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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: monomer on November 04, 2008, 12:46:55 pm

Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 04, 2008, 12:46:55 pm: I drop my shortblock off at my local Machine shop. This is they're (and mine) first VW diesel block.

a week later, I get a call. They want to re-weld and grind the "gash" in the thrust bearing area. It's a Diesel crank, not a 350SB here - no welding for me. I find one and order it off the samba.

I dropped it off today. This is the first time I see said "gash" I note the fact that the snub on the new crank is the wrong one (from an auto...) But the Thrust areas are nearly exactly the same.

Pics:
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/Bearing3.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/Bearing1.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/Bearing.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/Snubs.jpg)

(sorry for the poor quality, didn't have my digital on me when I dropped it off - only my phone)

The "Gash" looks to be an oiling groove to me. Anyone?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: myke_w on November 04, 2008, 12:57:07 pm: Very difficult to see in those pics if you have better ones that would be ideal for figuring this out
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 04, 2008, 06:53:24 pm: the groove is roughly .030 deep, on the inside.

both cranks have the same exact groove, one cranks from an auto, ones from a manual.

the groove looks to be turned in. It shows no signs of overheating/discoloration

I'll try to get more pics tomorrow.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 08, 2008, 11:05:09 am: new pics turned out the same

macro on my camera seems to do nothing.

No-one has had one of these apart?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: burn_your_money on November 08, 2008, 12:55:18 pm: What motor is this for?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: fatmobile on November 08, 2008, 06:49:53 pm: What kind/brand of bearings were on it?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 09, 2008, 06:58:36 pm: Quote from: "fatmobile"
What kind/brand of bearings were on it?

no idea. I'd say stock.

This is a 1.6 Diesel (1983 rabbit 5 speed)

anyone have one of these apart? Recall what it looked like?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: Vincent Waldon on November 09, 2008, 07:34:05 pm: I think we're all going to draw a blank until we can see clear pictures of the damage ?
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 09, 2008, 08:11:02 pm: Quote from: "Vincent Waldon"
I think we're all going to draw a blank until we can see clear pictures of the damage ?

Well, you see the rough dimensions of said groove. it's only on the one side. No annealing or discoloration the groove is .020-.030 deep on the inside (guessed by eye)

it's there, and in the same dimensions on both cranks.

pretty straightforward. I think it's an oiling groove, but this is my first build.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: lord_verminaard on November 10, 2008, 05:52:10 am: Just had mine apart too, I'm pretty sure that groove was there, though I was in a hurry and didn't look too close. Make damn triple sure that the machine shop puts "proper" bearings back in it, a lot of cheap replacement bearings for early VW cranks are 2-piece with the thrust washer built in to the shell, those are junk. Make sure to get the 4-piece version and make sure they set up the thrust properly. If not, the crank will be trash after the first 20 times you push in the clutch. Many times you can re-use the thrust washer if neither the crank or the washer is worn.

Brendan
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 10, 2008, 03:16:36 pm: Quote from: "lord_verminaard"
Just had mine apart too, I'm pretty sure that groove was there, though I was in a hurry and didn't look too close. Make damn triple sure that the machine shop puts "proper" bearings back in it, a lot of cheap replacement bearings for early VW cranks are 2-piece with the thrust washer built in to the shell, those are junk. Make sure to get the 4-piece version and make sure they set up the thrust properly. If not, the crank will be trash after the first 20 times you push in the clutch. Many times you can re-use the thrust washer if neither the crank or the washer is worn.

Brendan

I'm getting the full glyco deal from myke.

The shop is just boring/decking/resizing. I plan on having a trusted friend assemble the shortblock.

I
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 13, 2008, 02:34:49 pm: I know someone's had the bottom end apart......

this is holding me up.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: jtanguay on November 13, 2008, 03:11:47 pm: theres pictures somewhere on this site of what the damage looks like... i just forget who's crank it was...
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 14, 2008, 01:38:42 pm: More pics:

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/00006-1.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/00005-1.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/00008-1.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/00003-1.jpg)
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/Monomer001x/Rabbit%20GTD%20Build/00002-1.jpg)
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: zukgod1 on November 14, 2008, 01:40:34 pm: I'm pretty sure that's just supose to be a flat surface. no groves at all.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 14, 2008, 01:52:10 pm: Quote from: "zukgod1"
I'm pretty sure that's just supose to be a flat surface. no groves at all.

I cant do "pretty sure"

I need a straight answer...
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: Black Smokin' Diesel on November 14, 2008, 02:18:22 pm: The spare crank I have here has no such groove. It came from a 1.6TD manual tranny.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 14, 2008, 02:36:14 pm: Quote from: "Black Smokin' Diesel"
The spare crank I have here has no such groove. It came from a 1.6TD manual tranny.

I'd take that "spare" off your hands but international shipping on a 35lb item would kill.

anyone have one laying around. HAS TO BE A MANUAL!
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: zukgod1 on November 14, 2008, 03:10:19 pm: Quote from: "monomer"
Quote from: "zukgod1"
I'm pretty sure that's just suppose to be a flat surface. no groves at all.

I cant do "pretty sure"

I need a straight answer...

Ok. It's NOT suppose to have a grove.

Flat surface.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: arb on November 25, 2008, 09:35:49 am: The flat needs to be flat. That said, how does the thrust bearing look? The grove looks uniform and there is at least 50% of your area that looks good. If you have another crank, use it. In not, and the bearing looks good except for the grove, and your money is low, use it.
Title: 1.6 Crank Trust Bearing Woes
Post by: monomer on November 25, 2008, 01:05:18 pm: Quote from: "arb"
The flat needs to be flat. That said, how does the thrust bearing look? The grove looks uniform and there is at least 50% of your area that looks good. If you have another crank, use it. In not, and the bearing looks good except for the grove, and your money is low, use it.

Bearing is MIA.

I cleaned garage....

New crank and new glyco bearing will be used. I've spared no expense thus far in the build; I'm sure as hell not going to here.