Head stud part #?

[maxfax]

Sorry to hear about the block cracking...some say that the older CR and CK blocks are prone to that happening.

They're not prone to cracking... They are destined to crack.... :cry:

[autoholic]

Interesting, I'll have to look at the code on my "new" block.
I can see why they can crack, not alot of material around that bolt hole.

I'll have to wait a bit to put this motor back together, I have tons of other stuff i need to get done before winter. It'll be a good winter project.

[autoholic]

Wow, destined to crack?  I hope the studs will help alleviate this problem, I'll check out my code when I get home tonight, never paid any attention to it.

[jtanguay]

sounds like tapping the block for 12mm and drilling out the head would be an easier option at this point... 11mm seems to be such a PITA!

[autoholic]

yea, but wouldn't that just make it weaker since you would have to remove precious material from around that bolt hole to go to the larger 12MM?

Apparently this cracking has happened to others, this is the first I have seen it. Hopefully making sure the holes are clean and going with studs will prevent it from re-occurring on the next block (even if I do have one of the older codes, which with my luck I will). I am all out of blocks now, all my remaining VW stuff is junk.

[maxfax]

The main reason the 11mm blocks crack is the bolts only thread in there about a half inch at most (slightly less if I remeber right)..   The studs thread in there an inch plus.. Alot more material holding with the studs versus the bolts...  I've heard of people drilling the 11mm block to 12mm but I tend to agree, that would leave even less material around the holes..   The studs seem to be the fix...  

I've even used studs on blocks with small cracks around the holes with good results... Just put some thread sealer on them..  Not that I would recomend or even admit to doing such a thing... :oops:

[Mark(The Miser)UK]

The main reason the 11mm blocks crack is the bolts only thread in there about a half inch at most (slightly less if I remeber right)..   The studs thread in there an inch plus.. Alot more material holding with the studs versus the bolts...  I've heard of people drilling the 11mm block to 12mm but I tend to agree, that would leave even less material around the holes..   The studs seem to be the fix...  

I've even used studs on blocks with small cracks around the holes with good results... Just put some thread sealer on them..  Not that I would recomend or even admit to doing such a thing... :oops:

Interestingly with a recent gasket job on a late CY 12mm mechanical block, and  bolts I noted the following:

Block holes are between 13.5 and 14 TURNS deep.[so I don't see how studs go in much deeper] :?  
Bolts start to truely clamp gasket at about 10 TURNS. all done at about 11 TURNS. {I don't believe it I wrote it down somewhere and I've lost  it; temporarily I hope :roll: }.
 Also noted at the same time that hydro-locking almost impossible unless threads dirty with solids, as air/liquid can be heard oozing out as bolts turned  by hand when trying them out before cleaning out all the oil
Andrew's Cam bolt thread tapping post on another site reinforces this IMO.

Don't studs have a finer thread and so need say 2/3 or is it less torque to clamp to the same degree.
 Studying a few heads, has lead me to believe that oveclamping merely burys gasket into head which 'ucks it up for a later gasket, and accelerates the need for a skim. :idea:

With stretch bolts, a 45 deg turn in place of 90 deg is also fine, as long as you have reached plastic state of bolt as measured by a torque wrench :idea:

[maxfax]

On the 11mm block there isn;t alot of meat around the holes, thats why the studs threading in further make all the difference..  10 threads may be pusing it with the stock bolts, and the 11mm bolts are not stretch bolts..  
  With the studs you are still clamping the head down with the same amount of force, teh difference is that it actually stays clamped down with the same amound of force versus the block cracking and the head lifting with the original bolts...

[AdAm84]

With all of this being said, Anyone got a torque for the studs?

[maxfax]

I've used the ARP spec of 80 lbs/ft with their molly grease, or 85 lbs/ft with 30wt oil...  Definitely a bit more than the 66 lbs/ft that VW called for but then again let's look at the problems they had..   And I would imagine a half turn from 44 lbs/ft (later 12mm stretch bolt specs) Probably equals a tad more than 66 lbs/ft

I figure if ARP intends that for a gas engine with 9:1 compression it can;t hurt on a diesel with 23:1 compression...   And so far so good haven't had to redo a headgaset since...  Haven;t had one back apart to see if the rings in the head gasket gouged into the head significanly.. And that's a good thing  

[autoholic]

I have not even read the literature yet on my ARP's. Wow 85lb? sounds like alot, especially since they are fine thread! I think i would be kind of scared to go that tight. No, I know I would be scared to go that tight, I will not go that tight.

[autoholic]

What code should I be looking for, I see a wierd marking with an "EB", it's kind of distorted and has a circle around it? what is the difference in all these blocks. Oops, I forgot to check the FAQ's, I bet the answer is there!

Also, since these diesel block are somewhat scarce, I wonder how the gas blocks are different? I see that the diesels are clearly marked 1.6D, but I do not know what is different?

[Mark(The Miser)UK]

According to my recent tests the initial 12mm stretch point was between 105 and 115 lbft. The torque wrench was a 1980's Snapon wrench which looks very much like the one used by Bosch in their service manuals.
[Previously, I had 'warmed' engine up for 150 miles before first retorque and found that bolts were down to 50 lb ft ish ].

Final angle torquing of the bolts seemed to level off just under 100lb ft ish.

 I suppose the gasket deforms more to start with and releases pressure.  I've done about 300 miles so far with no water loss/issue.

Edit: make it 3000miles :roll:

[maxfax]

Final angle torquing of the bolts seemed to level off just under 100lb ft ish.

Wow, no wonder there were problems with head gaskets on these older ones...   66 lbs/ft versus 100 lbs/ft is quite a difference...  I wonder if the lower torque spec for the older ones was because they knew the blocks wouldn;t handle any more than that...

[autoholic]

That would suck... getting it all done and pullijng the threads out - or cracking the block! i would be in tears this time!