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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: westcoaster on July 03, 2009, 05:59:21 pm
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I had a drip, drip, dribble coming from behind the timing belt cover area. Naturally, I said to myself "self, you have a bad headgasket" So I go to town and pull the whole thing apart , buy the parts and reassemble....
I go to refill the rad, drip, drip dribble.... (insert favorite expletive here)
Now I said to myself "self, you have bigger problems....."
Doesn't look like the head. It's coming out from under that. Back to pull it all apart again.....
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Could be a leaky frost plug........
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Could be a leaky frost plug........
Nope, it's coming from behind the timing belt cover (this engine is in my suzuki samurai)
There are two brackets bolted to the front of the engine. One is a thin tin plate with the clamps for the timing belt cover. The other is the bracket the IP attaches to.
Coolant is flowing along the top of the IP mounting bracket and dripping down from there. I'll need to pull the IP and all the bracketry to source this leak.
best case: there are a couple bolt holes that appear to go through to the water jacket. These are underneath where the coolant is coming from. Generally water doesn't flow up hill....
then there is a remote possability the head or gasket didn't seal
worst case, cracked block....
What are my options if the block is cracked?
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IIRC there's a frost plug in the block behind the IP bracket.......or maybe on the side of the head......I'm still tryin' to save yer block here.......
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There is a small frost plug on the end of the head....Kinda behind the bottom of the cam sprocket... I don;t have a block sitting to verify, but I think there are only those three plugs along the side...
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I don't think VW has any bolts that go into the cooling jackets.
That front plug that maxfax is talking about would be where I started looking.
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Yes, there is a frost plug on the front of the head up and to the left of the tensioner bolt (at least on the head I have on the shelf)
Sadly, that's not where my dribble is coming from. Still from the right and along the IP bracket...
I pulled the nut/bolt deal that the one bolt in the timing belt attaches to. My leak then started drippling from that hole.
Heep in mind this is all flowing from a system that has no pressure in it yet.....
Stoopid VW engine.... :P
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Oh yeah.....
I don't even need to refill to see where it's leaking from....
Can this be patched or is it junk?
(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/Westcoasterz/adayoutLarge.jpg)
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Yikes! Do you even have compression in that cylinder?
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Have no idea. I didn't notice any leaks when I pulled off the old headgasket. ???
Meh, atleast I didn't spring for a new head when they told me this one was junk! (for cracks between the valves)
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well if the crack is only in the water jacket and not the cylinder its self, and the corner bolt there still goes to some solid threads (maybe switch to studs). assuming those 2 things you could try jb weld. it sounds like half assing it, and truely it is, but it could work.
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I'd be tempted to not use that bolt there.
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:o what did you do to that poor engine!!! Are you running any boost? wow, that's pretty bad :(
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I haven't even run half a tank through the thing. As best I can tell it's bone stock. I have no idea what would have caused this. Was more than likely that way when I got it.
Went after it with brake cleaner and a toothbrush. Now the whole crack stands out nice and bold like...
I guess the only question is how much bolt is holding the head down in that corner. I might just stop fooling around and go buy myself a long block. A kick in the jewels no doubt, but at least it (should) have good compression and oil pressure....
(http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/Westcoasterz/adayout148Large.jpg)
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Yeah, in my mind your last picture is the final nail in the coffin. :'(
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Change in tactic....
So the block is trash, that is plain to see. I had the head in for a pressure test and they told me it was leaking between intake and exhaust on one cylinder. I opted to simply toss it back on the block with a new gasket anyway.
This really is a "nothing to lose" engine....
I would like to be able to get another half dozen or so tanks of diesel through this before I pull it for a long block. I also need to solve my cooling issues and ensure the rad I have will keep things cool.
Drilling the ends of the crack to keep things from travelling is a start. grove the crack and fill with?
So, let's hear your bootyfab solutions to seal this thing up and get it running again. I'm not done blowing this one up yet....
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that is bad - it can be repaired tho - find someone who really knows how to weld cast iron, its a very finicky process
usually caused by overtensioned headbolts not tightened in the correct sequence - it can also be caused by blocked headgasket passages..
when I replaced my headgasket - which btw was the original factory VW gasket, the coolant holes on cyls 3 and 4 were larger while on cyls 1 and 2 were smaller, makes sense coz the pump is running just south of cylinder 1 - its got loads of coolant flow available immediately cyl 4 doesnt.
I always make sure to enlarge the coolant holes for cyl3 and 4 in new head gaskets
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just wonderin', what is the bolt hole that the crack goes through hold on; the injection pump bracket? makes you wonder which bolt was torqued too much, the cylinder head bolt or that one. either way, that sucks. good luck.... :)
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just wonderin', what is the bolt hole that the crack goes through hold on; the injection pump bracket? makes you wonder which bolt was torqued too much, the cylinder head bolt or that one. either way, that sucks. good luck.... :)
It's a double nut thing that holds on the IP bracket and the one bolt for the timing belt cover.
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your better off with a different block all together imho...thats a really bad crack that will take lots of work to "fix" and even then your asking for trouble.
seems like it would be money..time and headache ahead if you found a new engine.
if you do run it please report back :P ;D
if that crack goes to the Head gasket surface then I cant see how you could stop any leaks for very long.........
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If you have compression in that cylinder I'd channel out the crack a bit, fill it with JB weld and then run that coolant that doesn't require any pressure. Evans perhaps? I would not use that "double nut" bolt hole though.
I'd recommend a leak down test on that cylinder to see if combustion gasses are getting into the oil or coolant.
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Well, I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by trying that.
None of the parts I have bought can be re used on a new engine so I might as well get some use out of them..... :'(
edit:
I will need to install that "double nut" thing back in the block with gobs of permatex sealant on it to keep any leaks from dribbling out of the hole...
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Dang!
If it weren't for having to pull the head again, I'd grind it out and fill it with brass.. Old school head and block repair from back in the day, but it worked rather well... Trouble is you're gonna have to get it hot and probably end up damaging the HG...
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could always weld the crack with the head off and grit your teeth?
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I had to spot weld a ring grear on my two cylinder JD 70 flywheel. I used my arc welder with nickel rod. Worked great. Might work for the block.
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Oh, Yeah!
This is going to be booty fantastic (if it holds for very long....)
Ground out the crack a little with a rotary file.
Mixed up some JB weld and applied to the cracks.
Permatex form-a-gasket between the IP bracket and the block. Stuffed some permatex down the hole (not enough no doubt) applied a liberal ammount to the threads on the "double nut" and screwed that in without cranking it down too tight.
It'll more than likely still leak a little. At least it won't be gushing out without any pressure in the system like it was before.
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Switch to a coolant that doesn't require pressure. I'm pretty sure it's called Evans coolant
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Switch to a coolant that doesn't require pressure. I'm pretty sure it's called Evans coolant
It's expensive sh*t though. Over $30 a gal and you may need to buy extra sh*t to wash out the system so it's gonna be a lot of dough. ::)
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i bet you, or the previous owner cracked it from torquing the head. or it could be from tons of boost. is this a turbo engine? on my first 1.5D, i cracked 7 out of the 10 threaded holes in the deck of the block. but over 30psi didnt help that situation out any.
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It's expensive sh*t though. Over $30 a gal and you may need to buy extra sh*t to wash out the system so it's gonna be a lot of dough. ::)
Garden hose, and some Dawn dish soap from your local General store. Great for washing out the system trust me :P lol