupe in york pa?


Nope. Sedan in Utah.