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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: greatpenguin on December 22, 2008, 09:10:37 am
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Oh, im sure this has been discussed tons here, but i cant seem to find anything on the subject. Im sitting on a T3 and a K24 turbo for my rebuild, But i have to sell one to get some money back. From what I can see the K24 seems to have better flow potential, but looks a tad smaller. The T3 looks a tad bigger, and better made, but looks like its restrictive which may remove any advantages. Im looked to squeeze out every last drop of power. Any help on the subject would be appreciated.
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if you want ALL the power you can get sale the t3 and get a K26 and make a K24/K26 hybrid..... :lol: 8)
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exhaust of the 24 intake of the k26? There is a used k26 on ebay for $86, This could be a doable idea.
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The 26 cold side bolts right up to the 24 center section.
Both 53 willys and i are running one as are a few other members.
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how much more power does this give? The only thing I am not sure of is since the 24 has the built on wastegate and the k26 does not, there is some plumbing to take in account for (I dont have my turbo's on me currently). Is that not an issue?
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Sell the T3 in any case. The impeller diameters are exactly the same on the T3 and the KKK24, while the KKK is overall a much better turbo. It's more efficient (slightly) and still has better spool-up. A hybrid KKK would be nice if you can't get your hands on a suitable Holset or Schwitzer.
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how much more power does this give? The only thing I am not sure of is since the 24 has the built on wastegate and the k26 does not, there is some plumbing to take in account for (I dont have my turbo's on me currently). Is that not an issue?
The wastegate is not a problem, just use the KKK 24 turbine with the original W/G . As for power, it will greatly depend on what kind of KKK26 cold side you use (there are dozens of different sizes and specs), but a stock KKK24 has been proven to make over 160 hp in ideal conditions. So it's gonna be able to do better than that!
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This is the one on ebay (if someone else nabs it i will be sad). This sounds like the way to go then. I was just worried about the hose from the cold side that runs to the wastegate, as this one does not have that. I suppose its nothing that a turbo shop couldn't do for me anyways. If I was to get a rebuild kit... Would I have to grab both then? The add says this is off of a porche 944
(http://i18.ebayimg.com/07/i/001/22/33/d615_12.JPG)
(http://i20.ebayimg.com/07/i/001/22/33/c466_12.JPG)
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This is the one on ebay (if someone else nabs it i will be sad). This sounds like the way to go then. I was just worried about the hose from the cold side that runs to the wastegate, as this one does not have that. I suppose its nothing that a turbo shop couldn't do for me anyways. If I was to get a rebuild kit... Would I have to grab both then? The add says this is off of a porche 944
(http://i18.ebayimg.com/07/i/001/22/33/d615_12.JPG)
(http://i20.ebayimg.com/07/i/001/22/33/c466_12.JPG)
No, you would only need the KKK24 service kit, unless you were to use a KKK26 center section.
A KKK26 out of a 944 supports about 270 hp on a gas engine, so that should mean something in the region of 200 hp on a diesel engine.
Maybe the hybrid would have a max output of around 180 hp? You never know until you've tried it, but maybe it'll be in that ballbark.
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I got my k26 at a local junkyard for $60..then I paid $100 for a rebuild kit...then I paid $80 to have the k24 housing machined to fit the K26 exhaust wheel...
i'm pretty happy with it...although I dont have much time on it yet..
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I got my k26 at a local junkyard for $60..then I paid $100 for a rebuild kit...then I paid $80 to have the k24 housing machined to fit the K26 exhaust wheel...
i'm pretty happy with it...although I dont have much time on it yet..
So, in order to match them up, it does require machining of the k24 housing? I dont know of a local place i trust that does that.
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No. That's only if you want to use a KKK26 hot side.
If you use a 24 hot and center section, you'll have your hybrid by just bolting on a KKK26 cold side.
The 26 that you mentioned, BTW, would suit this quite well as it's not the bigger '89-'91 944 Turbo's, but the earlier, smaller one (!)
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Well, I bought the K26. Guess that answers my first question, and cost me more money :)
Now I need to sell my spare TD kit.
Thanks for the quick input guys!
I should just move my build thread over here, i'll get alot more imput from you guys.
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Sounds like you'll have a very nice turbo set-up on your hands!
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Sell the T3 in any case. The impeller diameters are exactly the same on the T3 and the KKK24, while the KKK is overall a much better turbo. It's more efficient (slightly) and still has better spool-up. A hybrid KKK would be nice if you can't get your hands on a suitable Holset or Schwitzer.
where do you get your information?I feel the t3 is way more robust.
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I've had both the T3 and the K series turbo apart.
Internally there wasn't much different aside from the compressor wheel.
The fins were fewer in quantity and not as aggressive on the T3. This may attribute to the "more Robust" comment as it's just not going to have the same amount of stress on the shaft and bearing as the K series turbos.
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I love my T3 yet i have little expirence with the K24. Have driven a K14 and the off idle response is nuts. And that 14 has over 200,000 miles onm it.
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See, thar ya go.
To me, the right answer to the question is "neither".
K14 + hot pump = upwards of 30 psi whenever you want, and it's starting to boost at 1500 RPM.
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Sell the T3 in any case. The impeller diameters are exactly the same on the T3 and the KKK24, while the KKK is overall a much better turbo. It's more efficient (slightly) and still has better spool-up. A hybrid KKK would be nice if you can't get your hands on a suitable Holset or Schwitzer.
where do you get your information?I feel the t3 is way more robust.
About durability, I really don't know - from what I have heard, both turbos are very durable as there are very rarely any problems unless totally over-stressed. So about 'robust' I don't know if there's any difference.
Where I get my information? Well, I have personal experience on both turbos, and as for the Garrett, on several different applications too.
The KKK is able to make more power and still has better spool-up. The biggest difference in spool-up characteristics is that the Garrett's boost curve grows very slowly above 1 bar (14 psi) while the KKK gives instant response at max boost. Furthermore, the KKK24 is a newer design than the Garrett, which accounts for the better performance, I guess.
See, thar ya go.
To me, the right answer to the question is "neither".
K14 + hot pump = upwards of 30 psi whenever you want, and it's starting to boost at 1500 RPM.
A good point. The K14 is again a very modern design compared to either the T3 or KKK24, but it does lack the ultimate top-end power because of the smaller impellers. For a moderately tuned street TD, I think the K14 is just about ideal. But it won't give you 160 hp which the K24 can...
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I have a k24/k26 That I built up and never used.I also had the k24 turbine housing machined out the fit the k26 turbine wheel.This is much better than using the k24 turbine wheel and will produce better drive to boost numbers as its driving a bigger compressor wheel.I used a k26 off an Audi gasser?? and used the k24 center housing as the audi's was the water cooled one which have potential issues from what I hear.I think the Audi k26 had a 40-42mm inducer.
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I used a k26 off an Audi gasser?? and used the k24 center housing as the audi's was the water cooled one which have potential issues from what I hear.I think the Audi k26 had a 40-42mm inducer.
Huh, what 'issues' did you hear about the water cooled bearing housing on the Audi K26s?
I have a '86 Audi TQW with said water cooled K26 with over 200K miles on it, and I've bumped the boost up to 1.8 bar last year and it goes like a scalded cat.
I've got an extra K26 that I'm going to do the k24/k26 hybrid thing for my '79 1.6TD and I was thinking obout using the water cooled center section because cooler is better when it comes to turbo bushing life.
If the shaft diameter is the same for both turbos, I suspect the bushings and thrust bearings are the same too. I don't see how adding a water jacket to the center housing could do anything but good to the life of the turbo.
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I heard that the k26 center housings can have issues,possibly with cracking and letting coolant/oil mix??This is only somting I heard though!
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I have a k26 thats oil cooled only.i thought it was from and audi 5000.
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Hey everyone. I'm thinking about putting together a k24/26 turbo. I'm not
sure I fully understand the motivation behind the different variations of this setup.
In what instances would it be preferable to use both the hot and cold sides of the k26 as opposed to keeping the k24 hot side? I was under the impression using the smaller hot side of the k24 would help spool up times and was one of the benefits over just rigging up a k26.
Also, do any issues arise from using both turbines from the k26 in regard to it being a turbo for a gasoline engine as opposed to a diesel? I thought gas and diesel turbos were designed differently so this might be another reason to keep the k24 hot side?
Thanks for the help!
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Sell the T3 in any case. The impeller diameters are exactly the same on the T3 and the KKK24, while the KKK is overall a much better turbo. It's more efficient (slightly) and still has better spool-up. A hybrid KKK would be nice if you can't get your hands on a suitable Holset or Schwitzer.
where do you get your information?I feel the t3 is way more robust.
X2 I've used em both on my modified AAZ and like the T3 better. BTW, does anyone know of a modern turbo that will bolt to our manifolds?
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Sell the T3 in any case. The impeller diameters are exactly the same on the T3 and the KKK24, while the KKK is overall a much better turbo. It's more efficient (slightly) and still has better spool-up. A hybrid KKK would be nice if you can't get your hands on a suitable Holset or Schwitzer.
where do you get your information?I feel the t3 is way more robust.
X2 I've used em both and like the T3 better. BTW, does anyone know of a modern turbo that will bolt to our manifolds?
Oh, interesting. I love my T3 and have built a k24/k26 hybrid recently but i'm thinking about selling it. Not sure it's worth keeping, and I do love my T3 too.