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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: brandon5 on February 19, 2010, 12:06:24 pm
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So i've made a couple threads in here so far and I've never been this lost with a car before... This thing has been sitting for way to long. You diesel guys are my last hope.
Ok so if you dont know, its a 92 golf with a 1.9td engine from a 97 jetta. I swapped the entire harness with it so i could swap the dash. I turn the ignition and all it does is clicks. Ive tested everything. Starter works, battery holds a good charge. Motor will even turn when i apply power to the solenoid. But the car will not start that way, i cant even smell diesel when i crank. The ignition isnt getting power obviously, I just recently put the wiring in for the stock mk3 alarm and i bypassed it. Still no power coming through. I even topped up the diesel just to make sure it had any.
Even if i could completely bypass the alarm, or start it by jumping the starter that would be a huge step.
Thanks for your time.
Brandon
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ok so when you try to crank the starter solendoid clicks??? or is it a relay under the dash??
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Is it a diesel starter? the gasser starter wont work.
How do you know the starter works if it does not turn over with the key?
Is the terminal 50 wire hooked up to the starter? (the one that the ignition uses to tell the starter to turn) For some reason I always forget to hook this one back up, and I usually panic momentarily.
You need to have 12v running to the stop solenoid on the injection pump to prime if you are cranking by hand, otherwise you are just getting exercise.
did you unbolt the fuel line unions at the injectors and crank until you saw fuel at all 4?
That's all I can think of right now.
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Does it have a neutral saftey switch? Needing you to step on the clutch (or on some the brake) for anything to happen?
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It wouldn't even click if there was a neutral safety switch.
Much like not connecting your seatbelt in a '91 Golf,.. nothing happens.
Click it, then hold it there.
Go out and feel for warm connections.
I'm guessing starter solenoid.
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When i crank just the relay clicks. And it is a diesel starter. I got it bench tested, and i can crank it if i apply power directly to it. The black and red wire is hooked up to the starter. How do i apply power straight to the fuel pump? And how do i check if fuel is running through. All i know is when it cranks, fuel runs through the lines. Although it is bubbly. It might have a clutch switch but its not hooked up.
Even if i can start it without the ignition that would be good for now, Because it hasn't been started since it was swapped.
Thanks
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97 is late for a TD - post up a pic of your injector pump and we can tell you what you need to put 12V to in order to allow the car to start when it turns over on the starter.
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. How do i apply power straight to the fuel pump?
just jump it from the battery for now until you can get it started, or tap a source that has power while cranking
And how do i check if fuel is running through. All i know is when it cranks, fuel runs through the lines. Although it is bubbly.
slightly loosen the union at the injector and crank until you see fuel come out of the unions. could have air locked up in there
Thanks
good luck
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Thanks guys, if any of this works i owe you a lot.
This is the best picture i have right now. I can get a better one if you want.
(http://i915.photobucket.com/albums/ac360/brandon555555/19td002.jpg)
Sorry to sound kind of like a noob but i am. Where exactly do i apply power well cranking?
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Well forget about everything else.
1- The starter works if 12v applied
2- Fuel shut off must be open if fuel is moving around the lines, bubble should go away after it has run for a minute or two.
What are the temperatures like around there? Your Glow Plug system probably isn't working right now (especially if you are jumping it). Unless the garage is heated, even cool temperatures could make it hard to start.
Did you have to change the timing belt or play with the injection pump at all?
Do you get white smoke out the tailpipe when you try to jump start it?
Essentially, if you have 12v to the stop solenoid and 12v to the starter so it turns, and you have fuel, it should start (with the exception of it being cold of course, but then you would have lots of white smoke.)
Ian
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Its around 0 right now. When i try and jump it, it doesn't seem like its even trying to start. Because you cant even smell fuel. Do i have to apply power to the pump?
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if you have no power to the pump, it will never run, no matter what. EVER!
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So can i run a wire from the battery straight to the pump while cranking manually? If so where do i run it to, All i see is a 4 prong plug.
Thanks
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Ok so i found the wire on the stop solenoid. Put power to it and i could hear it open. I held power to that while i cranked the starter and the fuel still wasn't burning. But the fuel doesn't really have bubbles in it anymore. is there away to bypass the all the alarms and switches to the ignition? It would make this a lot easier.
Thanks
If anyone needs pics to better help describe ill take them.
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bump
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your ignition problem could be the back off the ignition {the actual electrical switch} which your ignition barrel turns as the key way on the shaft rounds the pocket in the switch which then in turn stops the switch from turning when you turn the key {the barrel and shaft turns but the switch don't make proper contact resulting in relays clicking } to check if that is the problem take of the covers to access the back of the ignition and look for the small grub screw that holds the switch to the ignition then remove the switch and insert a flat bladed screwdriver into the pocket and turn .I had the same problem with many golf and transporters ,it may sort out the problem of not turning over the engine of the key but you may have other starting problems ,i don't know about the US and Can but by 97 most vw diesels in the UK had immobilizers built on to the injection pumps hope that makes some sense
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Ill look into that but im not sure. Because i have both ignitions. one from the 1.6d and one from the 1.9td. Whats the other immobilizer?
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by the sound of it you do not have a immobilizer as you said you could here the fuel shutoff solenoid operate when you put power to it from the battery ,in the UK they have a shield around the solenoid which contains the immobilizer. And its the actual switch that wears {the bit with the wires connected to it at the opposite end to where you put the key in to the barrel}not the ignition i.e the metal bit so when you turn the key the the keyed shaft turns with the turn of the key but fails to turn the switch enough to make the electrical contacts meet within the switch it normally switches ignition lights on but when you turn the key to the next position {start} you just get the relays clicking and buzzing in the fuse box
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Maybe you should just hot wire the stop solenoid on the injection pump and tow start the car?
If there's a lot of air in the fuel lines it'll take forever and a day to get started with the starter.
Just to hear the engine purr will give you energy to deal with the electrical issue ;D
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Maybe you should just hot wire the stop solenoid on the injection pump and tow start the car?
If there's a lot of air in the fuel lines it'll take forever and a day to get started with the starter.
Just to hear the engine purr will give you energy to deal with the electrical issue ;D
second this post!
As you have said, wire up the stop solenoid to 12V (put a switch in it if you plan on driving it so you can turn the car off when it starts). First start is ALWAYS diifficult after an engine swap unless you miraculously have not much/any air in the pump and lines. Tow start or hill start on a good hill will get you going though - you need plenty of rpm to pump all the air out of hte pump and lines so i like to use about 25km/h and second gear :-D
Also, just make sure all the fuel lines are tight and your not drawing in too much air.