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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: TOW'D on July 24, 2010, 08:30:27 am

Title: t belt broke
Post by: TOW'D on July 24, 2010, 08:30:27 am

Howdy Gang,
 The t belt broke on our '85 n/a Golf . The belt and all had less than 15,000km.
I don't know if it had anything to do with driving into deep mud puddles on our long driveway. The alternator belt would squeel when it got wet.
I pulled the head.

 I can't get 2 of the lifter out of the head.
There isn't any adjusting shims on the lifters so it must be a hydraulic lifters--does that sound correct?

I searched but didn't find what I was looking for.

I have a valve spring compressor(big C clamp looking tool ) is there an adapter to get into the cylinder head to remove the valves?

If I understand correctly the notches on the head gasket tell how much the pistons extend out of the block -- this H/G has two holes/notches

any good links for me to read .

thanks

hank

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: Rabbit on Roids on July 24, 2010, 11:02:42 am

the head is most likely trashed..

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: theman53 on July 24, 2010, 11:14:58 am

Just curious...what brand of TB and tensioner did you have?
There is a tools thread around here somewhere.
http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=771 (http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=771)

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: OM617 on July 24, 2010, 02:53:20 pm

Quote from: Rabbit on Roids on July 24, 2010, 11:02:42 am

the head is most likely trashed.

Not true. It greatly depends on the engine speed at which it broke and how long the vehicle was kept in gear after it broke.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: burn_your_money on July 24, 2010, 03:44:55 pm

85 should be solid lifters but if there are no adjusting shims on the top then it is a hydraulic engine. If you can get those 2 lifters out without destroying the head you should be able to salvage it. I would focus on them before looking at valves. There is some info in the FAQ on homemade tools for removing the valve train.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: 745 turbogreasel on July 24, 2010, 04:05:46 pm

Quote from: TOW'D on July 24, 2010, 08:30:27 am

If I understand correctly the notches on the head gasket tell how much the pistons extend out of the block -- this H/G has two holes/notches

There is no guarantee the right HG was used by the previous builder.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: DCC on July 25, 2010, 04:59:07 am

Quote from: Rabbit on Roids on July 24, 2010, 11:02:42 am

the head is most likely trashed..

Not necessarily. In my case, when the damaged t-belt slipped out of the cam pulley, I was expecting a FUBAR head, but luckily replacing all the valves, cam followers and camshaft (it broke), did the trick.  :)

In the OP case, I'll have the head tested, and the piston protusion measured.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: jasonsansfleece on July 25, 2010, 06:34:49 am

Weld a bolt to the top of the stuck lifter then use vise grips to pull it out.
Worked for me,
Guy

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: Rabbit on Roids on July 25, 2010, 11:32:44 am

Quote from: Rabbit on Roids on July 24, 2010, 11:02:42 am

the head is most likely trashed..

im not saying its a definite thing, but any engines ive seen do this, the heads need replacing..good job, you 2 are the first i know that saved their engines after a belt failure.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: wolf_walker on July 25, 2010, 12:57:21 pm

(http://soonerdudes.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/wrong-on-internet.jpg)


I second the weld something to it or set it up to use a slide hammer to pull the lifter.  If you are going to have a machine shop look it over, which you should, leave it be and let them deal with it.  Otherwise get the lifter out, buy a new one and see if you can get it to move in and out freely, same with all the others.  After that we can move on to the next thing to check.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: DCC on July 25, 2010, 03:24:22 pm

Quote from: Rabbit on Roids on July 25, 2010, 11:52:23 am

ive never seen a broken cam shaft because the piston pushed up on the valves.. idk what your smokin, but i want some..

Here you go. I posted this same pic on this very same forum before:

(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/2457/imagen099du4.jpg)

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: burn_your_money on July 25, 2010, 07:09:09 pm

Sorry if this thread is a bit confusing now, I just deleted a bunch of posts that weren't contributing to the OPs questions.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: TOW'D on July 25, 2010, 10:26:22 pm

Quote from: theman53 on July 24, 2010, 11:14:58 am

Just curious...what brand of TB and tensioner did you have?
There is a tools thread around here somewhere.
http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=771 (http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=771)

Not sure of the brand but we bought the timing belt kit from eBay along with a set of timing tools.

 When the belt broke I was driving slowly in town
I pushed the clutch in and coasted to a stop and checked under the hood and saw the broken belt when I undid the top cover.

Thanks for the homemade tool link some good tools there.

I'll try welding and slidehammer trick


 What would be a reasonable price for a good rebuilt head?


So nobody else gets a warning when signing in?thanks
hank

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: theman53 on July 26, 2010, 05:23:08 am

Not sure of the brand but we bought the timing belt kit from eBay along with a set of timing tools.

There are alot from ebay...I was just wondering if it came from NC from a certain seller that is all. Good luck.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: Wingaman on July 26, 2010, 06:54:23 am

http://cgi.ebay.ca/Timing-Belt-Tensioner-VW-1-6-Diesel-Jetta-Golf-Rabbit-/330453419892?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4cf08f0774 (http://cgi.ebay.ca/Timing-Belt-Tensioner-VW-1-6-Diesel-Jetta-Golf-Rabbit-/330453419892?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4cf08f0774)

This one ? I'm not surprise that the belt broke ! Do a research on Rothenbacher Engineering

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: TOW'D on July 26, 2010, 08:10:54 am

Quote from: Wingaman on July 26, 2010, 06:54:23 am

http://cgi.ebay.ca/Timing-Belt-Tensioner-VW-1-6-Diesel-Jetta-Golf-Rabbit-/330453419892?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4cf08f0774 (http://cgi.ebay.ca/Timing-Belt-Tensioner-VW-1-6-Diesel-Jetta-Golf-Rabbit-/330453419892?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4cf08f0774)

This one ? I'm not surprise that the belt broke ! Do a research on Rothenbacher Engineering

yes I think that was the one we bought.

Anybody know about the "Threat Detected" warning we get when signing in or is it just me?

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: veedubcanuck on July 26, 2010, 09:53:38 am

I get it too

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: vanbcguy on July 27, 2010, 06:59:59 pm

Next time spend almost the same money as you spent and get a REAL timing belt and tensioner... I'm sure you've learned your lesson now, but anyhow...

http://parts.autopartsonlinecanada.com/parts/apocanada/wizard.jsp?year=1986&make=VW&model=JET-D-001&category=A&part=Timing+Belt+Kit (http://parts.autopartsonlinecanada.com/parts/apocanada/wizard.jsp?year=1986&make=VW&model=JET-D-001&category=A&part=Timing+Belt+Kit) - $60 Canadian

http://www.autopartsway.com/autoparts2/index.cfm?fetch=part~ID=1986~Volkswagen~Jetta%20Diesel%201.6%20L4%20Base~240278 (http://www.autopartsway.com/autoparts2/index.cfm?fetch=part~ID=1986~Volkswagen~Jetta%20Diesel%201.6%20L4%20Base~240278) - $42 US

Those are Continental belts - they are for all intents and purposes OEM. 

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: TOW'D on July 29, 2010, 08:46:10 am

thanks for the help guys
I have learned ,my lesson
I'll get a Continental brand
hank

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: DCC on July 29, 2010, 01:36:02 pm

Quote from: TOW'D on July 29, 2010, 08:46:10 am

I'll get a Continental brand
hank

Checkout Gates, they're a good brand as well.

They offer kits that includes the tensioner. That's the one I put in my car last time.

Title: Re: t belt broke
Post by: Quantum TD on July 30, 2010, 01:46:15 pm

Quote from: DCC on July 29, 2010, 01:36:02 pm

Quote from: TOW'D on July 29, 2010, 08:46:10 am

I'll get a Continental brand
hank

Checkout Gates, they're a good brand as well.

They offer kits that includes the tensioner. That's the one I put in my car last time.

Indeed. Gates is as good or better than Conti/OEM. For the TDIs, they make the 100k PTFE coated belts that exceed the original belts.