VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: Powered by Spearco on January 26, 2009, 09:17:02 pm
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I took some pics of my frankinstien engine build. Not done yet but gettin there.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031957.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031955.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031989.jpg)
ARP studs, main bolts and rod bolts. Man I hope this is the way some of you have seald up the gasket to block part.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031842.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031845.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031847.jpg)
I bought this AAZ head new and did some porting. Mostly cleaned up the castings and matched ported to the gaskets. Also peened around the precups. You can see how I capped off the extra oil return hole.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233031953.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/1233032031.jpg)
The next thing to do is drill and tap the head for the valve cover.
What do you think.
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Very nicely done! Where did you score that valve cover?
Edit: Which valve cover will you be using with the 1.9 head. That's a regular old 8v cover. :?
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Its not mine, its my bro's. He had it laying around the shop.
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That engine is never gonna work.... Dump some dirty old oil all over it, then it will be fine :lol:
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That engine is never gonna work.... Dump some dirty old oil all over it, then it will be fine :lol:
hear hear!
I have a new head too but my block is grimy as frick. Thats a nice green you have there.
Sweet Sauce man.
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hmmm did you put the mechanical lifters into that head? i don't see how it can work properly with hydraulic lifters.
looking nice though!
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hmmm did you put the mechanical lifters into that head? i don't see how it can work properly with hydraulic lifters.
looking nice though!
It will work mostly fine with hydraulic(BTW thats the proper way to spell that) lifters but its going to make a hell of a mess when coolant and oil is leaking from that hole.
I have 2 Mechanical lifter engines and one Hydro. Im not even going to try to put a multilayer head gasket on the Mech engines. I might buy the super expensive one the 53 willys used.
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Here's my 1.9 head on a 1.6 mechanical block project:
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=15780.0 (http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=15780.0)
Topics include: porting, converting to mechanical, reaming guides, valve options, using a non-1.9 valve cover, metal head gasket, etc
(http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z236/dieselkraftstoff/SSPX0358.jpg)
I pulled the head again so I can remove some aluminum ridges at the base of the cam towers so I don't have to pull the cam to change the valve lash shims.
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hmmm did you put the mechanical lifters into that head? i don't see how it can work properly with hydraulic lifters.
looking nice though!
It will work mostly fine with hydraulic(BTW thats the proper way to spell that) lifters but its going to make a hell of a mess when coolant and oil is leaking from that hole.
I have 2 Mechanical lifter engines and one Hydro. Im not even going to try to put a multilayer head gasket on the Mech engines. I might buy the super expensive one the 53 willys used.
i thought that the hydraulic engines required the extra drain hole... mech engines have way more oil pressure at the head because they don't need it... i would assume that the extra oil would pool in the head and drain slower? or am i missing something?
you can buy the mechanical lifters to convert a 1.9 head into mech though...
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One question about the extra oil and higher oil presure. I've done alot of reading and I thought that when you upgrade your oil pump to the 36mm one you get better oil presure. Well isn't that pump for the hydro engines, and we're putting that on our mech. engines? More oil presure but one drain.
I'm just blocking the extra drain due to the block doesn't have the drain hole.
The rubber plug on the block at the coolant passage is to keep eveything from cross contaminating. Like what Audi80/ MJF did.
I have never done anything like this before, but have read alot about what others have done, and from what they have said, it works, regaurding the MLS headgasket to mechanical blocks.
Did I missread something when the upgrade and conversion was done?
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There are two other oil drains at the outermost head bolts on the manifold side of the head.
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Yeah there sure is.
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It will be just fine.
I did it long ago and works just fine.
I'll be in PDX in June on vaca. I'll drop ya a line before I take off, maybe I can stop in and say hi..
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Sounds great.
Thanks for the replies.
:)
Josh
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There's no need for the extra oil drain. In the vanagon the engine is tipped to 50° and works fine with hyd lifters. I guarantee that no oil drains down either of the front drains. In order to do so, the valve area would be completely submerged. :shock:
Andrew
sounds good then :)
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I smoke tested and presure tested the cooling system passages at 20 psi. today and no leaks to speak of. 8) .
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It will be just fine.
I did it long ago and works just fine.
I'll be in PDX in June on vaca. I'll drop ya a line before I take off, maybe I can stop in and say hi..
hey, if im still around when you come to portland.. i want to see your car. i drool from looking at it.
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It will be just fine.
I did it long ago and works just fine.
I'll be in PDX in June on vaca. I'll drop ya a line before I take off, maybe I can stop in and say hi..
hey, if im still around when you come to portland.. i want to see your car. i drool from looking at it.
I'll be in a 2002 Passat for that run. Going to have the whole fam damly with me, need comfort!!!
Still planning on coming up in June though.
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what timing, I was just going to post about using a 1.6hyd cyl head with my 1.6TD mech block..
So it has and can be done?
Was it just the extra oil line that was plugged? what material did you use to plug it? is it reversible?
whats with the other small rubber looking piece wedged in the HG? the picture I see doesnt look sealed. I dont imagine its just there to keep things in place since youre using studs...
would the 1.9 crush HG still be compatible?
nice clean work by the way, thanks!
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An aluminum pipe plug works:
(http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z236/dieselkraftstoff/SSPX0274.jpg)
More at:
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=15780.0
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I welded mine and plugged the hole in the block as well then placed a piece of rubber over the void in the gasket.
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w168/zukgod1/MK2%20Project/IMG_0495.jpg)
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w168/zukgod1/MK2%20Project/IMG_0494.jpg)
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w168/zukgod1/MK2%20Project/IMG00050-1.jpg)
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looking over those first pics reminds me to fit a different valve cover,mmmm..
nice job zuk, i was kind of hoping for something less than permanent for myself.
theres no pressure at that hole, so it really just needs to be sealed and I'd prefer it at the top so oil doesnt pool for weeks, months, years then finally let out a potentially hazardous chunk..
thats it though right? all the other passages are identical and compatibility with the 1.9 HG is non issue?
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Ya, aside from the oil drain and the coolant passage everything else matches up.
You may want to consider drilling the extra steam passages that the AAZ head gasket provides. You don't have to but better cooling is always good.
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dealaing with the oil passage now,
can you give details on the coolant passage? I saw it mentioned in some threads i was reading but nothing specific. was it the head or block or gasket needing to be addressed?
..& ive always thought it curious that so many VAG HG's are prted the way they are.
thanks
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Well, today was the day it came together.
Got the rest of the exhaust made up from the down pipe. Except its now
2 1/4 tubing. Turned out nice I think.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0743.jpg)
Here it is on the truck.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0747.jpg)
First start up was really smoky. Really smoky. Pump timming is at .98
and the pump came off of the other motor on the truck. I think that the pump is due for a rebuild soon. Oh I forgot to say that there is a set of SMOG GTD nozzles in and set to 155 bar. Here look at this.
http://[URL=http://s232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/?action=view¤t=CLIP0744.flv][img]http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/th_CLIP0744.jpg[/img][/url]
I did turn down the fuel screw a 1/2 turn and seemed to help but was at running temp. So will have to wait to see if it needs any other tweeking.
Yah the bolck heater didn't help either on first start.
Heres another vid after the pump was readjusted.
http://[URL=http://s232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/?action=view¤t=CLIP0749.flv][img]http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/th_CLIP0749.jpg[/img][/url]
Also when taking it for a test drive, I knoticed the turbo was quite louder and has that sound others were talking about. Sound tough I think.
I wasn't really throttling it very hard, but got to 6 maybe 8 PSI and about 800 to 1000 EGT's. The smoke seems to deminish at above 3K RPM. Maybe I should add a lift pump. That might help with the smoke at idle?
http://[URL=http://s232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/?action=view¤t=CLIP0750.flv][img]http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/th_CLIP0750.jpg[/img][/url]
http://[URL=http://s232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/?action=view¤t=CLIP0751.flv][img]http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/th_CLIP0751.jpg[/img][/url]
Please any thoughts or ideas.
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How old is your fuel? My jetta is smoking white like that right now and the fuel is probably over a year old. When I was initially running the motor off a jerry can it did not smoke.
With the lack of the extra oil passage it might be a good idea to add the extra CCV system that the AAZs have. I'm thinking that with high boost pressures you might get some significant blowby
How old are the injectors? I've noticed a couple times that new injectors clack more then old ones.
That's a sexy truck by the way.
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The fuel is less than a month old and the injetors are basicly brand new. I know that theres alot of unburnt fuel being thrown out. Thats where all the smoke is coming from. No cross contamination in oil or coolant so far.
Man those Air Craft Spruce thermo couple really reacts fast. I like it.
I'm wondering if I should advance the pump timming to 1.05 and see if it helps with the smoking.
As for the CCV, You can see that I have it routed right out under the engine for now :oops: :lol: .
Some little tidying up to do. Like fixing the leaky turbo oil return line where it flex's, getting the valve cover leak at the cap. Replacement is on the way.
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Oh yes, there it is. It blended in with the block too well :lol:
I seem to recall someone (maybe Dave) saying he needed to advance the pump to around 1.35mm but I could be completely wrong on that one.
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Hopefully someone will chime in and give some addvice (Andrew) :) , about addvancing the pump
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Advance your timing sir!
8)
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How much?
I know that the CR has been lowered because the cylinder head and a three notch head gasket.
The timming is @ .98. Double and triple checked that. When it finally started, I pulled out the advance lever and seemed to rattle a bit more?
Any Ideas? Is it the three notch or a combo of the HG and the head thats on there?
Help :oops:
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It's going to be hard to start regardless of the timing I fear.
I would try 1.05 for starters and go from there. I think it's going to be a bit pingy at idle but it should start.
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As far as the gasket size that was measured, I'd have to dig through my notes.
No air leaks to speak of. You can see that in the video I did.
I started it up this morning w/ lever pull out, no block heater, and fired right up but after 5 secs. it sputtered out and died. Smoke seemed less white and more grayish to black.
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If it's firing right up then dieing I don't think it's a timing issue.
Sounds like an air leak, pump issue.
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I kind of think it might be the pump, but once its warmed up it idles fine.
It does still smoke when warm but not as much. When throttled up, it stumbles and sputters but does rev. Just slow to react.
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Def. no air from filter to pump. I never removed the inlet line to the pump when I pulled it. Just at the filter. Bled the fuel system w/ vaccum untill no air was present. I just don't see how air could be the proplem here with this issue.
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You may want to try a set of good known stock injectors just to see.
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I reset the timming to 1.05 and it starts and runs much better. No more stumbling and sputtering, only when light throttle is applied. Then it really smokes. When fully warmed up no problems at all.
I haven't found my notes as far as what the piston protrusion measured, but I do remember that it needed a three notch.
Is it likly that all the smoke is due to that the rings have yet to seat and that would cause the heavy smoking until it warmed up. Everything swelling up and making less blow-by and more compresion?
I do have a super pump that Giles built for me that I could swap out to verify that the pump is infact at fault. It was made for the dragster though. I'll have to contact him to see if it would work for this setup.
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I've talked to one of the guys at the local diesel sevice shops and I told him about the running condition of my truck. He said that he's seen some pumps that the front main shaft seal would alow air to get past the seal and smoke like the dickins until warmed up.
Any thoughts or comments about this.
Also talked to Giles and he had recommended advancing the timming when cold until smoking is less.
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Update:
The main shaft seal was leaking/ sucking air into the pump. Fixed that, but had another TD pump rebuilt for another project.
Installed the new/ rebuilt pump on truck and set timming to 1.0mm
bled all air from lines and fired it up. Still smokes :evil: . No fire on #3 cylinder. Swaped #3 injector w/ #4 injector, but did a compression, and leak down tests. 425 psi and 0% leakage on #3 cylinder. Fasted up the injectors and lines. Bled air again and fired it up.
Still no fire on #3, even with the line cracked at 2K RPM. No fire :evil: :roll: . Swaped pumps thinking it was the pump and still no fire on #3. WTF!. Pulled the valve cover and found that some of the lifters were flat. #3 intake and #1 exhaust. Swaped out all lifters w/ new INA brand OEM one's. Bled down the new lifters 1/4 turn at a time to make sure no valves would hit. Hooked up oil psi gauge at head fired it up and still no fire on #3 cylinder! Oil psi is at 40 @ idle and 80 @ 2K RPM. All lifters are pumped up now but no fire. The hole time messing with it the block heater was plugged in and nice and warm to the touch.
How can it be that after all that it still won't fire?
Now that its cold from siting over night, I'll do a compression test to all cylinders. Then next ? Maybe pull the head and see if theres something wrong.
Any ideas as to whats wrong?
Thanks, Josh
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Pulled the cam out to check for flat lifters and busted valve springs, None. Compression is good. WTF. Could it be a cracked precup?
Anyone? Anything?
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Yes, glow plug is glowing good and hot. Yes, no change in RPM when injector line is cracked loose at idle or raised. Pulled out the injector to see if by chance if I could see a cracked precup, no luck so far.
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I pulled the head. Nothing to speak of for the problem, other than piston to cylinder clearance is very sloppy. No signs of cracked pistons or precup's. :? WTF! I'm going to pull the hole engine and send it back to the machineist and let him check it out. If you'ld ask me, it looks like to much piston slop on all cylinders. Mainly #3 cylinder.
I'll post some pics later. That is if anyone is interested in this :?
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Cant you flip the lines so they stick up in the air, attach the injectors and try it? I know it will make a god awful mess, but you will know for certain if you are getting fuel to #3. Just a late night idea.
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Andrew, I did change to a good pump, and still the same condition. Changed injectors and lines, checked compression, leak tested, and changed to known good new lifters. A good visual at the springs, saw nothing unusual. I've got alot of money into this engine to not just pull the head and see if theres something, maybe by slight chance.
Well, I did and saw nothing right away.
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0785.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0784.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0786.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0787.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0788.jpg)
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/PICT0789.jpg)
I did see that there is alot of piston to cylinder clearance. I can shake the tops of the pistons with my gingers and does make noise. On all of them.
Looks like hole #2 is starting to make some contact with skirts and tops.
The head is beautiful as far as I can see.
I have to admit I screw up when origanaly measuring piston protrusion it was a three notch. Its supposed to be a one notch.
#1 .65mm
#2 .51mm
#3 .58mm
#4 .56mm
Is it possable for #3 to not fire due to PP and the sloppy pistons.
Not to mention, the 1.9 head.
I remember having a Rabbit or two that had three notch, when it should of had a one. ?
I'm going to pull the piston assemblies and measure them and check clearance's.
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Update:
Machine shop had it for almost two weeks and did'nt have time to look. So I took it back. Checked it out my self and found nothing out of the ordinary. Decided to reassemble it with a one notch gasket I got from the Dealer. 50 bucks, not bad.
I set the pump timing to 1.02, primed and bled fuel system.
Fill cooling system and bled.
Fired it up and runs. Smokes and sputters for 2min. and clears right up.
Runs the best it ran so far.
I leave the block heater pluged in over the night and on the first crank, it fires up.
So far I've put 100 miles on it.
So far so good.
http://[URL=http://s232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/?action=view¤t=CLIP0899.flv][img]http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee10/joshmarstall/th_CLIP0899.jpg[/img][/url]
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is there a delay in the sound from the video? or does your truck really have that much of a delay when you rev it up? did you do the governor mod yet?