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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on July 02, 2009, 01:08:18 pm
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Are any of you prepared to change an alternator belt or water pump belt when it breaks unexpectedly? If so, what tools and parts do you carry with you or do you simply rely on AAA? :)
Edit: This is for a car with power steering and air condition.
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Spare belt, 3/8" drive ratchet with the sockets and hex drivers appropriate for your pulleys, and a large flat blade screwdriver.
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if you have to call AAA for a broken v-belt......... ::). call a buddy, and get a ride to the parts store, cheap ass socket set should already be in the car. voila..and if you need to know what sockets.....you can take most vw's apart with only the 8,10,13, and 15mm sockets. if you can't afford the whole set.....vice grips ::)(omg, I can't believe I just said that ;D)
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I have a set of screw driers and small sockets in the car now, I bought a small wallet of sockets and 1/2" ratchet with 3/8" adaptor but since moving can't find them! ???
Also have my alternator belt in the car at all time. I'll have to keep a PAS belt in there too now I've got PAS.
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Talk is cheap. ::) Have you actually replaced the alternator belt in an emergency? Give me a step by step of what you did. ;)
ps. I'm talking my car with power steering and AC.
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actually, removing those belts are the first thing ANYONE does to work on a motor, emergency or not; so don't get so butt hurt
alright, get ready to get wow'ed by this. so you have a/c and power steering, its gonna take an extra 2 minutes. can't remember off hand which belt comes off first, but here is what you do to get both off
power steering
1. there's no tensioner on the p/s, so you loosen the pulley (6mm iirc), to get the slack.
2. remove p/s belt
alternator
1. loosen tension on the alternator, push down, remove belt
you should be glad talk is cheap, because it doesn't cost you anything......
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A/C ? Who needs that? ;D
On my 1.6 Gasser I changed the alternator belt in 5 mins on my drive - it was the first time I'd ever changed it. Easy to do once you've actually done it. Check your Bentley manual for instructions :P
Loosen the lock nut, undo the bolt/nut on the rack until the alternator belt is loose enough to take off, slip new belt on, tighten up rack bolt, tighten up lock nut. Check once a week if you do average milage (20miles a day) and adjust to suit, should have I think 5mm play/flex iirc. That was on the 1.6 gasser, shouldn't be too different on a 1.6TD NON serp set-up.
easy peasy ;)
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ON your car, the only tools you'll need to swap them out are as follows:
-Gearwrench 17mm stubby (to loosen tensioner)
-Gearwrench 13 mm normal (to loosen P/S locknut and AC bracket nuts)
-13mm socket with 3inch extension (to loosen P/S/ bolts to bracket)
-Ratchet
-6inch 3/8 drive extension (to loosen tension off AC compressor)
-8mm allen (to loosen AC bolts to bracket)
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actually, removing those belts are the first thing ANYONE does to work on a motor, emergency or not; so don't get so butt hurt
alright, get ready to get wow'ed by this. so you have a/c and power steering, its gonna take an extra 2 minutes. can't remember off hand which belt comes off first, but here is what you do to get both off
power steering
1. there's no tensioner on the p/s, so you loosen the pulley (6mm iirc), to get the slack.
2. remove p/s belt
alternator
1. loosen tension on the alternator, push down, remove belt
you should be glad talk is cheap, because it doesn't cost you anything......
It is clear from your post you have not replaced an alternator belt on a car with power steering and AC (or you forgot). There is a tensioner on the power steering pump. How can there not be? The power steering pump belt has to come off first. Then the water pump/ AC belt where tensioner is on the AC compressor, then the alternator belt, which is driven off the AC compressor pulley.
Please state whether you HAVE or HAVE NOT actuallly done an alternator bely in an emergency on a car with power steering and AC. If you have:
1. Did you jack the car up?
2. Did you remove the wheel for better access?
3. Did you have a jack stand and the jack holding up the car if you did remove the wheel?
4. Did you crawl under the car without a jack stand?
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BUY A BENTELY....its all in there. I have replaced those two belts, as well as swapped the entire motor from one generation car to another. i am more than able to change a belt, which is prolly the easiest thing to do on any car. good luck
I don't argue on the netz, I have a bentley, so take a peek in there......
call AAA, you shouldn't be working on any car
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Hello, I did not read the above stuff because it looks like there is an argument going on.
I have driven these stinking slow cars since 1981.
I have learned to always carry a spare alternator in each of the cars I own either behind the passenger side seat or in the trunk (in a Jetta). I also carry two metal ammo cans wth a full complement of "our" numerically uneven (13 mm, 15 mm, 17 mm, etc) wrenches and sockets along with screw drivers wire cutters and some spare wire. I always have at least one spare belt of each type specific to the car within the car. I also carry at least one good voltage regulator with new, long brushes on it along with fuses some screws, vise grips, jumper cables, and a 12 volt tire pump. I carry one complete alternator idler pulley (Mk. II with air conditioner) and its corresponding hardware. Oh, I almost forgot a new pump shut off solenoid and curved 15/16 Snap on wrench for it.
I carry two original VW jacks which are in good shape....because they are amazingly light and they do work in a pinch.
I always have two Sears rechargeable LED trouble lights which are really usable for everything from emergency car repairs to avoiding rattlesnake bites at night......got one yesterday....the SNAKE, NOT the bite.
Why do I go to all this much hassle??? Because I live out here in the sticklers and drive in all types of weather in very high mileage cars.
Over the years, I have had to use ALL of this stuff. The worst was an air conditioned Mk. I alternator in the middle of the night in the middle of winter in this hell-hole they call Wyoming!!!!!
What was your question again......?
EDIT: A water pump? Ah, NO, I do not carry one of those.....but, I do reach in a give it the wiggle test all the time
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BUY A BENTELY....its all in there. I have replaced those two belts, as well as swapped the entire motor from one generation car to another. i am more than able to change a belt, which is prolly the easiest thing to do on any car. good luck
I don't argue on the netz, I have a bentley, so take a peek in there......
call AAA, you shouldn't be working on any car
I am not tryiing to argue with you . I have a Bently, but the Bently is lacking in many important details, that's why we have these forums ha? I am not disputing your capabilities either. I just finished doing the timing belt and had to remove and replace the V belts in the process. It was not an easy job even with the wheel off on jack stand. Everything was oily and gunky- not at all appealing working under the car. Getting the belts on and off was tight. The belts didn't want to come off or back on without persuasion. Access to the AC and alternator belt tensioner was tight. I just can't imagine it would be an easy job in an emergency. That's why I asked those you you who have actually done the job IN AN EMERGENCY to give your input so that I can learn from your experience. No disrespect was intended.
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Hello, I did not read the above stuff because it looks like there is an argument going on.
I have driven these stinking slow cars since 1981.
I have learned to always carry a spare alternator in each of the cars I own either behind the passenger side seat or in the trunk (in a Jetta). I also carry two metal ammo cans wth a full complement of "our" numerically uneven (13 mm, 15 mm, 17 mm, etc) wrenches and sockets along with screw drivers wire cutters and some spare wire. I always have at least one spare belt of each type specific to the car within the car. I also carry at least one good voltage regulator with new, long brushes on it along with fuses some screws, vise grips, jumper cables, and a 12 volt tire pump. I carry one complete alternator idler pulley (Mk. II with air conditioner) and its corresponding hardware. Oh, I almost forgot a new pump shut off solenoid and curved 15/16 Snap on wrench for it.
I carry two original VW jacks which are in good shape....because they are amazingly light and they do work in a pinch.
I always have two Sears rechargeable LED trouble lights which are really usable for everything from emergency car repairs to avoiding rattlesnake bites at night......got one yesterday....the SNAKE, NOT the bite.
Why do I go to all this much hassle??? Because I live out here in the sticklers and drive in all types of weather in very high mileage cars.
Over the years, I have had to use ALL of this stuff. The worst was an air conditioned Mk. I alternator in the middle of the night in the middle of winter in this hell-hole they call Wyoming!!!!!
What was your question again......?
EDIT: A water pump? Ah, NO, I do not carry one of those.....but, I do reach in a give it the wiggle test all the time
Thanks for your input. You sound totally prepared- Kudos! Do you have a picture of the orig VW jacks? Why 2 of them? I don't trust the jack that came with my 92 Jetta.
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Ok this will sound strange but I have used one of my wifes nylons in a pinch to get home. ;DJust stretch It around the pulleys and tie a knot. No tools and takes about one min. works great and will keep the lights on and the car from over heating.
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Ok this will sound strange but I have used one of my wifes nylons in a pinch to get home. ;DJust stretch It around the pulleys and tie a knot. No tools and takes about one min. works great and will keep the lights on and the car from over heating.
hahahaha, that's pretty funny :D
I carry a spare water pump/alt belt, never had to change one by the side of the road.....good thing 'cause I don't usually have my tools with me except on longer trips.
I've wondered about using baling twine before, duct tape is good to have along too.
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Ok this will sound strange but I have used one of my wifes nylons in a pinch to get home. ;DJust stretch It around the pulleys and tie a knot. No tools and takes about one min. works great and will keep the lights on and the car from over heating.
:) that is fantastic. Just to clarify . . . do you use just one leg section? i am assuming you cut off the panty section .. . or do you leave the panty section? Wouldn't it be flapping about? Maybe I'm overthinking this, but if I'm going to ask my wife to contribute this particular garment "to fix the car" it better work.
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To the OP
When I first got my Jetta I had many leaks and squeeky belts that I set out to fix. I also removed as many of the A/C componets that I could to free up the engine compartment/loss excess weight. In the process I removed and installed the alt a few times to get proficient at it.
There is not emergency belt replacement further than using panty hose or duct tape. If the belt breaks and your're in the middle of nowhere, you had better be proficient at changing that belt or wear pantiey hose. The belt comes on and goes off the exact same way as you did it during the timing belt change. This ain't no Chevy or Dodge with an alt that you you just pull on to tighten. Some wise-ass German engineer designed the worse possible way to route and tighten/loosen that alt belt.
1st disconect the neg batt lead
2nd remove the top bolt on the alt to alt bracket
3rd loosen the bottom alt support bolt below the IP
4th loosen the nut on the idler pulley
5th loosen the idler adjustment bolt
6th find something to bang like hell on the idler nut in the forward direction to get the f'ing pulley to move fowards enough to get the new belt on
7th tighen belt and all associated hardware.
Let me know if you need me to walk you through an oil change ;D
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Flapjack
Use the nee-hi not pantyhose. Don't let any of your buddys see that in you tool box. hahahaha.
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Some wise-ass German engineer designed the worse possible way to route and tighten/loosen that alt belt.
1st disconect the neg batt lead
2nd remove the top bolt on the alt to alt bracket
3rd loosen the bottom alt support bolt below the IP
4th loosen the nut on the idler pulley
5th loosen the idler adjustment bolt
6th find something to bang like hell on the idler nut in the forward direction to get the f'ing pulley to move fowards enough to get the new belt on
7th tighen belt and all associated hardware.
Let me know if you need me to walk you through an oil change ;D
The steps above is the easy part and can be done from above. What has been omitted is the power steering belt and the water pump/AC belt, which has to come out first before the alternator belt can go on, and which can only be done from below the car by loosening the pwr steering tensioner and the pulley. Then the water pump /AC belt has to come off next, which means loosening the tensioner on the AC compressor and fighting to get the belt off. I just can't imagine removing and replacing those three belts in an emergency on the side of the road unless I have practiced it and kept all the tools used in the practice in the car.
If anyone has done those belts on the side of the road, I'd love to hear from you and any special tips or tricks you may have to make the job easier.
If the alternator belt breaks, I don't think I would attempt a side of the road repair. I'd just pull the broken belt off and drive it home if possible. The only battery power necessary to drive the car is power to the IP fuel shutoff solenoid. I estimate you can drive for at least 8 hours if you do not use other electrical accessories and keep that solenoid open. It'd be great if an emergency belt is available that is open ended where you can thread it onto the pulleys, connect the ends and tighten, without having to remove belts that are in the way. Have you seen a belt like that?
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Hello, I did not read the above stuff because it looks like there is an argument going on.
I have driven these stinking slow cars since 1981.
I have learned to always carry a spare alternator in each of the cars I own either behind the passenger side seat or in the trunk (in a Jetta). I also carry two metal ammo cans wth a full complement of "our" numerically uneven (13 mm, 15 mm, 17 mm, etc) wrenches and sockets along with screw drivers wire cutters and some spare wire. I always have at least one spare belt of each type specific to the car within the car. I also carry at least one good voltage regulator with new, long brushes on it along with fuses some screws, vise grips, jumper cables, and a 12 volt tire pump. I carry one complete alternator idler pulley (Mk. II with air conditioner) and its corresponding hardware. Oh, I almost forgot a new pump shut off solenoid and curved 15/16 Snap on wrench for it.
I carry two original VW jacks which are in good shape....because they are amazingly light and they do work in a pinch.
I always have two Sears rechargeable LED trouble lights which are really usable for everything from emergency car repairs to avoiding rattlesnake bites at night......got one yesterday....the SNAKE, NOT the bite.
Why do I go to all this much hassle??? Because I live out here in the sticklers and drive in all types of weather in very high mileage cars.
Over the years, I have had to use ALL of this stuff. The worst was an air conditioned Mk. I alternator in the middle of the night in the middle of winter in this hell-hole they call Wyoming!!!!!
What was your question again......?
EDIT: A water pump? Ah, NO, I do not carry one of those.....but, I do reach in a give it the wiggle test all the time
Looks like I met a long lost relative! I drive an hour back and forth to work every day and there's not much in between my house and work. I like being prepared for emergencies. Here's what I carry:
Tools:
-carry box full of wrenches, screwdrivers, pliers, hammer, prybars, etc
-complete socket set with 1/4", 3/8, and 1/2 drive
-cordless drill
-jumper cables
-2 funnels
-12V air pump
-lug wrench of course
-Bentley (most important)
Parts:
-starter
-vee and serpentine belts
-most coolant hoses
-oil pressure switches
-spare glow plug
-coolant
-engine oil
-brake fluid
-headlight bulbs
You never know.
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my alternator shat on me whilst on the move - bad regulator - and it was night - time, I creeped the car home by removing the IP solenoid plunger with a spanner my mate bent with a torch and a vise - nutjob he was - but it took off the IP solenoid..
speaking of changing belts - I have had to change belts on a mates Golf with A/C on the side of the road - took about 45 minutes, good thing that we always keeped the engine sparkly clean..
tools were
combi spanners (10mm, 13mm, 17mm and 15mm)
allen socket - 8mm and 6mm
screwdriver = big ass one
both belts in
I have this plastic moulded briefcase of tools (german proxxon) that my mate gave me for a birthday - simple to stow not rattly and has everything you need in an emergency - combi spanners from 6mm to 19
sockets 8, 10, 12, 13,14, 15, 16, 17, 19, 21, 22 and 24
ratchet
wobbly
extensions
breaker tommy bar
pliers
wp pliers
hammer
wiring tester,
screwdrivers
allen keys 5,6,8 and 10mm
I sometimes keep it in the car along with a set of 500amp jumper cables I fabricated,
havent needed the tools much on the run but have helped other motorists many times.. :)
parts i keep for car
1 40 amp bosch relay (too many relays in my car)
fuses
H/L bulb
drivebelts
little roll of this rubber that can patch rad hoses (works well for about 2 hours) I dont know that the hell it is (a crane mechanic gave it to me and its awesome)
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If you've already done the job in your driveway then you know whats going to be needed and done in order to replicate it on the side of the road. The only difference is it will be changed at a time of least convenience for you :)
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The steps above is the easy part and can be done from above. What has been omitted is the power steering belt and the water pump/AC belt, which has to come out first before the alternator belt can go on, and which can only be done from below the car by loosening the pwr steering tensioner and the pulley. Then the water pump /AC belt has to come off next, which means loosening the tensioner on the AC compressor and fighting to get the belt off. I just can't imagine removing and replacing those three belts in an emergency on the side of the road unless I have practiced it and kept all the tools used in the practice in the car.
Dude, to change the alt belt you remove the alt and then loosen the A/C compressor mounting bolts and then loosen the A/C comp adjuster. Once the adjuster is loose you just push down on the comp and the A/C, H2O, PS belt comes off and you install the inner/alt belt and reinstall/tighten. If the PS belt breaks, just drive home without PS and fix it when you get home. You don't need to loosen the PS belt to change the ALT belt.