highest HP on vw idi achieved so far?

[MJF]

Yeah thats a giles 9mm pump

[R.O.R-2.0]

I think part of the recipe for high HP with an IDI is high RPMs.  I'm working towards building a 1920cc 5-cylinder with a 77.4 mm stroke and 79.5 mm pistons.  Probably one of the first over-square VW/Audi diesel engines ever.

whats the stock specs?

and if you turn it too many RPMS, your gonna have to switch your fuel pump type.. the VE pump on my car only likes about 5500 rpms..

There aren't any stock specs really, since it's a combination of about 4 engines.  Early 80's vintage Audi turbo gasser block with 79.5 mm bores and 11 mm head bolts, 77.4 mm crank from European-only 2.0 20V engine, 79.5 mm 1.9 TD-type pistons, 2.0 10V diesel head (have a NOS unit), Giles pump off my 100 Quattro, custom rods, etc.  I have a new stock pump that I will probably put back on the 100 as I'm turning it into more of a winter go-anywhere-in-the-snow car.  My Giles pump doesn't have the wax-stat timing advance hardware any longer, and that would be a nice feature in a cold weather car.

Probably the most interesting thing is the uber-short stroke.  We all know how well the 1.5 revs.  Now image that with a 77.4 mm stroke.

i notice no difference between my 1.5 and 1.6... they both rev happily.. right up to 5500. no higher..

diesel doesnt burn fast, so you cant turn too many rpms, otherwise you will be pumping the diesel thru the motor before it can burn properly..

there is a flame speed to diesel, it DOES ignite/burn SLOWER than gasoline, and you can surpass it easily on one of these little diesels..

another thing to remember, the more rollers/bumps on the cam plate, the less ability to turn RPMS..

a 4 cylinder bosch VE pump can fuel to ~5500 rpms..

a 8 cylinder bosche VE pump can do roughly half the RPMS of the 4 cylinder pump, because it has twice as many bumps on the cam plate..

so, you may want to look into fitting an inline mercedes pump to your under square 2.0L 5 banger..

i would pursue that route anyways, if i were going to build an engine as custom as what you are talking, then retro-fitting an inline injection pump should be no big deal..

only thing you gotta worry about, is that the pump is set up to turn CCW.. the engine turns CW, but the pump is driven from the back of the cam, so its gotta be a CCW rotation pump.. if you even decide to use something OTHER than the VE pump on it now..

[monomer]

Dave 935racer made 194whp with 50 trim t3/t4 and a dinky 9mm Giles pumP
Josh powered by spearco did 180whp with a 10mm pump and Mercedes 45 trim t3 he did 191 with nitrous he also had a dunk of over 270 with nitrous but I don't think he trusted it cause he has 191whp in his sig. Both these cars were 1.6 with 1.9 head

Mjf did over 200whp before with some weird 1.7 engine he built I forget what turbo was on

And aki_76 or something I believe did close to 300 with an aaz. If I wasn't on my phone I'd post links. Ive seen this brought up before but I don't remember there being a thread dedicated to it tho. If u check the FAQ there is a dyno thread

What Mercede's was that turbo from?

Most were around a "42 trim" and t-25 (t2 platform) like the one I just had rebuilt, from a 300d 2.5 (1992)

its off an 80s 300 it's a 45 trim t3 with a .48 at exhaust housing. 42 is probably the compressor housing Ar which doesn't mean much do u have any pics or part numbers I'm curious what mercedes swapped to down the road

I think the problem with Josh's turbo is first of all the older Mercedes t3s had the older bigger turbine wheel which was heavier and of an older design that didn't spool as fast or flow as well the newer turbine which almost all t3s shared from our little vw diesel even up to the buick grand national. The second thing is it has I a .48 ar turbine housing which I don't think is a good match for the 45 trim compressor wheel on a 1.6 because the housing can way out flow the compressor so u lose spool time with out making up for it in the upper rpms with big up which is why I made a vw merc turbo hybrid but I haven't used it yet

Superior turbo and injection just rebuilt this one with new wheels and centre section. Their tag: TB/02 HI/PO.

I suppose "HI/PO" is ment for the new wheels and compressor housing. Hotside is stamped .41 Ar.


I have no idea on inducer/exducer size on the hot/cold, it's much different from what I dropped off. They were also nice enough to put a pressure operated WG on it, as vac WG are on just about every benz.



When I dropped it off, this turbo had 421k Miles of abuse. The wheels were coked so bad you could hardly turn them by hand. It now looks better then new, and I can't wait to bolt it up!

[RabbitJockey]

Ok I know around 1990 a lot of manufacturers switched to the t25 stuff like saab and many switched also to t2/t3 hybrids usually called a t28 and came in different trims and what not like nissan

[Alcaid]

Any new records on this subject?

[R.O.R-2.0]

Any new records on this subject?

Josh dyno'd 288whp on a 1.6 hybrid w/ merc turbo, and nitrous..

giles pump of course..

i think the dyno was a little bit off..

i know his truck is powerful, but i dont think its almost 300hp..

he doesnt even run 100mph in the quarter..

1600#s should do better than 100mph in the quarter w/ damn near 300hp..

[Alcaid]

NOS is "cheating" in my book anyway. I've seen that dyno sheet and it looks a bit funny indeed.

How much boost are people pushing on the Frankens without failures in the long run?

[RabbitJockey]

Any new records on this subject?

Josh dyno'd 288whp on a 1.6 hybrid w/ merc turbo, and nitrous..

giles pump of course..

i think the dyno was a little bit off..

i know his truck is powerful, but i dont think its almost 300hp..

he doesnt even run 100mph in the quarter..

1600#s should do better than 100mph in the quarter w/ damn near 300hp..

He does do 100mph in the quarter which is very fast for the et he had

[mystery3]

i know his truck is powerful, but i dont think its almost 300hp..

1600#s should do better than 100mph in the quarter w/ damn near 300hp..

In a caddy? If so how does one go about getting a caddy to 1600lbs?

[MJF]

Where is his dynosheet?

[745 turbogreasel]

and if you turn it too many RPMS, your gonna have to switch your fuel pump type.. the VE pump on my car only likes about 5500 rpms..

i notice no difference between my 1.5 and 1.6... they both rev happily.. right up to 5500. no higher..

diesel doesnt burn fast, so you cant turn too many rpms, otherwise you will be pumping the diesel thru the motor before it can burn properly..


a 4 cylinder bosch VE pump can fuel to ~5500 rpms..

a 8 cylinder bosche VE pump can do roughly half the RPMS of the 4 cylinder pump, because it has twice as many bumps on the cam plate..

so, you may want to look into fitting an inline mercedes pump to your under square 2.0L 5 banger..

i would pursue that route anyways, if i were going to build an engine as custom as what you are talking, then retro-fitting an inline injection pump should be no big deal..

only thing you gotta worry about, is that the pump is set up to turn CCW.. the engine turns CW, but the pump is driven from the back of the cam, so its gotta be a CCW rotation pump.. if you even decide to use something OTHER than the VE pump on it now..

My 2.5 doesn't rev any less than a 1.6, stock for stock, probably better thanks to better manifolds.  Might even be a good donor pump for a 2 liter?
I bet this is north of 300HP http://www.garaget.org/?car=165910&image=1572145 If you look close you can see the 2nd pump to keep up with the 2nd turbo.
If I'm reading right, this one, or one like it  is over 350HP in 'safe' tune.

[RabbitJockey]

Where is his dynosheet?

http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=28825.45


Also I have seen a dyno sheet of a Mercedes diesel making over 500hp and revving to 7k peak power was still between 5-7k tho just like our engines

[Alcaid]

Where is his dynosheet?

http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=28825.45


Also I have seen a dyno sheet of a Mercedes diesel making over 500hp and revving to 7k peak power was still between 5-7k tho just like our engines

Those MB engines can't be compared at all with their totally different prechamber design, 4 valves per piston, inline pumps that handles crazy rpms and high fuel quantities, robustness+++

OM606 mid-engine Rabbit would be SICK!

[TurboJ]

OM606 has been built to over 600 hp many times.

OM603 has been built very close to 600 hp many times.

Both are IDI engines...

As for the VAG 4-cyl IDI, this is at least documented:



...in case you're wondering, that's 268.7 hp and 298 lb-ft.

It's a 1.6 diesel mk2 Golf with a 1.9 head and lots of other modifications. I know that dyno machine/software and it's not optimistic.

[RabbitJockey]

It's odd none of the 1.6 engines seem to make much power until about 3500 and then it's an abrupt spike and a small plateau of power, is it just hOw the engine behaves or is slow spool the factor